The EU Migrant Crisis

mid_gen · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:14

subbytna said:
As an island nation we have a finite amount of space and facilities.

and non-island nations have an infinite amount? A little confused on the logic of this statement.

Ricochet J · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:23

Moley said:
Yes, but once it was all over and peace was restored I would want to return home - as most of us would. Migrants from Africa and the Middle East usually settle and never return home.

Why would you return to a war torn country when you have settled in the host country?

CREATIVE!11 · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:26

Conscript said:
Surely it's not surprising that if they are seeking to build a new life for themselves, they would try and do so in the more prosperous economies, or those with the most employment opportunities on offer?

Implying that they can't be genuine refugees because they haven't set up shop in the first non-war torn country they venture through, and that their attempts to reach Germany, the UK, etc are therefore nothing more than an attempt to exploit the benefits systems of such countries is a vast oversimplification. And one that adds nothing but the usual tabloid hysterics to the debate.

It leads to the sort of tripe that the gutter press rolls out on a weekly basis about how all migrants are little more than a swarm of parasites intent of draining our resources dry, and the usual drivel by barbaric dunderheads who seriously think the answer to the problem is mass murder.

They are just human beings who on the whole are just trying to seek a better life and their plight deserves rational consideration, rather than being a debate hijacked by such hysterics.

Yeah I can understand people wanting a better life of course, but I'm also aware unfortunately money doesn't grow on trees. Sure I wish it did, sure I wish the world could be rainbow and unicorns and everyone gets a great life.

I tend to just slap bang in the middle divorced from emotions towards a situation. I get it. I really do.

But for example if the UK let the entire population of Somalia in what do you think would happen? I mean obviously hypothetical situation but what would happen? I know it's all nice and warm and fuzzy to help your fellow man but the world is just cruel and unfair. Some of us luck out, and some of us luck out even more in the west being born into a rich family. (Some days daydreaming I actually do wish this... I think oh wow how great world could be if x and y were true). Pretty much given my age and the times we live in have resigned myself to never being able to own my own home no matter what I do (unless again I luck out) is it fair I didn't get to buy a house in the 70's before the ridiculous boom? *shrug* life.

Also a country can only do so much to prop up everyone else. It can only go so far, look at the amount of charity thrown into Africa, nothing is any different decades later.

Just the reality of life. Maybe I have this view because I was actually born into relative poverty and I was surrounded by gross poverty (South Africa).

robfosters · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:30

I agree the migrants who are granted asylum should be spread around to share the burden, but once they have been allocated a country, I don't think they should be granted freedom of movement like an ordinary EU citizen, as most of them will just head straight for either Germany or the UK.

chief barker · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:34

robfosters said:
I agree the migrants who are granted asylum should be spread around to share the burden, but once they have been allocated a country, I don't think they should be granted freedom of movement like an ordinary EU citizen, as most of them will just head straight for either Germany or the UK.

Just not in Welling, right?

Danthus · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:38

If they come here where would they be housed?

chief barker · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:41

OldCoals said:
If they come here where would they be housed?

They should be put in the houses of all the ones with a bleeding heart.

robfosters · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:41

chief barker said:
Just not in Welling, right?

I would have a few here. Rather not next door though. We've already had poles move in a few doors down and they have been a nightmare.

No, they should be dispersed around their allocated country as well. When you start getting concentrations of people it severely limits integration.

scorza · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:42

I think one thing is for certain, Schengen has been a disaster for those countries that signed up for it. We need to leave the EU - fast, before it implodes.

Moley · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:43

Ricochet J said:
Why would you return to a war torn country when you have settled in the host country?

What part of 'once it was all over and peace was restored' didn't you read?

Hint: the bit in bold.

robfosters · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:43

scorza said:
I think one thing is for certain, Schengen has been a disaster for those countries that signed up for it. We need to leave the EU - fast, before it implodes.

Merkel said yesterday that Schengen is now in serious danger, or words to that effect.

Basher · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:47

Moley said:
What part of 'once it was all over and peace was restored' didn't you read?

Hint: the bit in bold.

Perhaps you should read a little closer? He said war-torn, not at war ...

Deleted member 66701 · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:50

OldCoals said:
How do we distinguish between economic migrants refugees?

What's wrong with economic migrants?

People move from the north of England to London all the time to get better jobs and earn more money.

robfosters · 1 Sep 2015 at 14:52

amigafan2003 said:
What's wrong with economic migrants?

People move from the north of England to London all the time to get better jobs and earn more money.

They leave a job behind them which can then be filled by someone else though.

Moley · 1 Sep 2015 at 15:11

Basher said:
Perhaps you should read a little closer? He said war-torn, not at war ...

The definition of war-torn doesn't automatically mean the war is over you know? It just means damaged by war. Syria is war-torn, Ukraine is war-torn (and still perfectly safe in the west of the country) Sudan is war-torn, etc. etc. etc.

Danthus · 1 Sep 2015 at 15:23

amigafan2003 said:
What's wrong with economic migrants?

People move from the north of England to London all the time to get better jobs and earn more money.

Given you are both a Labour and a union man, I find that question rather strange.

Schlong&Stable · 1 Sep 2015 at 15:24

amigafan2003 said:
What's wrong with economic migrants?

People move from the north of England to London all the time to get better jobs and earn more money.

Are you under the impression that northern England is a foreign country? :confused:

arknor · 1 Sep 2015 at 15:29

Siliconslave said:
in my mind one of the big problems is the use of the word migrant - we are getting it drilled into us by politicians and the media that these people are migrating out of choice, looking for the good life on the scrounge in the uk.

We are somewhat ignoring the fact that a lot of these are people are honestly fleeing for their lives as refugees of war.

RE staying in france - the UN Refugee Agency has france putting up over twice the number of refugees than the uk -252k vs 117k (http://www.unhcr.org/pages/49e45bb01.html)

if they can afford to pay traffickers thousands of pounds they aren't that needy

gettothechopper · 1 Sep 2015 at 15:36

arknor said:
if they can afford to pay traffickers thousands of pounds they aren't that needy

which kind of proves that maybe its the getting killed / opressed factors that are causing their movement rather than handouts and benefits?

Danthus · 1 Sep 2015 at 15:49

gettothechopper said:
which kind of proves that maybe its the getting killed / opressed factors that are causing their movement rather than handouts and benefits?

So why not stop in the first safe country then?

The EU Migrant Crisis

Deleted member 66701

Deleted member 66701