***UEFA Champions League/Europa League 2010/11 Matchday 1***

[G|mp]

Nick, answer me a question.

Do you remember MU in the 80's under Ron Atkinson? That was a transitional period and we were languishing behind everyone, iirc he ****ed up a 10 point lead and we lost the title.

Veron etc that you have mentioned were bought and failed to live up to the hype, it takes a special player to succeed at MU and I don't care what you say regarding Wenger buying better cheaper players, it takes a special breed of player to succeed at MU. Look at Veron at Chelsea, he was a hell of a better player than he was at MU purely because the pressure wasn't the same.

Keep banging on about it all you like but for every duff buy that Fergie has made as has already been pointed out, every other manager has as well.

I really do think you're just on the wind up nowadays :/

 

[G|mp]

do you really think thats true? i love man u? i am just concerned by the transitional issues the club has that have not been addressed properly despite funds clearly being available and the players to fill the gaps being available at the right time and the right price.

we just missed out on them and bought badly.

i mean our transfer ins and outs tells its own story. surely anyone with some common sense can see that apart from a handful of good buys the rest of the money has been utterly wasted?

We went for Berbatov at the time and he chose Spurs, nothing Fergie can do about that!

If we had not bought Ferdinand, Rooney, Berbatov and gone for cheaper options what situation do you think we would be in now?

I'll tell you where, same position as Arsenal, fighting to stay in the top 4 with a cheaper and by far mediocre squad.

 

[The Running Man]

Arshavin has 10yrs left (Hes 29)
tbh i think SAF has done alright in transfers...Smalling, Hernandez and Twins look alright, berba is a top player just not used correctly but Carrick is a waste as

well those were all signed this season, except the twins. so what happened for the last 5 years worth of signings?

i mean sure Valencia is OK, but is he better than Nasri? Arsh etc except he cost more than both of them, but being south american is bad for international duty reasons.

Lol and sorry with that i took his number as his age! he doesnt look 29!

but you think smalling looks good? for like 9-12million? er... Pique looked good and wasnt that kind of money. Jon Evans? oh how i cringe!

We went for Berbatov at the time and he chose Spurs, nothing Fergie can do about that!

well you dont stick it out with Tevez and then drop him whilst he's hot and then double the offer for berbatov until they cant resist any longer!

we could have had tevez for 25 or betbatov for 28? as an investment for purely financial stakes, id take tevez. for effort and energy on the pitch, id also take tevez...

err...?

there comes a point where you have to move on and say, okay that player is now too old, too expensive, go somewhere else. not just keep bidding until you have to mortgage the house for him! i mean come on.

I really do think you're just on the wind up nowadays :/

im not genuinely. i just feel strongly about it. you as much s agreed with me about some of these players simply not being good enough but are continuing to argue the toss?

If we had not bought Ferdinand, Rooney, Berbatov and gone for cheaper options what situation do you think we would be in now?

seriously, if we d not spent 30 on berba and had invested in a right back, and even Van Der Vaart for instance, im sure we'd be loads better off than we are right now?

some players are the right age and right potential to be 30mill sure. i can see that.

Like Ronaldinho was when we tried to haggle down those last 2 millions, or wayne was in his youth with an option to bankrupt, i mean go to newcastle. berbatov was never in that category , neither was veron.

 

[drunkenmaster]

Tevez played in an identical role as Rooney, considering he supposedly went to City for around 45million, I don't except the idea he would have cost Utd 25million, likewise however much he would have cost, ideally you wouldn't want to play him alongside Rooney. Berbatov is a completely different type of player, he's well worth 30mil, he's got better touch and control than the vast vast majority of players in the premier league. Thats ignoring that Tevez wasn't the same player at Utd as Hughes managed to get out of him at City, again, there were goals all over the place at UTD, half the reason he scored so many at City was the attack focused on him, not Berb, Rooney or Ronaldo, half the reason Rooney scored so many, is without Ronaldo/Tevez the attack focused on him and more chances fell to him, if Rooney/Tevez had played together last season, neither would have gotten over 20 goals.

A similar situation at Arsenal would be having the choice to buy a Ronaldo quality type player for 30mil, or buy Lampard for 25mil(assuming Tevez really was offered for that price), Lampards fantastic, but Arsenal have few out and out wingers, none of Ronaldo's quality, and Fabregas in the middle, who frankly is better than Lampard, it would be an utter waste to buy, and bench Lampard than buy Ronaldo who'd be first team.

Berbatov, this season for sure is the 2nd best player in the squad, and really, at worst is in the top 4 best players at Utd depending on how highly you rate Vidic, Rooney and Scholes ahead of him.

I have no idea what you're argueing about, Berbatov this season so far has been MASSIVELY better than Tevez so far and for me Berbatov was equally as good last year, just with a team around not linking up as often, the movement, 1-2's, the interplay between Nani, Scholes, Berbatov has been outstanding this year, when Scholes doesn't play theres quite literally no one even close to being able to link up with Berbatov as well.

Arshavin looked fantastic against Braga with Nasri/Wilshire playing, he looks disinterested and almost entirely crap with Diaby, Denilson/Theo in the team. Hell Arshavin covered and got way back at right back several times covering for Sagna, he just looked more alive ALL game long even without the ball as the team just felt right and worked so so well. All teams need great players around them to be at their best.

Berbatov was absolutely outstanding at playing in Rooney and Ronaldo in behind and creating chances for them the year before that, he's been well worth 30mil every year, people just get upset when he doesn't score 30 goals a year, because, frankly, they just don't get it.

The only difference between Berb this year and last is being played more often and scoring a few more as he's shooting more than passing to the WAY out of form Rooney.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

I'll tell you exactly why we do, here's a little task for you, go out and buy 2 squad players with as much Premier League and Champions League experience that O'Shea and Brown have got.

Ooohh make sure that they can play multiple positions as well please.

Ooohh make sure they will play for the same wages that O'Shea and Brown do and also that they're quite happy to play back up to the first team.



Now go my young steed and report back with your findings!

Gallas would be one, im sure someone else could come up with another.

 

[G|mp]

well those were all signed this season, except the twins. so what happened for the last 5 years worth of signings?

i mean sure Valencia is OK, but is he better than Nasri? Arsh etc except he cost more than both of them, but being south american is bad for international duty reasons.

Lol and sorry with that i took his number as his age! he doesnt look 29!

but you think smalling looks good? for like 9-12million? er... Pique looked good and wasnt that kind of money. Jon Evans? oh how i cringe!



well you dont stick it out with Tevez and then drop him whilst he's hot and then double the offer for berbatov until they cant resist any longer!

we could have had tevez for 25 or betbatov for 28? as an investment for purely financial stakes, id take tevez. for effort and energy on the pitch, id also take tevez...

err...?

there comes a point where you have to move on and say, okay that player is now too old, too expensive, go somewhere else. not just keep bidding until you have to mortgage the house for him! i mean come on.



im not genuinely. i just feel strongly about it. you as much s agreed with me about some of these players simply not being good enough but are continuing to argue the toss?



seriously, if we d not spent 30 on berba and had invested in a right back, and even Van Der Vaart for instance, im sure we'd be loads better off than we are right now?

some players are the right age and right potential to be 30mill sure. i can see that.

Like Ronaldinho was when we tried to haggle down those last 2 millions, or wayne was in his youth with an option to bankrupt, i mean go to newcastle. berbatov was never in that category , neither was veron.

When have I ever agreed with you on anything related to football?

Valencia is better than Nasri, he can cross for one and score goals.

We've been over Pique before, he wasn't getting 1st team football so wanted to move on to his boyhood club.

What seriously did Tevez ever bring to United apart from defending from the front running round like a headless chicken, he had Rooney and Ronaldo giving him the ammunition but never looked like he could score more than 6 a season, then his wage demands became apparent and Fergie ****ed him off, I have no regrets over that one at all, do you like players who make gestures towards the people that pay his wages? He sealed his fate right there and then. Good riddance to the Argie mercenary.

You talk about spending 30 million on Berbatov, what about the others that you have again glossed over because they don't fit in with your argument?

The Ronaldinho deal was ****ed up by Kenyon and nobody else.

How would we have ever got VdV? He was always going to Real Madrid but I forgot that you think we should be able to sign anyone whenever we like, must be your FM2010 thinking again.

If Joe Bloggs playing for Stoke next week scored a hat trick you would come out with "we should have signed him when he was 200k and only 9 years old, Fergie dropped the ball again!!!!"

You say that you feel strongly about it but have you ever had another United fan agree with anything you say? Genuine question.

Another one, how old are you? You obviously don't remember when United were struggling in mid table.

 

[G|mp]

Gallas would be one, im sure someone else could come up with another.

Yeah we should have signed Gallas when he was at Arsenal to sit on the bench for the same wages as O'Shea and Brown are on.

I can see that happening, no, I really can

Again, we are not playing FM here girls.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

Yeah we should have signed Gallas when he was at Arsenal to sit on the bench for the same wages as O'Shea and Brown are on.

I can see that happening, no, I really can

Again, we are not playing FM here girls.

how much are they on?

 

[G|mp]

how much are they on?

At a guess?

Half of what Gallas was on.

You've ignored my other points, can you see Gallas joining MU to sit on the bench when he was at either Arsenal or Chelsea?

 

[Psycho Sonny]

At a guess?

Half of what Gallas was on.

You've ignored my other points, can you see Gallas joining MU to sit on the bench when he was at either Arsenal or Chelsea?

Ferdinand has been plagued with injuries for the past season, you should have signed gallas on a free this season and he would have accepted the same wages he is on at spurs.

 

[G|mp]

Ferdinand has been plagued with injuries for the past season, you should have signed gallas on a free this season and he would have accepted the same wages he is on at spurs.

You know him then obviously.

What makes you think we would want him?

The strops he has when he loses?

His great pre match team talks in a huddle?

The all round bad attitude?

His loyalty?

Pick one.

The other point is that we already have Ferdinand, Vidic, Evans and Smalling.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

You know him then obviously.

What makes you think we would want him?

The strops he has when he loses?

His great pre match team talks in a huddle?

The all round bad attitude?

His loyalty?

Pick one.

The other point is that we already have Ferdinand, Vidic, Evans and Smalling.

im sure fergie would set him straight and not take any of his crap so that negates most of your points.

as for evans, he gets bullied and is weak in the air, something which wouldnt happen with gallas. with ferdinands recent injuries happening all too frequently, they are only going to get worse with age, you need someone like gallas as backup this season, not evans.

the teams needs better players, thats undeniable, whether you can afford those players or not is a different matter, it is clear you guys can't.

 

[G|mp]

im sure fergie would set him straight and not take any of his crap so that negates most of your points.

as for evans, he gets bullied and is weak in the air, something which wouldnt happen with gallas. with ferdinands recent injuries happening all too frequently, they are only going to get worse with age, you need someone like gallas as backup this season, not evans.

the teams needs better players, thats undeniable, whether you can afford those players or not is a different matter, it is clear you guys can't.

Yes I'm sure Fergie is going to teach a 33 year old man how to behave.

You seem to have missed out the other 2 defenders I mentioned, where do Vidic and Smalling fit into your plans? May be we should forget them for the sake of your argument, we don't need any defenders.

Ferdinand and Vidic as the CB's with Evans and Smalling as back up, that is not a bad set of defenders there and I would put it up against anyones.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

Yes I'm sure Fergie is going to teach a 33 year old man how to behave.

You seem to have missed out the other 2 defenders I mentioned, where do Vidic and Smalling fit into your plans? May be we should forget them for the sake of your argument, we don't need any defenders.

Ferdinand and Vidic as the CB's with Evans and Smalling as back up, that is not a bad set of defenders there and I would put it up against anyones.

Vidic is the best in the league. so he is an obvious starter, i didnt think these simple things needed explained to a man of your high football knowledge.

therefore the other CB spot goes to Ferdinand (who has been injury plagued for a season) therefore you need a decent backup.

Smalling is 20, he never got that many games for fulham never mind man utd, he is still a reserve team player, not backup.

that leaves you with evans who isnt decent enough to be backup to an injury plagued ferdinand. if rio wasnt injury plaged then he would be fine, but he currently is.

you guys need a top CB now.

 

[G|mp]

Vidic is the best in the league. so he is an obvious starter, i didnt think these simple things needed explained to a man of your high football knowledge.

therefore the other CB spot goes to Ferdinand (who has been injury plagued for a season) therefore you need a decent backup.

Smalling is 20, he never got that many games for fulham never mind man utd, he is still a reserve team player, not backup.

that leaves you with evans who isnt decent enough to be backup to an injury plagued ferdinand. if rio wasnt injury plaged then he would be fine, but he currently is.

you guys need a top CB now.

I really do have to bow down to your superior knowledge, tell me how many did MU concede last season with this **** awful injury plagued defence?

Shall I tell you save you looking, 28, yes 28 the lowest in the Premier League.

That was with a defence of Fletcher and Carrick for 2 and a bit games whilst we didn't have a defender in the squad.

Team P W D L F A GD PTS

1 Chelsea 38 27 5 6 103 32 71 86

2 Man Utd 38 27 4 7 86 28 58 85

3 Arsenal 38 23 6 9 83 41 42 75

4 Tottenham 38 21 7 10 67 41 26 70

Now yeah lets get Gallas in, he was fit all season and sure did shore up the Arsenal defence.

 

[Rich_L]

I'll tell you where, same position as Arsenal, fighting to stay in the top 4 with a cheaper and by far mediocre squad.

Just a small point but since I don't recall Arsenal really struggling to stay in the top 4?

I know every season people come up with the gem that "They are going to struggle because Spurs/Man City/Liverpool/Villa/etc are really improved" but then every season they comfortably achieve a top 4 position, normally pushing Man Utd and Chelsea with a decent cup run in the Champs League to boot rather than fighting off challenges from below. Even the time when Liverpool had a great season they still made 4th without too much bother.

They're kinda in their own mini-tier, not quite as good as Man Utd and Chelsea (but given the budget that's hardly surprising) but I can only remember once they've really been challenged for a Top 4 spot, so to say they are fighting to stay in the Top 4 each season does them a fair bit of disservice, especially given their transfer dealings.

 

[Biz.Kid09]

Gallas would have a been a good signing for anyone tbh

 

[G|mp]

Just a small point but since I don't recall Arsenal really struggling to stay in the top 4?

I know every season people come up with the gem that "They are going to struggle because Spurs/Man City/Liverpool/Villa/etc are really improved" but then every season they comfortably achieve a top 4 position, normally pushing Man Utd and Chelsea with a decent cup run in the Champs League to boot rather than fighting off challenges from below. Even the time when Liverpool had a great season they still made 4th without too much bother.

They're kinda in their own mini-tier, not quite as good as Man Utd and Chelsea (but given the budget that's hardly surprising) but I can only remember once they've really been challenged for a Top 4 spot, so to say they are fighting to stay in the Top 4 each season does them a fair bit of disservice, especially given their transfer dealings.

I didn't say they were struggling I said fighting to stay in it, the same as Liverpool, Spurs and City were fighting for it last season.

If it wasn't for Spurs bottling it at one point last season it looked as if they were going to take it from Arsenal and Liverpool having a shocker helped their cause.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

I really do have to bow down to your superior knowledge, tell me how many did MU concede last season with this **** awful injury plagued defence?

Shall I tell you save you looking, 28, yes 28 the lowest in the Premier League.

That was with a defence of Fletcher and Carrick for 2 and a bit games whilst we didn't have a defender in the squad.

Team P W D L F A GD PTS

1 Chelsea 38 27 5 6 103 32 71 86

2 Man Utd 38 27 4 7 86 28 58 85

3 Arsenal 38 23 6 9 83 41 42 75

4 Tottenham 38 21 7 10 67 41 26 70

Now yeah lets get Gallas in, he was fit all season and sure did shore up the Arsenal defence.

yeah thats right you dont need any defender's especially not gallas.

you guys are looking comfortable with 4 games played so far and 2 of them being draw's, those draw's were who's fault? must have been the striker's and not a certain Mr Evans who got raped by Mr Cahill and lost every high ball played near him?

look at your goals against for this season too, 5 goals scored against you in 4 games, whereas chelsea and arsenal combined have only let in 4 goals in 8 games.

 

[Tummy]

yeah thats right you dont need any defender's especially not gallas.

you guys are looking comfortable with 4 games played so far and 2 of them being draw's, those draw's were who's fault? must have been the striker's and not a certain Mr Evans who got raped by Mr Cahill and lost every high ball played near him?

look at your goals against for this season too, 5 goals scored against you in 4 games, whereas chelsea and arsenal combined have only let in 4 goals in 8 games.

Knee Jerk too much?

G|mp's right.

There isn't anything wrong with the United center backs, very comfortable back four that were for the most part oustanding last season and helped United maintain the best defence.

oh wait, no sorry, they've let in a few goals in the few games they've played. Sorry. They should have signed a past it, french drama queen.