Train prices

JBuk · 17 May 2009 at 20:25

Hatter The Mad said:
It depends on the person - my point is, if he doesn't feel like he isn't getting £xxx worth of value from first class (above buying standard), he's an idiot for buying a first class ticket.

I wasn't disagreeing although idiot maybe a tad harsh heh

What benefits are there in 1st? a better seat and a free pot of coffee or something? I honestly don't know what you get

dangerstat · 17 May 2009 at 20:25

Hatter The Mad said:
There are such things as standard calss open return tickets, y'know. Also, the chances are that the business trip will be planned >7 days in advance - giving access to the value tickets.

Quite simply there where no cheaper tickets for the train I needed to get. I'm quite happy to travel standard class *on my own time* when it's for a business trip you should (and I think paying a little extra is fine) expect to travel comfortably. The cost setup at the moment is just stupid, there really isn't anyway to defend it

dangerstat · 17 May 2009 at 20:27

JBuk said:
I wasn't disagreeing although idiot maybe a tad harsh heh

What benefits are there in 1st? a better seat and a free pot of coffee or something? I honestly don't know what you get

It depends on the opperator TBH. Normally you get something to eat (well on the occasion that it's actually edible) and more room / better seats. But for a premium of £100+ on routes into London it's an outrage.

Hatter The Mad · 17 May 2009 at 20:28

JBuk said:
What benefits are there in 1st? a better seat and a free pot of coffee or something? I honestly don't know what you get

Depends on the line, type of train (including age) and operator. Normally, you'll get a slightly wider chair, more leg room, and larger table space. Some operators give you free coffee.

JBuk · 17 May 2009 at 20:28

So it's not actually 1st class, its "slightly better than standard class"

Hatter The Mad · 17 May 2009 at 20:29

dangerstat said:
But for a premium of £100+ on routes into London it's an outrage.

I cannot take any of your points seriously - you call it an outrage (and I wholly agree with you), yet you still pay for it (business trip or not). They wouldn't charge this if people didn't buy the tickets - and thousands of people do.

dangerstat · 17 May 2009 at 20:31

JBuk said:
So it's not actually 1st class, its "slightly better than standard class"

Exactly, Virgin are actually not that bad, last time I got a free paper, pretty decent breakfast and you can actually get some work done (laptop power point at each seat). The last bit is the key bit, it's about being able to work on the move, and unfortunately very few of the opperators understand this.

rypt · 17 May 2009 at 20:33

Hatter The Mad said:
They wouldn't charge this if people didn't buy the tickets - and thousands of people do.

They are supposed to provide us with the best possible train service though ...

dangerstat · 17 May 2009 at 20:33

Hatter The Mad said:
I cannot take any of your points seriously - you call it an outrage (and I wholly agree with you), yet you still pay for it (business trip or not). They wouldn't charge this if people didn't buy the tickets - and thousands of people do.

I have no alternative. That's why I'm paying for it in this case. When I do, I don't pay for it. Just because I *have* to buy a ticket at that price DOES NOT make it less of an outrage

Hatter The Mad · 17 May 2009 at 20:33

dangerstat said:
I have no alternative. That's why I'm paying for it in this case. When I do, I don't pay for it. Just because I *have* to buy a ticket at that price DOES NOT make it less of an outrage

You're saying you have no choice but to buy a 1st class ticket? :confused:

dangerstat · 17 May 2009 at 20:36

Hatter The Mad said:
You're saying you have no choice but to buy a 1st class ticket?

Yes I need to do work whilst traveling. Best of luck to you trying to do that in standard.

Weebull · 17 May 2009 at 20:37

What's with return tickets suddenly being so expensive anyway? Maybe it's just me and the Hull - London services, but I used to be able to just get a return for £30, now it's closer to £90 and I have to shop around trying to find two singles instead. Why?

EDIT: My point is not the prices, but that returns used to actually cost what 2 singles would, now there's a completely arbitrary mark-up on them. :confused:

Hatter The Mad · 17 May 2009 at 20:37

dangerstat said:
Yes I need to do work whilst traveling. Best of luck to you trying to do that in standard.

Do you book in advance? Just reserve a table seat next to the window (for the socket). Has always worked out for me

muon · 17 May 2009 at 20:38

rypt said:
UK train prices are about 10x what you'd pay in Spain or Belgium; and the rail service is better there

Guess where the Spanish got the money to build their intercity trains from.

My spanish international economics teacher always tells his story, how when germans visit spain they mention how good the trains are. He's always tempted to say, "thanks, you paid for them".

rypt · 17 May 2009 at 20:39

ghost101 said:
Guess where the Spanish got the money to build their intercity trains from.

Dunno, where did they get it?

EDIT: Oh an edit I see, so the Germans paid for it?
So, why is it that we could not get them to pay for your trains given how they destroyed plenty of lines during WW2?

muon · 17 May 2009 at 20:41

rypt said:
Dunno, where did they get it?

EDIT: Oh an edit I see, so the Germans paid for it?
So, why is it that we could not get them to pay for your trains given how they destroyed plenty of lines during WW2?

EU in general, germans being the largest net contributors.

Spain was given money to appease their concerns that a lot of industry would go to more efficient germany when free trade rules were enforced.

jak731 · 17 May 2009 at 20:41

The standard class in the more modern cross country virgin trains almost feels like first class (compared to the inter cities at any rate), especially if you get a table, power socket next to most seats as well.

Train prices do seem to have gone up more than inflation over the past year, it was about £9.50 to get a saver return from leeds to sheffield last (academic) year, £11.20 now.

dangerstat · 17 May 2009 at 20:42

Hatter The Mad said:
Do you book in advance? Just reserve a table seat next to the window (for the socket). Has always worked out for me

Absolutely I do. And actually I think there are some great fairs off peak for advanced tickets. It is exceptionally hard to get a decent amount of work done in standard (I'm not at all posh so this isn't me having a go). 90% of the people on the trains I normally catch are business customers just wanting a quiet journey for a few hours in order to get some work done - that's why they get a 1st class ticket otherwise it's just full of single mums, stag do's, old women who want to chat about anything. I just can't understand why I can't get a decent place to do some work for 2 hours on a train for less than £200. But course I see your point about cheaper tickets for those that aren't interested in doing some work

rypt · 17 May 2009 at 20:45

ghost101 said:
EU in general, garmans being the largest net contributors.

Spain was given money to appease their concerns that a lot of industry would go to more efficient germany when free trade rules were enforced.

Which is why I say that no money should go to EU from UK (or to any other country as aid or what not), I'd rather be out of EU than funding other countries - there are plenty of things that can be fixed here first.

Hatter The Mad · 17 May 2009 at 20:51

dangerstat said:
Absolutely I do. And actually I think there are some great fairs off peak for advanced tickets. It is exceptionally hard to get a decent amount of work done in standard (I'm not at all posh so this isn't me having a go). 90% of the people on the trains I normally catch are business customers just wanting a quiet journey for a few hours in order to get some work done - that's why they get a 1st class ticket otherwise it's just full of single mums, stag do's, old women who want to chat about anything. I just can't understand why I can't get a decent place to do some work for 2 hours on a train for less than £200. But course I see your point about cheaper tickets for those that aren't interested in doing some work

True, I grant you all of that. However, I maintain what I said earlier - they wouldn't charge that for the first class tickets if people didn't pay. And they do (or more truthfully, their large businesses do). A shame for the small business worker or owner, I guess.