!!!! The OCUK Martial Arts Thread !!!!

[Richdog]

Just seen a couple of people say they do MA in a few threads so thought i'd make this one.

I've done about 8 months of Wing Chun and Chen style Tai-Chi before moving on to Jeet Kune Do (concepts) for the last 6 months which is a mix of Boxing, Muay Thai, grappling and Kali (Filipino stickfighting).

I found Wing Chun a lot of fun and the principles were sound, I just didn't like the length of time it takes to get to the point where you can use it effectively, and even then I had my doubts about it as a complete and effective MA. Tai-Chi takes 10 years to get to the point where you can really use it effectively, but the health benefits are immediate, I just couldn't afford to keep it up. Long-term I know it's one of the most effective MA's out there though many people are under the illusion it's not a fighting art and just 'exercise'. You just need to find a good teacher who teaches it as a MA..

With JKD I find that it covers almost every aspect of what I want to learn as well as being immediately appliable, and I have a great teacher who is heavily into the psychology aspect of fighting too, he's no thug, in fact to look at him you'd not think him 'hard' (same as with most dangerous people). Kali is amazing too, useful learning how to wield some weapons should the need (god forbid) ever arise.

I enjoy it immensely, and my self-confidence has been given a nice boost from learning how to handle myself better, and through that i've also found that the average knobbos on a night out tend not to give me any grief because I carry myself better, I just look more confident. I highly reccommend taking up an MA to anyone looking for short and long-term health benefits.

The reason i'm doing it is not to 'get hard' as I hate fighting (for real), I just decided last year that it was my duty to learn how to protect my future family should the need ever arise in an increasingly dangerous world. If me, my future missus and child are ever in danger I don't want to be one of the guys who stands there helpless while me or my loved ones are attacked.

There's so many MA's I want to try too (mainly internal arts like Xing-Yi and Baji), there's just not enough time or money to spare.

What martial arts do you do and why do you do them? Discuss them here, and no crapping the thread please with what you deem humorous jokes about made-up martial arts or Bruce lee etc etc, lets keep the discussion friendly and intelligent.

EDIT - Apologies, didn't know there was a sports section, doh.

 

[Richdog]

Yeah, to be honest I personally don't really rate TKD or Karate as self-defence systems, but for flexibility and fitness they are good. It's just in a fight high kicks aren't the wisest idea or very practical unless you want a pounding (most of TKD's arsenal) and i'm not keen on Karate because it's so linear and blocking is done by meeting force with force, highly impractical compared to the Kung Fu styles of blocking which concentrate on deflecting energy. Makes you much more prone to injuring yourself.

Does your Kung Fu club spar or is it non-contact?

 

[Richdog]

Kung Fu teaches you techniques for real fighting.

Heh some would say that is also very debateable, seeing as in previous fights Kung Fu has consistently been owned in K-1/Pride fights by Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and Muay Thai especially, and usually in a very short amount of time. And the old "but many moves are too deadly to use in a ring fight" doesn't wash either, it is just generally not taught to a competition standard as far as heavy training and learning how to take serious punishment goes. The average Kung Fu fighter just isn't conditioned in the way that ring fighters are, and that's why they lose. I hear that things are changing though, and some Kung Fu teachers are now training students to the high ring standard specifically to go back and compete against Muay Thai and grapplers.

However, I agree that if taught well it can be a very effective method of self-defence, it just takes longer to get there. The worst thing about Wing Chun is that ground-fighting is generally not taught and it's not very open to new principles, it's quite rigid in the way it's taught.

Notable though are guys like Dan Docherty, Wu style Tai-Chi guy who won the full-contact Kung Fu Kung Fu championships a few years in a row in the 80's, and also a guy called James Sinclair, head of the UK Wing Chun Association who used to regularly hold private underground fights against other styles.

In my opinion though an MA isn't taught effectively as a self-defence unless you throw in copious amounts of contact sparring, many MA's that don't give you false confidence in your abilities, and when it comes to the crunch they generally get thei bum handed to them on a plate.

EDIT - Fishfluff, i'd also love to do Sport Jiu-Jitsu or Judo, they are damn great grappling arts that emphasise "getting in there" so to speak. There's none local to me though.

 

[Richdog]

I love fighting, have not done any training of any kind for nearly a year as my foot although fine to play football with, wont take the twisting and jumping of martial arts training.

What MA did you do? lol.

 

[Richdog]

Nah Wing Chun has very few kicks, and they are all waist height and below. JKD uses Muay Thai kicks, so no fancy spinny jumpy ones there.

 

[Richdog]

Problem with WC punches (vertical) is that while they're fast, they're not the most powerful unless you're an advanced practitioner with forearms of steel. Very weak compared to a boxing punch, though better for your hand.

In any case, my primary strike for people who scare me in the usual situation (drunk nutter outside nightclub) would be my elbow/forearm. Providing I hit I can cram so much power into it that it's either a knockout or severe facial damage. I'd do a wallop with that then run like the wind.

 

[Richdog]

Thats not realy true. Yes they are weaker than a big wind up hook or even a straight but you realy dont have to be an advanced practitioner to learn the techniques that can make them very powerful indeed.
I am only at yellow sash level right now and i'm pretty confident in my punching power.

Wall bags help condition the fists, and doing the punching sets helps improve power and speed a lot, but the boxing punch is more effective in an average situation I feel, having tried both. Just my opinion.

The other thing I didn't like about WC was the footwork... I much prefer boxing footwork, more mobile and easier to generate punching power.

 

[Richdog]

Wow one word post... how umm... involved lol. Getting charged per letter or something?

Nana is your school headed by Samuel then?

 

[Richdog]

Are you in Cardiff?

 

[Richdog]

Hmm it all seems to be japanese MA in your area, karate etc. Seen this one which looks better then the usual karate mush, mey be worth checking out http://www.goshinkwai.co.uk/

That kickboxing may be worth a look too though, seems there's not much in your area. How far are you willing to travel, where would be the furthest? How far from cardiff?

 

[Richdog]

Not knowing the geography of wales I was sort of hoping for a name of the furthest place you'd be willing to travel.

 

[Richdog]

That Jiu-Jitsu club looks alright, from what I can tell they compete in contact Judo competitions too, so you'll be learning some practical stuff.

Only remotely decent looking Kung Fu school I could find was also at the uni http://www.stusoc.cf.ac.uk/suon/au/kungfu/

Couldn't find any other decent place at all... there are two great MMA clubs in Cardiff, but i'm guessing that's a tad hardcore for you, lol. Would be for most people.

Stick with Jiu Jitsu/Judo, they are great beginners arts.

 

[Richdog]

no probs with it being hardcore aslong as they dont mind a learner!
i did judo to green belt (Star club in withywood Bristol) till i was 14, got bored at not being able to advance until 16!
did a few other bits and bobs before i was working the doors for 3 years so used to a bit of rough n tumble

any websites for these cardiff mma places?

http://cardiffmma.com/

There you go tiger...

 

[Richdog]

Wow Pak Mei "white eyebrow" is a VERY powerful art... far more powerful than most IMO, especially Wing Chun.

You are VERY lucky to have a Sifu that teaches it... never mind on that's being doing it for 40 years!

It is one of the most difficult styles to master, yet has a variety of ground techniques, weapon systems and Chi Kung!

You lucky git! Where are you based?

 

[Richdog]

I can't see me ever going to Manchester unless upon pain of death but I sure wish I had someone near who taught that.

While Muay Thai and Boxing are effective in the short-term during your youth, the older you get the weaker your offensive and defensive powers get.

With most Kung Fu internal styles such a Wing Chun Pak mei, and especially Tai-Chi... the older you get the more ownage you can dish out if necessary.

 

[Richdog]

I'm thinking about starting Aikido as there is a Dojo just opposite my work place. Anyone know much about this MA?

Very placid MA, not nearly as effective as Tai-Chi, barely any attacking moves and takes just as long to get to a point where you can use it in real-life.

Though people would no doubt disagree with me, I don't reccommended to anyone wanting to learn in a practical fashion how to fight or defend themselves.

 

[Richdog]

I know a few Aikido stylists and even they cross-train with harder arts in order to gain some decent fighting ability.

I agree with you about Aikido being great for learning about posture, balance, and directing energy but as I said, Tai-Chi does the same and is far more effective as a fighting martial art. Perosnally, given the choice out of spending 10 years learning either of them Tai-Chi would win the toss each time. It's health benefits are greater through extensive use of Qi-Gong, and it's principler imo sounder in nature. It combines devestating palm and fist strikes, kicks, jointlocks/breaks and throws with a grace, fluidity and seeming effortlessness that most other arts can only dream of. Plus a good teacher will have you sparring contact as well as learning push hands. Did I mention a great weapons set consisting of sword, saber and pole? There's a reason it's name means "grand ultimate fist" or "grand ultimate boxing" depending on which way you look at it. In olden china it was regarded as the deadliest fighting art one could master.

I think Aikido is a great way of learning self-discipline and posture etc, but as a fighting art I seriously doubt it's effectiveness. The way you are taught i.e: "co-operating" with a partner to learn throws etc I see as ineffective in comparison to judo/Jiu-jitsu where you get down and dirty to learn the techniques. Aikido is 99% defensive, and without a decent range of attacks I do not consider a fighting art a fighting art. It is known as the "non-violent martial art", something that has never really sat right with me.

But that is just a personal opinion, I do not speak for anyone else, and i'm sure MANY people would love aikido and get a lot out of studying it.

 

[Richdog]

Judo is a GREAT MA to get a foundation in. One year of it can give you a good basis in groundfighting for life, and is a perfect art for taking to another MA with weak groundfighting skills such as Wing Chun.

Hell you have so many good arts there... lucky git.

Wing Chun and Tai-Chi are great complimentary arts as they both emphasise sensitivity and finesse but require a LOT of patience.

 

[Richdog]

Hmmm I never really thought Judo was that good for developing groundfighting skills to be honest. No choking, no locks, no pressure points, about the only thing you have is pinning. JuJitsu is much better for groundfighting in my opinion.

No choking? No locks? Only thing you have is pinning?

That's very misinformed. I think you'll find it has a ton mate:

*Chokes (shimewaza) http://judoinfo.com/chokes.htm

*Locks and everything else http://judoinfo.com/gokyo2.htm

*Dislocations/breaks http://judoinfo.com/kubiwaza.htm

*Illustrated pictures of all http://judoinfo.com/techdrw.htm

Top judoka regularly beat top BJJ fighters in the ring, it is a highly respected yet oft-underrated art.

 

[Richdog]

Not misinformed at all as that's exactly how Judo was when I was doing it and actively competing in competitions. In fact, looking at the British Judo Association website that's still how contests are. The only ground fighting involved is attempting to pin your opponent to the mat for 25 seconds.

Your Judo was lilkely a very watered down competition version then as opposed to true Judo.

It's a bit like like saying "Kung Fu is all high kicks because that's what my
class did once" lol.

Judo is taught differently just as any other MA, to stereotype it because of the way you learnt it (very watered down by all appearences) is a bit narrow-minded. True Judo is as varied as any groundfighting art, I have been to seminars that have shown it and I know people that do it. Seen it with my own eyes. I hardly think Judo would be able to compete against such a feared art as Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu if it was as you say, do you?