uninterruptible power supply help

[Phil2008]

A 1800watt ups will last much longer then a 670watt ups if its using the same load... People get the wattage thats required to run there stuff and then wonder why the ups only last 5mins

Like with this ups I have got at the moment, its a 670watt UPS, but I only need a 350watts maximum. But getting a over the top UPS will increase runtime, as the batteries are not being drained so quickly.

Apparently online ups's can run with generators too, as the generator only recharges the batteries. But still I think you need half decent generator so the voltage doesn't spike too much. I might invest in a generator sometime to run along side my ups for the long power cuts we sometimes get.

I was on about the "eco mode" a few days ago that some online ups have and yes they can be run as a line interactive ups, to save power. The switch over from mains to battery mode is 50% faster on the new ups of 4millisecounds.. So I might use this mode if it uses a lot of power, then the normal mode during storms or if the mains powers dodgy.

 

[Phil2008]

Usually, but not always.

Battery capacity will decide the run-time not the rated wattage.

I will be a tad gutted if I dont get over 1hr runtime with a 150watt load with the 1800watt ups because at the moment I get 20mins with a 150watt load with a 670watt ups

Thats why I ordered a ups one with a such a high wattage, as I want the runtime to be much longer. The new ups has 4 12volts 9ah batteries and Im pretty sure Im using 2 12volts 9ah batteries with my old ups.

 

[Phil2008]

With the amont of money its cost (a little under £400) it better have a good runtime...Also our power is going off in a few weeks, so it will be connected it to our 200watt fishtank heater... I have no idea how long it will run on that, as the heater will be on and off due to the thermostat.

 

[Phil2008]

So Im guessin 2-3hrs depending how often the heater comes on,, but we are going to make the room nice and warm, so that should help with the water temp.

Im guessing the inverter will drain the battery aswel tho?

 

[Phil2008]

Yes, but it might not be worth doing because it doesn't sound like the ups going to last long,, but the plan is before the power goes off,, we will turn the temp up on the heaters thermostat as far as we dare without killing the fish and heat up the room. Then hopefully it will take a while before the heater needs to come on when the power goes off... or thats the plan anyway.

 

[Phil2008]

We had only just had the fish tank a few months ago, so its just connected to the mains power.. I only use the UPS on my computer stuff. But seeing that the power is going to be off in a few weeks, it might aswel be put to better use on the fish tank. Like its a tad of a waste of time trying my old UPS on the tank, as that lasts only about 10mins with a 150watt load. It should last roughly 20-30mins but the batteries need changing.

But I think when I get the new UPS,, I will test it first on the fish tank before setting it up on my computer stuff and see if its worth doing when the power goes off.

 

[Phil2008]

I could have had the same but with the external battery connector for £20 more, but you could do that forever,, a few more pounds.

 

[Phil2008]

I received the UPS today but its been in the wars as the front grill has been marked and damaged slightly through the cardboard box, but it appears to be working ok and you cant see the damage from a few meters away. So I am going to see if I can have a partial refund

So its still on charge, Im going to leave it charging till tomorrow and then l will test it on the fish tank. Im not having high hopes for it lasting long at all, as 2 filter pumps need running aswel now I would put the filters pumps on my old ups, but apparently the simulated sine wave can damage motors, so thats out. But I couldn't really spent more money on a higher wattage UPS, because your getting into stupid money for over 2000wattage UPS's. They probably use more mains power too and also they use 6 or more batteries, so battery replacements wont be cheap either.

I might have to buy a tinted film for the screen as it is always lit up, even on battery mode (stupid design) and its in my bedroom.. Also the fans are not all that quiet, but you guys warned me about that one, so I'll have to get use to the noise or change the fans. These are only my 2 niggles I have with it at the moment, and when I get it into my room I will see how much power it uses on the online mode and eco mode. I'll report back with all my findings.

 

[Phil2008]

I'd only expect the fans to be on while it's running from the batteries (and expect them to be very noisy).

Maybe it's because it's an online model rather than line interactive. I've never had any reason to buy anything but line interactive so I'm not sure. I wouldn't be changing fans unless you're 100% sure there's no chance of it cooking.

What's the recharge time? That's often one of the key differences between cheap and more expensive models.

Do you have any near neighbours? If that was my fish tank I'd be asking nicely and running a mains extension lead to next door. If I paid them £1/day or bought them a nice bottle of wine for the trouble they'd be well ahead.

The fans are on low speed, but they go high speed when ups gets over 70% loaded or in battery mode and the noise level ramps up quite a bit more. Im not sure about the recharge time, as it was about 80% charged out of the box with 1 charge bar needed charging as it was flashing. Its still flashing now but Im guessing its fully changed by now or there's something wrong with it.. The specs say 4hrs to 90%charge and the charger is 1.5A whatever that means.

Our neighbours wont have any power either, as they are upgrading the power cables to our houses...They were up and down the poles like wippersnappers changing all the cables about 10yrs ago aswel, so Im amazed they need changing again already. But good idea

Sorry for all the editing to my posts.

 

[Phil2008]

If the power will be out because they're performing planned maintenance to the supply it can't be for very long. If it was they'd need to provide some temporary alternative.

Yeah its off for 1 working day, 9-5 on the 7th of next month... But to be honest its not my fish tank its my sisters, so its up to her really. But if the ups battery runtime is rubbish on the fish tank, I might suggest renting a generator and running the ups off that as voltages from generators can spike up and down, so the ups hopefully will do its job and smooth out the spiky power

But like I might buy a generator myself at a later date for long power cuts to be connected to the ups. With being in a wheelchair I'll need on with a easy or battery start as I have got no speed in my arm to pull the cord to start the engine.

 

[Phil2008]

Its a marine tank, yes my sister had to be difficult.lol. So its not just the fish, its the live corrals too. But yeah its a 5ft tank so hopefully the heater wont need to come on much with the tank being big and if the room is nice and warm over 20c, that shold help matters too.

 

[Phil2008]

What about the lighting?

I think the lighting is fine, the corrals will just go to sleep. Thats about another 120watts even though they are led lights. A generator would be the only way to go if everything needed to run

 

[Phil2008]

Well guys I have only tested the ups on the tank, like for 5mins, so that was totally pointless. But the mins remaining time without heater said 188mins and 27mins with heater running, but the heater turned off again within 3-4mins, so I dont know how long it will run for. But then I noticed it saying 188mins with nothing connected to the ups, so the ups can only calculate up to 188mins Im guessing? So fishtank could last longer then 188mins if it was just the filter pumps running..

Now my pc stuff...... First of all how much power it pulls from the mains without anything connected to it

old ups.... 25watts
new ups...online mode 40 - 50watts
eco mode 24-25watts
So not bad power usage and thats with the batteries charged
.........................................................................................
PC Stuff runtime

PC on standby with 2 routers running (about 30watts)
old ups....... 90mins
new ups......188mins (but maybe longer)

Using PC on the net (about 140watts)
old ups........10min
new ups.......60-80mins
..........................................................................................

So not a bad upgrade for me anyway, but sister wasn't that impressed, but people that dont know about UPS's thinks they are just a battery backup and nothing more.

So yeah the only 2 negative things so far are with the fan noise (it runs stupidly cool though) and the screen because it stays lit up, plus the runtime for the fishtank, but I knew that wasnt going to be good with the heater running.

I can change between eco and online modes on the fly, so I might only use online mode during bad weather and eco the rest on the time.

 

[Phil2008]

Here's a few pics of the ups,its almost as big as my pc. Everything you see on my desk is connected to it (Sorry about the mess)... Im 3d printing a cover for the ups screen as its way too bright at night. With the pc, 2 routers and 3d printer running it say 35-80mins, but as the 3d printer heaters are constantly on/off, it cant work out the runtime properly.

 

[Phil2008]

The ups had flicked over from eco to online mode on its own,,, I thought how odd, but then I realized the output voltage is set to 230 not 240. So when the input voltage went up to 242v, it flicked over to online mode to use the inverter so to get the output volts down to 230v..

Im guessing it will flick back over to eco mode once the voltage drops below 240 or something like that. I will change the output voltage to 240, but Im interested to see at what voltage it will flick back to eco mode. I think its something like 12volt difference either way.

 

[Phil2008]

Well guys its just dropped down to 236v and its flicked back to eco mode.... and a few mins later it flicked back on to online mode as the volts came back up to 242v.

Thats quite handy it changes between the 2 modes on its own, so I dont have todo it manually during bad weather. cool

Apparently the uk voltage was changed from 240 to 230 in March 1993. .. At the moment the input voltage on the ups says 243 and the reading on the ups has been round about the 240volt since getting the ups a few days ago. So either the ups is wrong or this country is still at 240?

 

[Phil2008]

So yeah guys I am very impressed with this ups so far and if Im not using the pc but turn on with monitor on standby, it will last 1hr 40min, with the old ups only lasting 20min.

The only problem are the dam fans, If I change them I void the warranty so the customer support said, if not I will either get use to them or they will drive me mad for 2yrs until the warranty runs out. But the customer support person did say they are 12v fans, so Im thinking some good old "Noctua fans" will do the job if they are 80mm and I think they are.

Also the supplier where I got the ups from, is going to see if he can get me a replacement front grill, or if not he's going to arrange it to be sent back for a replacement. So thats good of him

 

[Phil2008]

UPS itself needs power to keep running.
And like I said higher output rated UPSes have beefier circuitry consuming more than smaller ones, just like in PSUs.
There are UPSes with additional external battery module which have best operating times.
Because they allow increasing battery capacity without increasing power consumption of UPS itself.

Yeah I was thinking that it probably needs some power for its self, Im guessing its the inverter thats the powerhog mainly?

I could have bought the same ups with the external battery connector for about £20 more, but the battery pack box cost as much as the ups, for some crazy reason, as its a empty box. But I did think I could hook the batteries up without the box. But I guess its a tad too late now though, but I might see if he will let me have the more expensive one, if I have to return this ups for a replacement.

Problem in changing fans is making sure cooling stays good enough.
Also there can be fan speed monitoring with minimum fan speed or error is triggered.

I am hoping there will be some info about the airflow of the fans online, then I will try and match the new fan's with the closest airflow as poss while keeping things quiet. Or thats the idea. Someone did change the fans in a powerwalker ups and it kept shuting off, but he did solve the problem.

I hope its not cramped inside, but the customer support guy said the batteries and the electronics are separate from each other, a divide down the middle.. So fingers crossed, it wont be too bad inside.

My mate is comming to give me a hand with it next week, as I havent very steady hands todo it myself.

 

[Phil2008]

I think I can hear more motor noise then wind noise and if thats the case, I might be able todo somthing about it. Plus its made in china even though its a german ups, so hopefully the fans are cheap and nasty.

But yeah there's a good amount of air thats being sucked out of the ups and thats on low speed, So replacing of the fans might not quiet things down with the same airflow, but its worth a go. No doubt I will have trouble with the UPS not liking the replacement fans. So the key is dont get real low rpm fans then?

I really hope the fans are not 80mm in size, but I think they are though

 

[Phil2008]

You mean the fan grill guards? Yeah Im thinking the finger guards might be causing noise aswel, because its sucking a lot of air out, much more then my pc is doing. They look like 80mm fans to me, I would look but I would have to turn everything off as the cables are not long enough to pull the ups out.

Im guessing that half where the fan are is the electronics side and the other half contains the 4 batteries.