TrueHD & DTS HD MSTR

groen said:
Yes i notice this as well. What speakers do you have ?

I find that if i put the volume right down so that i can only just hear the voices from the center speaker, then the sound effects are still loud but not too loud. But if i put the voices up to a level that is above that. Then the explosions are just too loud for me. Some sources are worst than others.
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I have Wharfedale 9.1 speakers all round and a BK Gemini 2 sub, connected to a Sony 2400ES amp. It's pretty cool that they can get that loud and it really shakes the place up, but I'm conscious of getting complaints from neighbors, so say I'm watching The Dark Knight and it hits the bike chase scene suddenly the whole room is filled with rumbling and whatnot and I crap myself and have to drop the volume way down. Maybe I'm being overly sensitive. If only I had a detached house, then I could relax and enjoy my setup properly :(
 
RationalGaze said:
What does my head in with these HD formats is how unbalanced they always seem to be. I don't know if it's because they are mixed for a cinema or something, but I always find that the speech volume is low and the sound effects are really loud, so I have to constantly raise and lower the volume throughout a movie. I tried putting up the center speaker volume but it doesn't really make a difference. Whenever an action scene comes on, the whole lounge is just filled with the sound of explosions/crashing and whatnot and I have to quickly turn the sound down.
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Where it interferes with the film, i tend to just up the volume on the centre speaker for that film...
 
they are identical in terms of sound quality. any difference between the two on any particular disc are down to the mastering used - yes it is known to have the two tracks individually mastered to sound different.

DTS MA is the better codec for sure, but for other reasons. sound quality-wise as has been said - lossless is lossless.

regarding the comments on dynamic range, use the range compression - that's what it's there for. you'll find it on your player or on your amp.
 
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smit101 said:
To be honest there are quite a few PCM soundtracks,especially on some of the earlier released blu ray discs. Some in my collection include Hellboy,Underworld,The Pirates Of The Carribean Trilogy,James Bond Casino Royale,Apocalypto and others that escape me.

I always set my blu ray player to bitstream the audio and allow the 875 to do the decoding.

I don't really see (well hear really) how PCM,DolbyTrue HD or DTS-HD can really sound any different as they are essentially exactly the same thing,the only difference being that DolbyHD and DTS-HD are compressed to save disc space where as PCM isn't,once the amp has decoded the compressed formats we are then hearing uncompressed PCM,are we not? Any audible differences must surely be my imagination,maybe the BK Monolith sitting in the corner has cooked my ear drums up! Ahhhh! My tinnitus! PLEASE BE QUIET!:(:D
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Originally most BR's came out with PCM soundtracks, you are correct

What I was meaning however is that now there are literally 1000's of BR's on release, it is rare to find a pcm one (especially with re-issues of early releases occuring also)

As stated above, a cheap br player will deode the pcm soundtrack reasonably well (but its first and foremost a disc player and therefore sound decoding is a cheap add on) , a payed for amplifier will therefore decode the Hidef soundtrack to a better quality.

Also being one stage nearer the speakers (and therefore your ears) - the amp is better able to get timing etc right between the different speakers

Ive always found a "bad" (as in sound design) pcm soundtrack to be harder to make out than a "bad" TRueHD/DTS -HD-MSTR one (there are a few disks which have both to directly compare, but for the life of me I cant remember which ones now I try to think) (and this is while using good quality amp and speakers)


edit - Im by no means an expert, but I have never had to artificially boost the centre channel for any of hte BR's Ive watched (and I have over 400 of them). Once the amp/speakers are set up correctly there shouldnt be an issue at all with any Hollywood film (obviously a "cheaper" production may cause issues, but I cant think of any personally ). Occasionally I might have to rewind a particular speech to hear the wording, but even this is a rarity (and my ears are by no means perfect either). Room accoustics could be an issue if it isnt an innitial setup problem
 
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dbmzk1 said:
Er, no. Lossless is lossless, end of.

You have misunderstood it. Bit rate has nothing to do with it, one is just more compressed than the other. If from the same source, a TrueHD and DTS-HD MA sample would both be identical.
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Oh. I was led to believe that lossless meant uncompressed, cant remember who told me though....:rolleyes:
 
Grimley said:
Oh. I was led to believe that lossless meant uncompressed, cant remember who told me though....:rolleyes:
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True HD and DTS-HD are compressed versions of the original PCM studio master,they are compressed purely to preserve disc space.

Think of it like a computer file that is zipped/compressed to reduce size for internet transfer,once this is unzipped by the recipient at the other end, it is exactly the same as the original file. True HD/DTS-HD are unzipped (decoded) by the Home cinema amp before the sound is sent to the speakers,so becoming lossless.
 
except zipping does degrade the file (ie if done 100 or 1000 times, the file quality will be a lot worse than the original) - not so with Hi def audio which I understand is 100% reversible (ie you get out after compression EXACTLY what you put in) - ie lossless
 
FrankJH said:
except zipping does degrade the file (ie if done 100 or 1000 times, the file quality will be a lot worse than the original) - not so with Hi def audio which I understand is 100% reversible (ie you get out after compression EXACTLY what you put in) - ie lossless
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No,my analogy is sound. Zip files use lossless compression algorithms as do True-HD and DTS-HD.
 
FrankJH said:
except zipping does degrade the file (ie if done 100 or 1000 times, the file quality will be a lot worse than the original) - not so with Hi def audio which I understand is 100% reversible (ie you get out after compression EXACTLY what you put in) - ie lossless
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Brilliant :p

DTS-MA and TrueHD are like zip vs rar. Both lossless but different people. At the end both would be the same. Supposedly.

I've never read confirmation though that on a disc that contains both they use the same mix. In theory all sounds should be the same fidelity, but the mix can affect steering, relative volumes, etc.
 
How do you get TrueHD out of your PC, through Bitstream? I have an Onkyo 606..using my PS3 i get the bitstream signal with Blu Ray films but i want to know if there is any benfit to Bitstream Vs Uncompressed?
 
dom6918 said:
How do you get TrueHD out of your PC, through Bitstream? I have an Onkyo 606..using my PS3 i get the bitstream signal with Blu Ray films but i want to know if there is any benfit to Bitstream Vs Uncompressed?
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Lots of conflicting advice over on AVForums, I'd recommend listening to both and deciding yourself which is best if any difference.

It's just saying for you unzip to PCM in the PS3, then send PCM to the DACs in the amp, or (bitstream) send the zip and allow the amp to unzip and still use the amps in the DAC. I'm sure the ONLY difference would be jitter based, however that can be contentious issue too :)
 
zip isnt perfect guys - believe what you will though

By all means try it with a photograph or something - over a multiple number of times quality WILL be lost (maybe not enough to matter to most - which is why its should be and is well liked, but loss does occur)
 
FrankJH said:
zip isnt perfect guys - believe what you will though

By all means try it with a photograph or something - over a multiple number of times quality WILL be lost (maybe not enough to matter to most - which is why its should be and is well liked, but loss does occur)
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OK, try it with MD5 hashes at every step. I bet in a properly functioning computer with sound storage it will be the same.

Saving photos in a lossy format (jpg for one) is not the same as multiple zips/unzips.
 
FrankJH said:
zip isnt perfect guys - believe what you will though

By all means try it with a photograph or something - over a multiple number of times quality WILL be lost (maybe not enough to matter to most - which is why its should be and is well liked, but loss does occur)
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Lol, are you serious? :D Would you say 7z is better?

Why not make a batch file which zips and unzips a photo 1000 times, then compare the hashes at the end...

I have a feeling I'm being trolled... :p
 
As I originally said dont really care what you want to believe

Im not trolling


Ive had it proven that zip format ISNT 100% reversable - although for most uses it does the job nicely

Bossk128 said:
Saving photos in a lossy format (jpg for one) is not the same as multiple zips/unzips.
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you are the first one to mention any kind of format - lossy or otherwise

It makes no difference what the "original" is - we are talking about the difference between the original and what the 1000th zip appears
 
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