That and actually having to have to get out of bed and go to work instead of staying at home on benefits smoking and shagging all day.
Generally the people of that ilk do that no matter who’s in government
Tories lost the 2019 election among working age adults
- Thread starter cheesyboy
- Start date
Generally the people of that ilk do that no matter who’s in government
It's worth remembering that a fertility rate of 1.5 is A Bad Thing.That and actually having to have to get out of bed and go to work instead of staying at home on benefits smoking and shagging all day.
It may be that you need to swallow your distaste at a few layabouts getting a free meal to ensure we have a viable workforce in the future.
Soldato
Generally, yes. However the benefits cap introduced by the Tories in 2012 forced more out of the benefits lifestyle choice and back into the workplace.
Source? Because I’ve found it’s just meant they feed their **** kids less and generally be more negligent, and move from premium cigarettes to roll ups.
Whereas the benefit cap has hit genuinely disabled people and forced them into assessments where there is a financial profit in turning them down for things they later appeal and get anyway.
Soldato
"Lack of ability to afford things under the Tories is another potential cause for drop in fertility rates" Corrected that for you.
I know of many people that can more then afford kids, they just chose not to. Choices change over generations, its the same reason why a lot of families have 1 or 2 kids now - instead of much larger families years ago. That isn't down solely to the government in power at the time.
The government doesn’t affect peoples choice to have children or not in the bubble of personal preference. It does affect affordability and access to being able to have children securely.
If I don’t want kids because I don’t like kids, that’s on me.
If I want kids but can’t afford them because the government have stripped away all financial and practical support for poor people to have children, that’s largely on government policy.
Hence why, when things like sure start centres and child care affordability gets decimated, people who want kids but can’t afford them stop having babies under more Conservative governments.
Soldato
And like you said, it's only the irresponsible ones who carry on because they know someone else will end up picking up the bill anyway. So you end up with fewer kids raised by responsible parents and more kids raised by irresponsible parents... Call me judgemental if you want, but that doesn't sound like an ideal scenario!
Soldato
Some would argue there is plenty of child care support available for those that want kids. To name a few, child benefit, tax free credits, free nursery hours. I'm not aware of any huge reduction in benefits, apart from the 3rd child rule (post 2017). There might be some more I'm not aware of I imagine.
Either way, is the above enough? That's really down to individual choice.
Unfortunately we all know of some that abuse the system. Also unfortunately it's their kids that feel the pain because of their own inability to plan ahead. Should they, we, us expect others to pick up their shortfall? I will let you decide
Finally, all of these things come down to one thing - money. If you want all of these nice things for everyone, expect to pay more for it - starting with the NI increase.
Soldato
Child benefit is ~£20 a week for the first child, less for subsequent
Tax Credits - fair enough, if your income is low enough to receive them
Free childcare - not until the child is 3, only during term time, and from what I've read, quite a few childcare providers have strange conditions around them (e.g. you have to pay extra on top for food etc., they only allow you to use them at certain times which can be a problem if you work part time).
The problem is - to answer your question - for many people (i.e. the responsible lower earners), the answer to "is the above enough?" is a resounding "no", hence the drop in fertility rates.
Soldato
Not sure where you l have got the "resounding no" from.
However, let's raise taxes to pay for people to have more kids then? Across all bands of course.
Soldato
I think you need to read my post and the ones preceeding it again, because you've gotten completely the wrong end of the stick there
OIC - difficult to tell sometimes
Indeed. I think I'll snub this election in protest.
Soldato
Why across all bands?
You're assuming of course the offspring work, or do something fairly productive?
You literally quoted me saying "you may have to swallow your distaste at a few layabouts getting a free meal to ensure a viable workforce in the future", and just responded talking about a few layabouts.
At least try to argue in good faith.
Looks like this was the winning choice. Conservatives saw less votes then Labour did in the last election. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southend_West_(UK_Parliament_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2020s
Soldato
On a 24% turnout rather than a near 70% one. Also Conservatives saw more votes than Labour in all previous elections this century.
Soldato