Vcore? And other overclocking questions?

[keogh]

Howdy,

Firstly I am a complete newbie when it comes to overclocking, and I have never really looked into it cos I didn't want to run the risk of screwing my machine up.

Firstly, before I continue, the spec of my PC is (the bits I feel you need to know anyway):

ASUS A8N-SLi Premium [w/ Zalman ZM-NB47J Northbridge Cooler]
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 4400+ [w/ Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 Pro]
Corsair 2GB DDR XMS3200 Twinx
BFG Geforce 7800 GTX OC [With Zalman VF700-CU]
Hiper HPU-4K580-MK Type-R 580W ATX2.2 PSU

I went into my BIOS earlier to check something completely non overclocking related and come across an option called "JumperFree Configuration" (I think that was what it was called? And in there I saw several options.

So I decided to have a fiddle in here slightly. The first option was "Overclock Profile" which I set to "AI Overclock". This enabled the "Overclock Options" selection, and I had 4 options in here:

Overclock 3%
Overclock 5%
Overclock 8%
Overclock 10%

I started on 3% and booted to windows to check my temps, then I did 5% and done the same, and finally set it to 8% where I have it now. I tried running a game (HL2 was the first game I came to) and saw what temps I got after this.

When just in my desktop without playing games, the CPU sits at 40c/41c, and after playing HL2 for a bit, it jumped upto 50c/51c max from what I could see. Are these temps ok?

I also saw a lot of talk about the vcore and the temp on here somewhere? What does this mean? I've taken a screenie of my PC Probe, do these values look ok?

Could anyone give me somepointers on what I should and shouldn;t do here judging by the above? I don;t want to toast the machine?

Any help at all will be appreciated... bearing in mind I have no clue about this

Thanks!

Steve M

 

[keogh]

Anyone? I'd at least just like to know if them stats above are ok?.. Before it blows up

and a very brief explanation on how vcore works and what it is would be cool

 

[4T5]

Well it's early for me but i can say the temps are fine.
Always best to clock manually though as you will get better results.
Read more sticky etc and post back with relevant questions.

 

[spb251272]

Those settings look fine, although you may be better reading up a bit and manually setting the overclock. Just for reference, I had an X2 3800 at 2.5 on 1.55 vcore, with temps of about 50c under load. If you want to check it's ok, run orthos for at least 8 hours. If temps are ok and it doesn't give any errors, you're ok

 

[keogh]

Cheers lads, I'm gonna read Jokesters beginners guide later on and beef up my knowledge abit!

After a few tweaks etc I'll post back here and see what your verdicts are on my new stats.

Thanks!

 

[keogh]

Ok I am starting to understand things much better know and how it all works. After using Jokesters post and severalother posts on here.

One question I have is, at what CPU temp do you think I should kick my Artic Freezer 64 into full RPM? I've got it set to 72c at the mo? I was thing bout setting it lower (using QFan)?

I ran SP2004 and the temp gradually went up, and once it reached 53c I set my QFan to kick in at 51c and I saw the temp gradually go down.... so the freezer does work!

Any ideas what temp I should kick it in at? Or what you have yours set to?

 

[Defcon5]

USe orthos, sp2004 will only stress 1 core, you want them both running full tilt to check stability.

I have my freezer pro on 100 all the time, its not exactly loud, (by the time your mobo reads the temp as 72 your cpu will have melted throught the back of your case). Bear in mind, (in my experience) the 64 cant really cope with a heavily clocked x2

Dont use AI oc, do it manually, you will see far better gains, i doubt you'd even notice 10%

You have some nice low latency ram, so keep the frequencies low and the timings tight, go for 2-2-2-5 1T 200

 

[keogh]

USe orthos, sp2004 will only stress 1 core, you want them both running full tilt to check stability.

I have my freezer pro on 100 all the time, its not exactly loud, (by the time your mobo reads the temp as 72 your cpu will have melted throught the back of your case). Bear in mind, (in my experience) the 64 cant really cope with a heavily clocked x2

Dont use AI oc, do it manually, you will see far better gains, i doubt you'd even notice 10%

You have some nice low latency ram, so keep the frequencies low and the timings tight, go for 2-2-2-5 1T 200

Nice one defcon, Ill change my freezer to work pretty much all the time. Also thanks for mention the Orthos edition of SP2004, I didn't have a clue it existed.

With regards to the RAM... I still don;t understand what the 2-2-2-5 1T 200 stuff means or how I change it? I tried reading the RAM FAQ on the Memory forum but it confused the hell out of me? Can you tell me what this means? Or more importantly how and where I change it, I can then check that up with my mobo manual and I will understand it then?

thanks!

EDIT: I've set my freezer to kick in to full speed when my CPU temp reaches 54c. I don't game that often and spend most my time in windows working (I work from home) so I don't really need the fan at full speed all the time. So at 54 onwards it will boot up which should be ok right?

 

[keogh]

Just incase this makes any difference, CPU-Z says the below for me:

All those number options for the RAM... I really haven't a clue how I would change those, cos the only RAM change option I have in my BIOS is "DDR Voltage" which I am going to set to 2.75v when I reboot... as thats what corsair say on their site?

 

[spb251272]

Look for the Jumperfree Settings options - I think they are in there. If not, have a search around - you're looking for memory timings or dram timings. Setting to tighter (lower) timings will make your system run a bit faster

 

[keogh]

Ok I found it, it was in DRAM Configuration, but there are tons of settings in there and I don't know what ones match up to get 2-2-2-5 1T 200

I wrote down the values of all the options:

Memclock (mhz): 400
CAS Latency (tcl): 3
Min RAS active time (Tras): 8T
RAS to CAS delay (Trcd): 3T
Row percentage time (Trp): 3T
Row cycle time (Trc): 12T
Row refresh cyc time (Trfc): 24T
Read to write time (trwt): 2T
Write recovery time (Twr): Auto
1T/2T Memory Timing: 2T
S/W DRAM Over 4GB Remapping: Enabled

UPDATE: I just tried changing values to: CAS: 2 | tRCD: 2T | 1T/2T Mem Timing: 1T and upon rebooting my PC froze on the ASUS (press Del to Enter Setup screen). So it obviously didn't like that? I changed those values cos the Memory guide on the memory forum suggested changing those values down... so I did

Also this overclocking manually doesn't seem to work for me?

I just went in and set things to:

FSB: 225mhz
CPU Multiplier: 11x
VCore: Auto
HTT: 3x

And I set all my DRAM settings to the settings above.

When I boot, I went into the BIOS again to see the clock speed and it had gone up, so exited to boot to windows and I get a boot fail all the time, and telling me to go back to the BIOS and set it to default.

I tried several over things and it don't seem to want to boot?

I followed Jokesters Beginners guide, but it says set things to their default stock value, but that is all on Auto at the moment... so I don;t know what the stock value is?

I just can't figure out how to clock it up and get into windows? I must be missing sumin, cos the AI Overclock gets me in... so it must be changing something somewhere else I don't know about?

I'd love any help wiith this, cos I wanna overclock

 

[keogh]

Anybody? I'm getting desperate here

At least, does:

2-2-2-5 1T 200

mean

CAS-tRAS-tRCD-tRP CMD Memclock

Although 200 is listed above, my BIOS shows its as 400mhz... I think thats right anyway?

If anyone could relist all my BIOS settings above with the changes I would need to make to get the 2-2-2-5 1T 200 ram timings that would be great. Also what DDR Voltage should I go for? 2.75? I'll then reboot and see if it crashes again?

Then I can move onto clocking my CPU... and hopefully after rebooting I will be able to get into Windows without a boot failure. Everything I'm doing so far is causing me crashes, so I need help on learning this stuff.

Thanks and sorry for the constant posting, but its the only way I can learn

 

[Defcon5]

Yes thats right.

Stick the ram on 2.9v and try again, if not, use 2-3-2-5. If that doesnt work use 2-3-3-6 and so on. Just dont lose the command rate of 1T

Google your rams part number and see what other people have been able to acheive

400mhz is the DDR of your 200mhz base clock, you will need to divide this down when clocking the cpu.

Have fun!

 

[keogh]

Cheers defcon, I got it to 2-3-2-5 1T 200 in the end. I cannot get tRCD to 2, it crashes my PC everytime... although I'm running DDR voltage at 2.75.. so maybe uping that to 2.9 might help? I'll give it ago.

But overall 2-3-2-5 1T 200 is ok right?

ta

 

[Mattus]

There won't be much difference, but if you could get it to 2 by changing the voltage it's free performance, so why not

Also, cardinal rule of overclocking: only test one thing at a time (eg. dont try both new CPU and RAM settings in one go.) Otherwise you don't know why it cocked up!

 

[Defcon5]

But overall 2-3-2-5 1T 200 is ok right?

ta

Yeah thats fine. Depending on how well your cpu clocks, you may not be able to run the ram at 200, (your dividers may not be able to hit that, they may only be able to give you 185 or 215) but if thats the case, use the 215 and just get the timings as low as you can from there

You can play around with different HTT and multi combinations to get 200 on a divider but do not lose any cpu speed in favour of memory, its not worth it

 

[keogh]

Still not sure what this dividers is, cos so many mobos call it diff things? Is my divider "Memclock (mhz): 400" which I have set at 400. Is my mobo calling it 400 cos its doing the maths for me (if that makes sense)? Or should it be set to 200, cos thats in the option?

So to get the max from my cpu, I have to get the FSB as high as I can til its unstable/not booting, then lower the divider? I am a bit confused on how to get this part sorted... I'm still to find a guide that puts everything in lamen terms... cos I haven't a clue, but I'm learning

Any pointers on this Divider/FSB thing will be appreciated!

 

[Defcon5]

Your memory will only be able to run at less than say 220mhz (440mhz effective), so if your HTT (FSB) is above 220 your ram will not be able to cope and your system will not boot.

The way round this is to use a ram divider, wherby your ram runs at a percentage speed of your HTT (FSB)

In your bios options, you have 400, 333, 200 etc. These are the ram dividers.

So if your HTT was at 200, using the 400 divider your ram will be at 400, but use the 333 divider and your ram will be at 333mhz (effective)

The 400 divider is known as 1:1 as for every HTT mhz, there is a ram mhz.
The 200 divider for example it known as 2:1, as for every HTT mhx there is 0.5 ram mhz.

Say your cpu could run at 3ghz, using 300x10. If you had DDR600 ram you would be able to run 1:1 (your 400 divider) but as your rams max speed is 200 (DDR400) you need to use the 3:2 divider to make sure your ram speed is still at 200mhz (400 effective)

There is not performace loss in dividing the memory as it is divided down even when 1:1, and a64s get a better performance boost from using low latencies than high frequencies anyway

 

[keogh]

ok, so that means that to get more from my cpu i need to lower the divider to cope with it. but obviously there is a point where id be going to low with the ram to make it worth while.

So in my case, i have the FSB at 220mhz and the Divider at 400mhz. If I set the Divider to 333mhz I shpuld be able to up my FSB? Is that correct?

But how would you know what point to stop lowering the Divider? I would assume not to go lower than 333mhz? Or am I wrong?

Also, I have had conflicting advice about the Hyper Transport Frequncy? 3x or 4x? I don;t know who to belive?

Thanks for your help so far, appreciated!

 

[Defcon5]

ok, so that means that to get more from my cpu i need to lower the divider to cope with it. but obviously there is a point where id be going to low with the ram to make it worth while.

The higher your HTT, the bigger the ram divider

So in my case, i have the FSB at 220mhz and the Divider at 400mhz. If I set the Divider to 333mhz I shpuld be able to up my FSB? Is that correct?

Yes, as your ram will no longer be limiting your oc

But how would you know what point to stop lowering the Divider? I would assume not to go lower than 333mhz? Or am I wrong?

Every time your ram gets to above 210mhz(420 effective) use the next divider down, given your high multi 333 might be fine

Also, I have had conflicting advice about the Hyper Transport Frequncy? 3x or 4x? I don;t know who to belive?

HTT bus will knacker at above 1000 (stock 200x5) so use whichever multi you need to keep it below 1000

Thanks for your help so far, appreciated!

No problem! Glad to see someone who hasnt written off skt939!