Trading the stockmarket (NO Referrals)

QlimaxUK said:
On the CFD question I forgot to mention that I was looking to invest ONLY in bitcoin and maybe other crypto currencies as these markets show the most movement and don't require long-term risk that stocks have with lower price changes
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Does this give anyone else a headache?

You want to trade Cryptocurrency CFDs because these markets show the most movement but you don’t want the ‘long term risks’ associated with normal stocks?

So you want to lose all of your money as quickly as possible? :p

Then it looks like all of the platforms that allow you to do what your suggesting are dodgier than the already dodgy ‘genuine’ bucket shops that are out there.

Do you not see how this is a really bad idea?
 
^

well by the way I understand this CFD system its all about buying low and selling high so you wait until bitcoin drops to it's lowest level and then when it starts to rise you buy in and wait for it to hit the highest point then sell, now on most days that I have been watching this there is at least a $200 price difference between the highest and lowest points PER DAY now I don't know how many times per day this happens as the speed changes daily depending on how the markets go (or by how much the Chinese can rattle the cage 'so to speak')

So with this in mind I would say that a small trader could make about ~£10 profit per contract unit and if I could do this 5 times a day that would equate to ~£50 per day give or take, with company stock shares this is just not possible which is why I say that those are long term risk and not worth it for me

My only question is, whats the catch here as this seems just too easy and I think that the terms of these sites will somehow stop me from doing this, maybe by refusing a withdrawal, kind of like a casino that will kick you out for card counting, not illegal but against 'house rules' kind of thing
 
QlimaxUK said:
My only question is, whats the catch here as this seems just too easy
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Because it's effectively gambling, with no guarantee of any return? To say owning part of a profit making enterprise is "risky", whilst dabbling in near-random pricing movements of currency is crackers.

Aren't people interested in business and investing fundamentals any more?
 
Fusion said:
Aren't people interested in business and investing fundamentals any more?
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*puts hand up*

Qlimax, aside from the obvious "if it's too good to be true...", CFDs on cyrptocurrencies are far riskier, more volatile and as Fusion has alluded to based on no physical balance sheet, profit or other tangible unlike traditional stocks. I've never traded CFDs but I assume they're similar to leveraged spread bets whereby you need a balance to cover any potential losses and once you near that the trade will automatically be closed at a loss.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but it's likely that people who make a success of it aren't asking what the catch is and are plugged in 24/7 with enough bank roll to cover large drops and are potentially more reliant on algorithms and semi-automation.
 
https://imgur.com/R1d5Tkf

This is what it looks like (in demo mode) put 2 trades up 1 in BTC, 10 in ETH and set low 'achievable' profit-close on both which would give £10.20 ETH and £13.08 BTC if they 'win'

EDIT: they are losing right now but this is just an example, used margin = £321.10
 
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QlimaxUK said:
https://imgur.com/R1d5Tkf

This is what it looks like (in demo mode) put 2 trades up 1 in BTC, 10 in ETH and set low 'achievable' profit-close on both which would give £10.20 ETH and £13.08 BTC if they 'win'

EDIT: they are losing right now but this is just an example, used margin = £321.10
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What would you stand to lose if they both dropped to your stop-loss? Is it a 'hard' stop? How much movement do you actually need to make your £10 and how wide is the spread? Do you pay more (is the spread wider) for a hard stop?

You make it sound so easy "five trades a day making £10 per trade" but if it was that simple everyone would be doing it — you really are just gambling and you've got to understand the potential losses as well.

If you buy in, the market dips and you get stopped out you might just think "oh well, that was bad timing" but what if the same thing happens on four of your five daily trades? How much would you have lost to theoretically make your £50?

Then the next day, you want to make up for your losses the day before so you double the price or make 10 trades instead of five — not only do you need the cash to afford these losses, you need the cash to afford the margin to buy in 'the next time'. It could turn into a very expensive exercise very quickly — chasing losses is not fun, trust me.

Also, £300-odd margin to make £20 doesn't seem like a particularly good deal to me, especially if you've got no guarantees that you can even withdraw any 'winnings' at the end of it.
 
Leveraged trading is most risky with volatile prices and bitcoin qualifies as that. Its fairly rare for easy money to go overlooked, its usually through a bad reputation and previous incidents which means its risky and known then I guess and the bet is the risk is wrongly judged. Like BP's accident, at some point the hypebole got a bit much and it could have been judged cheap. The white house press conference where Venezuela type calls for forced seizure of all BP assets was discussed was that point I thought.
Judging bitcoin is hard, its biased to China maybe some are more familiar with that.

Going by charts I think BTC is positive right now and like said above averaging up is a more reliable course then trying to judge when a negative trend can turn. Forex is more difficult then stocks, the time scale to judge BTC mood is over just a few days. It is back above a trend for this whole year now
http://www.quoteswise.com/jesse-livermore-quotes.html

d00xq6y.jpg


Is the moves by Kurdistan a big deal I wonder. Oil at a two year high because of it I read

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-41359361

DwTFoin.png
 
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QlimaxUK said:
well by the way I understand this CFD system its all about buying low and selling high so you wait until bitcoin drops to it's lowest level and then when it starts to rise you buy in and wait for it to hit the highest point then sell
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How do you know, at some given point in time, that this is the 'lowest level' it is going to be at that day? Are you sure you're not kidding yourself by looking back with the benefit of hindsight? On some days it could just keep on dropping or keep on rising etc..
 
Open a demo account with IG and see how you do. Just bear in mind you are far more ruthless and take far greater risks with pretend money than your own.
QlimaxUK said:
My only question is, whats the catch here as this seems just too easy
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The catch is (and it's a big one) you have no way of knowing where the low point is and, when you pick your low point, whether it will go up or down from there.
 
Given i'm using this as a generic investment thread (i know it's not one)

With the Lifetime ISA and it's 25% a year bonus. Is that on the balance of your account or the amount paid in that calendar year? If it's the former then i'm thinking that sticking £4k into one and forgetting about it to get £1k bonus every year as a bonus on top of any investment growth seems like a no brainer.

Can't seem to see anything to confirm this though.

Assuming a 7% growth in investment and a life of just under 30 years which is when i'd hit 60 and be able to withdraw it.

Left being with the bonus each year and the right being only in the year of contribution

TGZGQFU.png
 
Nope - Ignore my false hope, looks like it is only on the contribution each year. Not much better than a regular pension in that case after tax relief.
 
Was just doing a quick calculation for my own benefit but will have a look at that calculator. Although i do love a good spreadsheet!

Will probably just stick with this for house buying as our current one is solely in my wifes name. Then stick to my normal pension for anything else.
 
MoRT489 said:
Open a demo account with IG and see how you do.
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Just buy IGG shares and benefit from others working for you :) So long as volatility exists and personally I think its a rising trend long term then IG is likely going to benefit. IG fell back because of some regulatory matters about customer bonuses so they could be more expensive right now but arent. I kind of think they are a bearish play because volatility and negative markets are correlated afaik and we are rising for a long time now, even if wrong they pay a good yield and should be sustainable.
However I could be completely wrong, I havent investigated recently.


Ferrexpo is kinda amazing, margin expansion is the reason why commodity shares move so extremely? Its in Ukraine but I think its in the west not east border, low costs and good gains from rising iron price I guess is why.

15p to 300p and its come back down slightly but I guess its still on trend to rise. I'm not sure it was ever so risky at 15 or 30 or 40 to not buy. I did add some at 50p and sell again as a trade and I've took some at 70p for long term which I'm now thinking I should sell at least some, probably will. As ever if I been more involved correctly I would not regret selling now but I still think its best to take profits sometimes, rebalance

http://www.trustnodes.com/2017/09/2...es-run-money-says-lagard-might-added-imfs-sdr
 
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But as a bucket shop isn’t there a chance that IG could at some stage lose its licence or be more harshly regulated, which would potentially wipe out any gains?
 
Alibaba is looking like a cracking buy... likely to be the same size or larger as Amazon within a reasonably short amount of time and it has a huge market.
 
MoRT489 said:
But as a bucket shop isn’t there a chance that IG could at some stage lose its licence or be more harshly regulated, which would potentially wipe out any gains?
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Its taxed as gambling so the government is taking a cut of their revenue above a normal business I think. Its unlikely, UK doesnt want to lose this kind of business to foreign competetion. Like 2bn of Stamp Duty is paid in London by foreigners who do not visit this country, BP is quoted in London and New York and its the same asset but they choose to trade it here and give us 'free money' Same for IG really, whatever quotes could be traded elsewhere and tax paid to another government but its done here which is a positive for balancing the budget.
Its just quite unlikely imo, of course always regulation possible in every sector but its honest enough business afaik. BT in theory should be split but they have a giant pension overhang which is not a problem government wants to deal with so they carry on a monolith from the dark ages :p

Might be a better choice out there from various gambling quoted companies, IG are one of the biggest in the world I think.
Iron is dropping a bit, got a sell signal showing. Probably its tied to China which is wobbly? Sold some FXPO and its risen of course :D
 
CNA looks good 15 year low nice div above inflation. also jumped into Foxt as a long term buy no debts most has been carried into the price, oversold just like CNA.I have a few stocks in BT for the div.
 
Hi Guys,

im looking for a decent trading app to start off with. I hear robinhood is a good with with zero fees for trades etc but it lacks the information which some of the paid apps offer. This would be my first time investing/trading so something cheap to start with would be good.

I currently do not do the lottery so I would invest/trade with the money that would alternatively be spent on doing it.

Thanks
 
Its the div which is threatened I guess but no debts is also good. Bad news comes in threes but if its the same bad news repeated could be a buy

The stock, “is getting hit again and again for the same thing,” said Deepa Venkateswaran, an analyst in London at Sanford C. Bernstein & Co.

“I would buy it. It’s getting extremely cheap,” Venkateswaran said about Centrica’s stock. With big investments needed to boost uptake of electric vehicles and smart meters “it’s not in the interest of the government to bankrupt the suppliers.”

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-energy-price-cap-action-in-blow-to-utilities
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