Caporegime
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I do believe it is a natural thing to have a good footballing brain. Players have the talent but not all have the brain.
The Manchester United Club Thread **Sponsored by Comedy Central**
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I do believe it is a natural thing to have a good footballing brain. Players have the talent but not all have the brain.
Its been said quite widely that they can tell from anyone's DNA that they are more adapt at Power vs Endurance (and athletic performance in general).
And its been common for decades for families to go into the same business for generation after generation, and yes of course a lot of this can be down to "learnt" skill rather than "inherited" but the inherent skill/ understanding has to be there first as well.
Im not for one second saying its a definite that it comes from the womb - Im just not prepared to say its not possible at all , biological / dna science and understanding may not be at that level to know one way or another.
And its been common for decades for families to go into the same business for generation after generation, and yes of course a lot of this can be down to "learnt" skill rather than "inherited" but the inherent skill/ understanding has to be there first as well.
Im not for one second saying its a definite that it comes from the womb - Im just not prepared to say its not possible at all , biological / dna science and understanding may not be at that level to know one way or another.
I don't understand why he put Da Gea in goal in a game that had penalties written all over it. We overachieved in the league mainly based due to disastrous spells for other teams. Ole needs to be replaced. ZZ is a pipe dream but he's a free man again.
Sadly, the board don't agree
https://metro.co.uk/2021/05/27/ole-...utd-board-promise-four-new-signings-14662796/
I just don't see the logic, his contract runs to the end of next season and it's not like he'll be in demand!
I know there's the argument about players wanting to know who they're playing for, but i don't see Solskjaer having that appeal anyway.
I'm not sure who in the premier league would hire him.
Its complete rubbish. Players don't care if the manager is out of contract at the end of the next season. No one will have come to United for Ole and whoever replaces him (and they will at the end of next season regardless of signings) will be a better more high profile manager.
One of the lower teams in the league might take a punt on him but I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't get many offers. He certainly won't be looking at any of the top teams in any of the top leagues.
Personally I think Ole has made very good progress despite the defeat in the final.
Im all for him being given another year or two in the job (depending on how 21/22 goes) but he has to be backed definitively , unlike last summer.
If Martial and Greenwood hadnt had such disasters of seasons (well, in Greenwood's case until the last four - six weeks or so) , we could have seriously challenged for the title. Just to be clear, Im not blaming Greenwood at all, 2nd season syndrome especially at his age was always going to happen, but up until March time he was really finding it a real struggle.
It was also always going to be difficult having a significantly short summer compared to most other EPL teams, and using the first 4- 5 games of the season as pre-season. We also dont have the depth of squad similar to Chelsea, City and a few others.
You also have to look at just how many draws we got this season, nearly 33% of league games - just one additional goal in a relatively small proportion of those games and City would have felt real pressure .....it may not have made any difference in the end but just being that close would be good to see.
He is learning on the job, in two of the toughest seasons ever in recent history (due to Covid) - remember Chelsea spent £200m last summer or there abouts, we have had significant injuries or players really out of (or declining ) form and a defence that has really struggled majorly - and a board that re-signs Bailly , another injury prone centre half just like Jones.
Im all for him being given another year or two in the job (depending on how 21/22 goes) but he has to be backed definitively , unlike last summer.
If Martial and Greenwood hadnt had such disasters of seasons (well, in Greenwood's case until the last four - six weeks or so) , we could have seriously challenged for the title. Just to be clear, Im not blaming Greenwood at all, 2nd season syndrome especially at his age was always going to happen, but up until March time he was really finding it a real struggle.
It was also always going to be difficult having a significantly short summer compared to most other EPL teams, and using the first 4- 5 games of the season as pre-season. We also dont have the depth of squad similar to Chelsea, City and a few others.
You also have to look at just how many draws we got this season, nearly 33% of league games - just one additional goal in a relatively small proportion of those games and City would have felt real pressure .....it may not have made any difference in the end but just being that close would be good to see.
He is learning on the job, in two of the toughest seasons ever in recent history (due to Covid) - remember Chelsea spent £200m last summer or there abouts, we have had significant injuries or players really out of (or declining ) form and a defence that has really struggled majorly - and a board that re-signs Bailly , another injury prone centre half just like Jones.
I think you've forgotten what it's like to challenge for title, either that or the last few you've won have come so easy with late winners, late runs and other teams struggling.
City if pushed probably had another 10 or points or so in them. As proven by the last couple of seasons. How many points did they lose in the last 10 games? They lost 3 out of the last 4. You think they're doing that if someone is chasing them?
We lost two or three as well - with a Sancho or a decent centre half (given that Maguire was injured) , there wasnt THAT much between the teams even when City went on that incredible run (which would be difficult to repeat)
Utd's other "advantage" is that with a better summer - and it wouldnt have taken that much, lets be honest - 12 months ago, we would have been able to rotate better and potentially win more while resting players , its hard to see how City rotate more while gaining points
Caporegime
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We dropped points to Sheffield United (3), Last kick of the game equalizer against Everton (2), Draw against Westbrom (2), Draw against Leicester (2). That's 9 points off the bat that we threw away. I also think the losses against Leicester and Liverpool at the end of the season would have had different outcomes if they were not dead rubbers.
It is a big if but if Ole can sort out that low block that is impossible for us to sort atm then we may have an even better season next time around.
Would you care for a bet before the start of the new season on where we will finish and how we will do in the CL? We have very different views on United under Ole so I think it would be interesting. We could even ask Baz to put a pole up in this thread perhaps.
Caporegime
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I back my manager till the end. Like I said the next season is massive for him and he needs to be challenging no doubt but if he doesn't get backed in the summer then I will not begrudge him doing badly. He got nothing last summer but took the squad forward. He needs those 3 players without fail this summer as City will spend 500 million easy
.Guardiola didn't win the champions League with the squad he has yet no one is asking for him to get the axe?
Chelsea have a good team but they are not on the level of City who should have won the champions League easily.
Caporegime
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It is called being realistic. We have tried two serial winners in Jose and LVG and both failed. I don't really see any decent managers available apart from Conte who basically another Jose.
Liverpool won the lottery by getting Klopp but it is yet to be seen if he can continue into next season as he should have a fit squad.
Reality is with our current owners you are not keeping up with City and Chelsea. Barcelona and Real have tried and are now Bankrupt.
Also what constitutes as doing okay. We have back to back champions League qualification for the first time since Fergie. Unbeaten away in the league all season and got to the final of a major European trophy. I would call that decent progress since he has taken over.
Whether he can take that next step next season is the million dollar question but none of us will know that until next season is finished.
Did he though. He has spent over £250m on players so far and his best season (this season) he lost a EL final to a team assembled for probably 1/10th of ours and got 74 points. In comparison, Mourinho took a weaker squad to the EL final and won it and came second with 81 points.
If Ole's 74 points was transposed to that season with Mourinho we would have come 4th.
He needs those 3 players without fail this summer as City will spend 500 million easy
City will almost certainly spend quite a lot this summer but their current squad and ceiling leaves far less room for improvement. None of the United fans think that we will be going toe to toe with City on spending or squad depth etc but we would like a manager who seems to be improving the team without simply buying better players. Who this season has been a revelation? Who was the last player your thought "man, Ole has got him playing out of his skin and I didn't think he was that good". When was the last time you watched United and thought "wow, we are ripping them to pieces with our play" when it wasn't simply a team that committed suicide by running a high line and leaving us acres of space behind them.
City and Liverpool (and Probably Chelsea next season) are in a completely different league to us and its not their players.
Based on xG this season we should be finishing 4th. We have been lucky whether people like to admit it or not.
Guardiola made a mess of the final there is no doubt. Would City have won it if he didn't? Maybe but a lot of us on here backed Chelsea because they are the antithesis of City. They play defensive, well organised and cagey football and look to hit you on the break and they have the players and discipline to pull it off. Finals are always a bit of a crap shoot.
Villareal are a well organised but massively limited team and we looked completely clueless and crap. The difference between the two finals was astounding. City were probing, pulling Chelsea around and working for space and opportunity. Chelsea worked their arses off and Kante was god like and key to their resilience. United on the other hand barely bothered Villareal in 120 minutes of football. City would have torn them to pieces because Guardiola has coached the team to move the ball, make space, open teams up, work small areas of the pitch to create overloads.
You only have to look at the odds before the two games to see how heavy favourites United were vs City.
I simply don't understand how any United fan can think we are ever going to win anything of note with Ole when we are competing against teams with more resources and better managers. A world class manager can bridge that gap to compete (see Klopp) but to be outspent, out managed, out coached is just going to lead to one outcome.
I pretty much agree with what fez has said above.
However, the point I have made is right there in your very post:
You've described Jose as having 'failed', but he won the Europa League comfortably, and in the same post you've praised Ole for getting to the very same final and losing it horrendously.
If you have a bunch of talented, very fast players, playing against a high line, you'll always do well. You don't need a manager for that, that's how basic it is.
I'd also like to add that Bruno has been far more important than Ole, he's carried the club single handedly since coming in. Ole would have been gone ages ago without him.
Caporegime
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City got 14pts less, they should sack that Pep guy. Or maybe points totals can't be compared like that across seasons? Here is an interesting alternative. City got 86% of what they managed that season. 86% of what Jose got is 70pts, so less than Ole managed this season.
I think it's funny that people claim Bruno has carried us, I don't remember anyone complaining that Lewandowski carries Bayern. The really funny thing is De Gea had a far greater impact on that Jose season and people conveniently forget it when talking about it.
We've made progress under Ole, it's undeniable but there needs to be more. This season was a ****fest and nobody was ever going to be able to compete with City on squad depth in a year where you're playing every 3 days. To achieve second with a squad that had zero first team 11 signings is an impressive achievement, despite some acting like we're hovering around midtable.
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Hasn't made any progress, just looks like it because everyone else went backwards.
People seem to forget that. Spurs, Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal etc have all had horrendous seasons compared to what they usually achieve.Hasn't made any progress, just looks like it because everyone else went backwards.