Typical number of job applications nowadays before being offered a job?

[Nasher]

That's crazy talk tbh... IT/tech is huge and within it AI is pretty much the highest impact area to work in at the moment - your individual impact as a tradesperson is pretty limited in comparison to many tech careers - there's only so much you can fix or so much stuff you can physically install as an individual and it scales pretty linearly with hours put in and individual skill etc.. whereas someone's work in tech can have an outsided impact, someone finds some way of optimising some existing process and process and the company saves millions etc.. AI, at the moment and in the near future, is basically just further enhancing the impact someone can have.

But also just re: being on the tools at 40 or 50 - there's also specialist roles, speak to say an electrician at a data centre or similar - they're not exactly on their hands and knees all day as someone doing domestic work or new construction might be - they'll often be specialist high voltage guys with additional qualifications etc..

AI is a bubble though. It's going to burst like the dot-com one did.

Eventually the tools will be user friendly enough that no one needs specialists anymore. It'll fall under general IT.

People who typically need to make job applications - new graduates, people changing careers, people who've been sacked/made redundant.

Generally, if you're already employed, then applications shouldn't be necessary (some fields vary - civil servants need to proactively apply for jobs/promotions) - typically, you should have recruiters contacting you on linkedin, people in your industry at other places who know you (ex colleagues, clients etc..) etc. if you build a network, there should be offers semi-regularly that you turn down - if that's not happening then work on fixing that before you actually need it. You should be able to move on at your leisure and feel comfortable turning down jobs as you're already employed - you should also feel comfortable occasionally accepting invitations to interview somewhere even if you're not actually considering moving - just to keep an eye on your worth, keep your interview skills sharp and also you maight end up with a surprising offer.

Why should applications be avoided - well, applications are inherently flawed, these days it's so easy to apply that they can attract literally hundreds if not thousands of applicants for any given job, many are hopelessly mismatched etc.. but with that volume of applicants many companies will use AI to filter people, it's a long shot for most. It's not completely hopeless, but it's not efficient, ergo, someone having to make hundreds of applications is believable.

It's much better to get an employee referral or to have a conversation with a recruiter who is actually contracted to fill a given role, as they can simply get you an initial interview and bypass having your CV stuck in a pile of other open applicants.

Yep recruiters are using AI to filter people. You can game it though and once you figure it out you'll start getting offered a lot more interviews (and there lies the issue with AI lol). Once you get a feel for how it functions you can mess with it pretty easily. Most people haven't realised that yet so use it to get ahead.

 

[jaybee]

Do yourself a favour and learn a trade. Electricians, plumbers and mechies are always, always in demand and will never be without work. Starting a career in IT now has to be one of the most fruitless endeavours you could possibly do.

As a seasoned IT professional, I agree. My son is academic enough to do A levels but is going down the electrician path.
Starting IT now is brave with AI becoming so prevalent.

 

[radderfire]

This is the same issue my friend is facing with this plumping business.

I guess that's the opposite of a personal trainer?

 

[radderfire]

Starting IT now is brave with AI becoming so prevalent.

I'm not in IT but I see the reduction in IT job demand more as a downturn in the economy rather than the rise of AI.

 

[jaybee]

There are Reddit subs full of people saying the same thing, and that's that contracting - particularly IT contracting roles - is absolutely dead. The glory days are gone. IR35 had a major part in it but it's several factors really.

I'm just saying starting out in IT now is a completely different landscape to 20 years ago.

 

[cheesyboy]

I last changed jobs about 4 years ago. From memory, I got the 4th job I interviewed for. I was going through recruiters, so didn't really 'apply' for anything outside of those.

The most ridiculous one was where I had three rounds of interviews for a 3 month contract... and didn't even get it

Another was where I got put forward as the 'here's what you get for 20% less money' comparison. I went into it knowing that, but wanted the interview practice, and to get a feeling for what I would need for that extra 20%.

I'm in finance. There's regularly jobs that pop up that I would be interested in if I wasn't enjoying where I'm at. No idea how competitive they are, of course.

 

[Nasher]

I'm not in IT but I see the reduction in IT job demand more as a downturn in the economy rather than the rise of AI.

That on top of it. IT always gets cut when a company needs to save money, but they don't seem to consider it's the IT guys who actually enable everyone else to work.

The place I just left has a single tech left running around doing eveything on site (a building built to fit 500 people in), he plans to leave later in the year. Things will slowly break down and they will be screwed. There is no time to hire someone and train them up and they don't pay enough for someone more experienced.

 

[dowie]

AI is a bubble though. It's going to burst like the dot-com one did.

Eventually the tools will be user friendly enough that no one needs specialists anymore. It'll fall under general IT.

That's too vague, I don't doubt some startups are going to crash and burn, for example, but it's not clear that AI is a bubble at all and you're just offering that as an assertion.

Currently, the opposite to what you've just said is the case, people do need specialists but don't need junior devs etc.. so much.

 

[radderfire]

The way I see this is that the UK government has been "bought out", which essentially means the politicians have been seduced by the private sector. This means profit motive controls everything, like UK manufacturing being shifted abroad, and the UK property market getting massively inflated to enrich the bosses of the financial sector. There is no-one in the government that actually sticks up for the people anymore, they've all been "bought out" and bow to the power of the Pound Sterling. It's not exactly corruption or bribery, but it's a similar result. Essentially then, there's no real planning over how people of this country are going to be employed, and there aren't nearly enough jobs to go around for young people. It's a joke and a mess. The country should be ashamed.

 

[radderfire]

The place I just left has a single tech left running around doing eveything on site (a building built to fit 500 people in), he plans to leave later in the year. Things will slowly break down and they will be screwed. There is no time to hire someone and train them up and they don't pay enough for someone more experienced.

Sounds like they're going to find out about the value of their IT staff the hard way.

 

[malachi]

There are Reddit subs full of people saying the same thing, and that's that contracting - particularly IT contracting roles - is absolutely dead. The glory days are gone. IR35 had a major part in it but it's several factors really.

I'm just saying starting out in IT now is a completely different landscape to 20 years ago.

Best to leave the UK and take your skillset elsewhere. As the Government make it hard for Average Joe to level up.

Unfortunately not everyone has that option.

 

[Nasher]

The way I see this is that the UK government has been "bought out", which essentially means the politicians have been seduced by the private sector. This means profit motive controls everything, like UK manufacturing being shifted abroad, and the UK property market getting massively inflated to enrich the bosses of the financial sector. There is no-one in the government that actually sticks up for the people anymore, they've all been "bought out" and bow to the power of the Pound Sterling. It's not exactly corruption or bribery, but it's a similar result. Essentially then, there's no real planning over how people of this country are going to be employed, and there aren't nearly enough jobs to go around for young people. It's a joke and a mess. The country should be ashamed.

It's only not corruption and bribary because they made laws allowing them to do these things. A bit like the tax loopholes for the rich which never get closed

A normal civil servant isn't allowed to be involved with a company offering services to the government, but for some reason MPs are.

 

[radderfire]

Another example of how the profit motive has taken over, is that educational establishments have been turned into businesses. This has made them desperate to attract students for any old course, but it turns out that many of these courses have little relevance to real world job opportunities, or there are way more people doing them than jobs actually exist for.

 

[malachi]

My HR department was full of people with pointless degrees. One had a degree in Zoologie and another in Geology.

They pick those degrees because they sounded fun.

 

[NickK]

After resigning back in November….I made two applications.

I ended up taking a third job that I was approached for, from someone I worked with in the past.

Things are going to be very different for people just starting out their careers though. Can’t rely on your network when you don’t have one yet.

Approached is really a different kettle of fish, you tend to be past the filtering and noise. I remember being made redundant from one place but a vendor basically made me and offer in the coffee shop right then and there. Also the last approached role was straight in too - two interviews and hired.

I remember one role I got the job - I applied in November, the company HR lost my application when their staff resigned so I had to chase up with their OOO email contact, I had 7 interviews and finally was offered in March IIRC and started in May..

I would expect people to be applying for at least 300+ roles in tech.

 

[mid_gen]

Approached is really a different kettle of fish, you tend to be past the filtering and noise. I remember being made redundant from one place but a vendor basically made me and offer in the coffee shop right then and there. Also the last approached role was straight in too - two interviews and hired.

Well yes, that's my point. You need a network. It's partly why I took some part time work at a local uni, excellent networking opportunity and I made a lot of good contacts through it.

I remember one role I got the job - I applied in November, the company HR lost my application when their staff resigned so I had to chase up with their OOO email contact, I had 7 interviews and finally was offered in March IIRC and started in May..

I would expect people to be applying for at least 300+ roles in tech.

I'm glad this isn't the tech world I live in!

 

[NickK]

People who typically need to make job applications - new graduates, people changing careers, people who've been sacked/made redundant.

Issue is that that people make assumption.

I remember being made redundant once.. not because I was low performing but simply because the organisation decided to can 50,000 people in one go, and refocus globally. Other times - company sold and relocated offices, and the multi-conglomerate group decided, after 6 years of a centralisation strategy to switch to decentralisation.

Companies are volatile and change, you can be really good at what you do but when budgets are depressed and the market is saturated - the only way (as you've pointed out is via personal contacts).

I've one one personal referral - on talking to the that CEO it was clear he's looking for a low level AI techie. Techie yes but leading 70+ staff was less technical and more organisational bulldozer.

I am techie (I have a degree that says techie too) - but it plays against you if you confuse the market saying techie "how" rather than executive "why". If I wave the 'how' then I get stereotyped, if keep at a high level 'why' then we're going to be closer.

I've learnt the hard way - the job market can't cope with multi-faceted applicants. They need to have a clear pigeonhole applicant.

 

[slinxy]

I’ve been lucky I guess..
“played” at getting a job when I left uni.. as I wasn’t really interested in any of them, just went though the motions to keep the dole officer off my back.

The jobs that I go for, I tend to get 1:1 application to hiring.

I have gone for some jobs just to have a nose and a chat at the interview lol

My current job I got head hunted for, thou I still had to do the paperwork and interview.

I guess I see how hard is really is when I try to get an “easy” role in a decades time to see me though to retirement.

 

[mid_gen]

Issue is that that people make assumption.

I remember being made redundant once.. not because I was low performing but simply because the organisation decided to can 50,000 people in one go, and refocus globally. Other times - company sold and relocated offices, and the multi-conglomerate group decided, after 6 years of a centralisation strategy to switch to decentralisation.

Companies are volatile and change, you can be really good at what you do but when budgets are depressed and the market is saturated - the only way (as you've pointed out is via personal contacts).

I've one one personal referral - on talking to the that CEO it was clear he's looking for a low level AI techie. Techie yes but leading 70+ staff was less technical and more organisational bulldozer.

I am techie (I have a degree that says techie too) - but it plays against you if you confuse the market saying techie "how" rather than executive "why". If I wave the 'how' then I get stereotyped, if keep at a high level 'why' then we're going to be closer.

I've learnt the hard way - the job market can't cope with multi-faceted applicants. They need to have a clear pigeonhole applicant.

I’ve got a very varied CV across multiple industries, sometimes I’ve been in purely managerial roles, sometimes purely technical, sometimes somewhere in between.

I don’t find my breadth of experience a problem, it means I’m never stumped if I get asked about something ‘outside my lane’.

Framing things as ‘their problem’ isn’t really going to help!

 

[NickK]

I’ve got a very varied CV across multiple industries, sometimes I’ve been in purely managerial roles, sometimes purely technical, sometimes somewhere in between.

I don’t find my breadth of experience a problem, it means I’m never stumped if I get asked about something ‘outside my lane’.

Framing things as ‘their problem’ isn’t really going to help!

It depends on the recruiter - there's a spectrum. Not saying I'm perfect, but it's not just a one sided issue.