** The Official Space Flight Thread - The Space Station and Beyond **

Werewolf said:
I seem to remember reading something from one of the top guys at NASA about what I think he called "Range safety waivers" for launches.
Basically how close to the launch you can be safely for various things and how you basically have to issue the safety waivers to do anything, IIRC you need them to even do routine stuff near the rockets once they've been fuelled let alone say walk with the astronauts to it, even the NASA public observation stands are technically far too close for some scenarios, but to fully comply with the safety requirements you'd pretty much have to evacuate half of Texas for most launches from Houston.

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I'm trying to remember where it was as it was interesting and I thought i'd bookmarked it (the guy wrote a bunch of explanations for various NASA related subjects on what I think was his personal blog after he retired).
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I think I've found it, Wayne Hale's blog, he was a flight director at NASA and his blog covers things like some of the issues that they had with the shuttles including what turned out to be a really simple fix for a potentially catastrophic issue with the huge nuts that held the whole stack in place prior to launch.

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One of his entries explains part of the reason the shuttle program cost so much per flight.
Basically any costs associated with the facilities the shuttles (and other craft) used would be billed to those programmes, so if there were only shuttles using a facility that year the shuttle program would be billed the full cost of it "Does the VAB need a new coat of paint? The Shuttle program gets to pay for that. Does the MCC need a new roof? The Shuttle program gets to pay for that. Does the A-2 Test Stand need a new flame bucket? The Shuttle program gets to pay for that".


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I found the bit about range safety, it's under the "Calculating the risks" entry.
 
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I’m not very familiar with this rocket but if the separation stage had been successful, would the bottom bit have returned and landed itself like I’ve seen on another rocket (twin boosters landing on a ship at sea).
 
ic1male said:
I’m not very familiar with this rocket but if the separation stage had been successful, would the bottom bit have returned and landed itself like I’ve seen on another rocket (twin boosters landing on a ship at sea).
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Eventually yes, they are aiming to save and re-use both sections, but at this stage of development I believe they are not trying with the first 3 or 4 rockets.
 
ic1male said:
I’m not very familiar with this rocket but if the separation stage had been successful, would the bottom bit have returned and landed itself like I’ve seen on another rocket (twin boosters landing on a ship at sea).
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Yes basically, although for this test launch they were "landing" in the sea rather than risk serious damage on land in case of a failure. Obviously this didn't go to plan and ended with a major RUD.
 
The more I rewatch that the more it looks like it was firing at the pad for far far longer than it should have been before release. Which will obviously massively increase the damage to the concrete
 
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Grim5 said:
Some of the concrete hit the nearby tanks lmao - look at those dents!

Elon was worried about the rocket exploding on the pad destroying the launch area and yet a successful launch had done a substantial amount of damage to the entire area

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To be fair those are only covers over the tanks, those eight tanks are tanks within a tank. so as long as the inner tank is ok they could replace the outer protective shell. Though the one closest looks to have taken a fair whack, and there is no indication as to how intact the inners are.

I managed to catch it live in the end. Impressive! would have liked to have seen at least the separation happen. However, all in all a very impressive launch.

I look forward to seeing more detailed coverage of the aftermath of this on the launch facility. I know current plans for a deluge system for future launches. However, I do wonder if that will be sufficient. Maybe it will be enough for Boca Chica. However I suspect that The Cape launch site that they eventually plan to launch from will likely receive a lot more substantial launch platform.
We have to remember this is still early iterative testing.

Cant wait for the next test. though with that level of damage to the pad/launch platform, and the installation of the coming deluge system I feel we will be pushing late summer before we see any more full stack starship launch shenanigans.
 
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catch-22 if it had moved away faster concrete wouldn't have been soaked - have they related if they increased power on remaining engines, or directed them laterally to compensate.
 
Those guys know the risk they take putting gear so close to the launch site, and they only get that close because Space X gave them permission otherwise the public can't be there for FAA safety reasons. I doubt insurance will pay and it's not the first time gear has been damaged

That being said if Space X feels really nice, they could cover the cost privately - they have done so previously for damage employee vehicles that have been parked too close to launches
 
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Grim5 said:
Those guys know the risk they take putting gear so close to the launch site, and they only get that close because Space X gave them permission otherwise the public can't be there for safety reasons. I doubt insurance will pay and it's not the first time gear has been damaged
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No, really? Well I never. :rolleyes:
 
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jpaul said:
catch-22 if it had moved away faster concrete wouldn't have been soaked - have they related if they increased power on remaining engines, or directed them laterally to compensate.
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I agree compared to the static fires which reached 60% and the Starship sub-orbitals where the Raptors reached 100% initially, one assumes, that release was really slow. The additional time firing on the pad will have hammered the concrete much harder than planned.

I think they have a post launch environmental audit to do as part of their licence. So that will provide plenty of time for repairs and the addition of the new deluge system.
 
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