It isn't luck. You either chose to speed or not, that is the first decision and if you THEN speed and you're on 9 points you need take responsibility for your own actions. It is NOTHING to do with luck in that circumstance. It is possible to always follow the speed limits, few of us do of course, but if we get nicked the first decision was to speed so we have THEN made it a luck decision. Don't speed, don't get nicked for speeding, follow that and luck is a non issue.
TT99 convictees
- Thread starter sityeuropa
- Start date
Maybe luck isn't the right word but I'd argue that chance certainly has a bearing on whether or not you get caught speeding!
Consider 2 drivers, driving down the same 30mph road at 35mph but an hour apart - one get's caught by a mobile speed camera and an hour later the second driver doesn't = Chance/Luck (or whatever you want to call it)
I accept responsibility for the speeding I got caught for 10 years ago and it has most certainly tempered my driving now (as well as being older/wiser/having a family etc) but I still speed on occasion, sometimes without realising it! (it's very easy in my opinion to speed slightly on a familiar road where you feel comfortable and it's only when you glance at the speedometer that you even realise you are over!)
Consider 2 drivers, driving down the same 30mph road at 35mph but an hour apart - one get's caught by a mobile speed camera and an hour later the second driver doesn't = Chance/Luck (or whatever you want to call it)
I accept responsibility for the speeding I got caught for 10 years ago and it has most certainly tempered my driving now (as well as being older/wiser/having a family etc) but I still speed on occasion, sometimes without realising it! (it's very easy in my opinion to speed slightly on a familiar road where you feel comfortable and it's only when you glance at the speedometer that you even realise you are over!)
That's the nub of it. None of us are without sin (Don't start another God thread ffs) It's easy to have a momentary lapse especially with a car full of screaming kids or mates, trying to find that elusive house of address. Generally though, if you're aiming to adhere to the limits instead of 'knowing better' or 'chancing-it' means you don't rack up points by the bucketful.
If you're collecting points like lottery numbers and have a T99, you either have issues with your driving or fall into the "the rules don't apply to me" category. Luck has nothing to do with it whatsoever. Blaming "lady luck" is just passing the blame for either ignoring the limits or not paying attention to what you should be as a matter of habit.
It is equally easy just to stick at the speed limit : /
The main problem though is where people speed. The amount of people that go 60mph through a 40 or 50 and then stick at 60mph through a de-restricted dual carriageway on my work commute beggars belief.
Everyone just goes the wrong speed at the wrong time like complete ****wits.
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You're working on a flawed premise there. Firstly, you've made the assumption that neither driver could possibly have seen the van or that both drivers have the same observation skills or were paying the same amount of attention.
If you're daydreaming while driving you probably aren't paying enough attention to be safely driving at all, but even if you skip past that, your inattention deserves to be punished.
Your personal example there shows that you're perfectly willing to "switch off" on a familiar road, meaning you're not paying attention to the speed you're travelling at and possibly not paying full attention to the road either. If you shrug off the consequences of that inattention as long as it was merely missing a speed camera or camera van through inattention, why is that any different to if it was a more serious consequence as a result of the exact same behaviour?
I'm not trying to be evocative or create an argument here, but I'm trying to convey that the attitude towards luck with regard to not getting caught speeding is the same as the luck of any other event happening or not, up to and including killing someone through your own failings.
I have a fairly lax attitude towards speed limits and speeding - but I try my best to pay attention to what is going on because I know how I would feel if my mind had drifted off and I'd caused harm as a result. I view a speeding conviction as proof positive that I wasn't paying anywhere near enough attention while driving - and thus it was inexcusable that I was reducing the safety margins at the time.
So you've never been tootling along at what you imagine to be an acceptable speed for the surroundings and glanced at the speedo to find that you are a few mph over the limit for the road?
I'm not saying it's done on purpose, just that it's easy to lapse into it on a familiar road with no other traffic/pedestrians around!
I don't believe that I am - in my experience these vans are oftentimes obscured from view for just this purpose - for the sake of argument lets say my example assumes that the circumstances/abilities of the 2 drivers is the same - the fact that for one the speed camera was there and for one it wasn't is pure chance (in my opinion)
I also appreciate that lack of attention while driving is just as dangerous, if not more so, than speeding - I'm just saying it happens!
While I've stated the above, to a certain degree you make your own luck/chance by trying not to speed in the first place but you can't argue that given the same set of circumstances, luck/chance can play a part in anything in life!
Don't speed and it doesn't matter if you see or don't see the van. Don't try to make it a luck call AT ALL. Don't speed, your fine, do speed then be lucky. With 9 points I would prefer to remove the risk of losing my license if it was that important to me, not rely on risk or luck. I speed, we all speed, but it's my fault if I get nicked 100%, the luck just determines if I get away with it. Luck is used often by people who seek to apportion blame for their own mistakes. I use it, but I don't seek to justify it as my reason for being nicked. It was my fault.
I don't think many if any of the people mentioning luck were using it a tool to absolve themselves of blame.
The 3 points I got a couple of years back was on a road I was using regularly and very familiar with. Did I feel a bit unlucky that I was caught that particular time? Sure as hell did i.e. wrong place wrong time as obviously countless people including myself had done the same and not been caught! However, did I blame anyone else? Nope it was 100% my fault so I didn't contest, paid the fine and took the points.
I definitely agree though that if you're on 9 points I can't possibly understand why you wouldn't drive like an absolute nanny to ensure you never collected another 3 and a ban.
I don't think I've explained my point very well if this is what you think I meant!
Luck/chance is also a random outcome sometimes!
100% this!
I'm on 9 points now and it's not a comfortable place to be. I have about 18 months till 3 points come off and when that point comes I'll at least breathe a little easier. These days I tend to look at the speedo a lot more whilst I should probably be paying more attention to the road. The MR2 has a massive speedo so a glance does fine but in the Evo the speedo is so small it's ridiculous so I actually have to look rather than glance.
I would say I've been unlucky recently. 0 points for 10 years when I was arguably driving like more of a nutter and then 9 points in under 2 years. 3 of which I don't particularly think I deserved in all honestly.
I would say I've been unlucky recently. 0 points for 10 years when I was arguably driving like more of a nutter and then 9 points in under 2 years. 3 of which I don't particularly think I deserved in all honestly.
Don't know why so many people took offence to the word luck, the post was clearly comparing speeders who get caught vs speeders who don't, of course if you speed and don't get caught you're lucky. Getting 12 points isn't unlucky but that's not what the post was getting at.
It's not 'of course' though, plenty of speeders don't get caught because they're doing 80mph down the barely used 60mph B Road to work, whereas the ones getting caught are doing 50mph through a frequently camera ridden 40mph section.
I used to spend a lot of time travelling between Southampton and Dorchester. There was a section that dropped from 60 to 40 and I adhered to that religiously, because they put a van there so often. I would get tailgated all the time, dodgy overtaking etc. I wouldn't consider those people unlucky, just stupid of they got caught, for choosing to speed on a bit of road that obviously had a lower limit because it was worse road and had frequent accidents.
So much is down to choosing your time and place, paying attention, good observations etc. luck is a minimal factor in my opinion, almost so much as to irrelevant. This is an opinion I've come to have since being caught a few years ago driving like an idiot, not paying attention to my surrounding, no luck involved.
I agreed with your post until the last paragraph. You can't definitively say 'no' luck involved because there is always an element of luck, even if you're clever about where you speed. I use the same methodology as yourself but it doesn't mean it's impossible to get caught. Personally I have favourite places I like to go fast and these are places where it's very unlikely I'll get caught because of the location or time of day. One day I might get caught or perhaps I'll continue with no points on my license even though others around me are getting caught.
Agreed, there is no foolproof way to go over the limit and not get caught. Yes you can limit your exposure by being clever but you can still get caught.
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Well there IS a foolproof way to not get caught speeding, which is not speeding
Haha indeed but you know what I meant
Soldato
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I will agreed, in my experience most of the people I know who have got points are not the ones who drive quickly. The ones who get the points are the ones who drive around in a bubble paying virtually no attention to anything.
Case in point is my mother who doesn't actually look at her speedo. She just drives at what feels like the right speed, of course as she get further into a journey she get's used to the feeling of speed so drives faster. Meaning she will often start a journey driving at around 15mph!! but yet still got herself a place on a speed awareness course.
If at any point during a journey you were to ask her what the prevailing speed limit is she wouldn't have a clue!
EDIT: Actualy that's not true, I did once have to following conversation with her.
"Mum, you seem to be doing 13 miles per hour"
"Isn't that the speed I'm meant to be doing."
"No mum, thirteen!!"
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