Wait for Bulldozer or upgrade to Sandybridge?

[Final8y]

from a technological standpoint it was, its behind the current leader, with regards to performance, heat and power usage.

Which is a fail

BD could easily be a "win" though, We just have to wait and see

So hypothetically speaking if BD won on performance, heat and power usage would that make SB a failure? I don't think so, its only fail if its goal was to beat in performance, heat and power usage & only in that narrow regard.

Now fail because its just rubbish regardless is a different argument.

 

[wannabedamned]

I suppose its more old tech vs new tech rather than outright failure. With regards to the 3 points I made the chip does fail, But more the meme fail rather than being an outright failure.

The AMD phenom 2 is 2009 tech, the Sandybridges 2011 tech. It's only natural its no longer upto standard.

 

[Martini1991]

comon now, before Sandybridge came out the Phenoms had the best price/performance ratio,

Agena, not Deneb.
And Deneb was only on par with Core 2, despite it coming out after Nehalem.

 

[Martini1991]

So hypothetically speaking if BD won on performance, heat and power usage would that make SB a failure? I don't think so, its only fail if its goal was to beat in performance, heat and power usage & only in that narrow regard.

Now fail because its just rubbish regardless is a different argument.

Deneb came out 4 months after Nehalem..... And was only as fast as Core 2.
Phenom could denote Agena, which WAS a failure.

 

[Final8y]

Deneb came out 4 months after Nehalem..... And was only as fast as Core 2.
Phenom could denote Agena, which WAS a failure.

Your missing the context & its very important that you take full consideration of the quote i was replying to & that specific aspect.

I said nothing of Phenom.

 

[Martini1991]

Your missing the context & its very important that you take full consideration of the quote i was replying to & that specific aspect.

I said nothing of Phenom.

People should say code name. As Phenom to many means Agena, or Deneb to others
I quoting your post, as you were talking about "failure". Deneb came out after Nehealm and was worse, that's different than if BD spanks SB, as SB never failed.

 

[Final8y]

People should say code name. As Phenom to many means Agena, or Deneb to others

I thought you knew that BD stood for Bulldozer.

 

[Martini1991]

I thought you knew that BD stood for Bulldozer.

Oh dear.....

 

[Final8y]

Oh dear.....

And why the sarcasm ?

 

[Final8y]

People should say code name. As Phenom to many means Agena, or Deneb to others
I quoting your post, as you were talking about "failure". Deneb came out after Nehealm and was worse, that's different than if BD spanks SB, as SB never failed.

Again My post said nothing of Deneb & the quote i was replying to means what i quoted from wannabedamned & not you quoting me.

And is clear from what i was saying about Losing out on performance,heat & power does not automatically make something a failure because there are many other aspects to considerer.

 

[gambitt]

This is probably a "how longs a piece of string" question but would we expect to see significant Llano price drops when Bulldozer is released? It's too high for a budget setup at the moment imo and I want an unlocked Llano (A8-3870) but if they don't drop the prices then I might as well get BD.

 

[wannabedamned]

And is clear from what i was saying about Losing out on performance,heat & power does not automatically make something a failure because there are many other aspects to considerer.

...and yet it does with regards to the 3 aspects i was talking about...The main ones

 

[Final8y]

...and yet it does with regards to the 3 aspects i was talking about...The main ones

So again if BD beats SB on those 3 aspects then SB becomes a failure ?

And you know that the makers goal is to beat on all 3 aspects to begin with ?

 

[Martini1991]

This is probably a "how longs a piece of string" question but would we expect to see significant Llano price drops when Bulldozer is released? It's too high for a budget setup at the moment imo and I want an unlocked Llano (A8-3870) but if they don't drop the prices then I might as well get BD.

I'm interested in it too.
As far as an improvement in IGP it is, it's stupid expensive and needs faster RAM to be faster.

 

[Martini1991]

So again if BD beats SB on those 3 aspects then SB becomes a failure ?

And you know that the makers goal is to beat on all 3 aspects to begin with ?

No, because BD was released afterwards, it just means BD was successful. BD may win on power consumption when comparing the 4 core to the 4 core SB, due to it modular design imo.

 

[wannabedamned]

So again if BD beats SB on those 3 aspects then SB becomes a failure ?

And you know that the makers goal is to beat on all 3 aspects to begin with ?

Phenom II vs Sandybridge

Heat - Phenom II fails
Power usage - Phenom II Fails
Performance - Phenom II Fails

Regardless of AMD's original intention of where the processors would hit the market, In general terms when competing with the competitor it loses in those areas(Fail)

--

Now if we put the whole thing on its head, and do BD vs Sandybridge, the same WOULD apply, as the goal posts would move. As they always do. Now if intel release new processors on 1155 that still put bulldozer to shame, then....That would be an Epic fail on AMD's part

 

[Final8y]

No, because BD was released afterwards, it just means BD was successful. BD may win on power consumption when comparing the 4 core to the 4 core SB, due to it modular design imo.

First & foremost its down to the intent of the maker to what goals they are trying to reach in any aspect & as long an they reach them then its a success in what they were trying to achieve.

What you want personally for something to be a success can be completely different.

Also your other point is exactly what i was saying, its not as simple as saying performance, heat & power because you just said No because BD was released afterwards which means other aspects,factors has to be taken into consideration & you just did.

 

[Final8y]

Phenom II vs Sandybridge

Heat - Phenom II fails
Power usage - Phenom II Fails
Performance - Phenom II Fails

Regardless of AMD's original intention of where the processors would hit the market, In general terms when competing with the competitor it loses in those areas(Fail)

And again i didn't say anything in regards to that because we already know.

And that's why i said BD SD, in future i will edit your quotes beforehand seeing as your finding its difficult to what part im specifically taking about.
--

Now if we put the whole thing on its head, and do BD vs Sandybridge, the same WOULD apply, as the goal posts would move. As they always do. Now if intel release new processors on 1155 that still put bulldozer to shame, then....That would be an Epic fail on AMD's part

What your failing to grasp my point is just basing failure on 3 aspects without taking other things into consideration without knowing intent does not make a CPU failure hence again my point about the SB would never be considered failure no matter what because of many other aspects & factors.

What you consider fail is based on your own personal aspects & criteria.

 

[Final8y]

MacDonald's is fail to me in comparison to BurgerKing when it comes to Quality & Portions but MacDonald's is not even trying to win on those aspects.

 

[wannabedamned]

See my original post, I said it failed with regards to the 3 aspects. I'm not wrong in saying that. Regardless of the other factors involved, i wasnt even going into that.

If AMD wanted to try and corner the budget market then fair game to them. But I wasnt really interested in discussing those aspects. As far as I'm aware when people are looking at BD they're wanting the 3 things I mentioned, which is why those are the 3 i brought up, with regards to the phenom II and SB

No one is wanting BD to be another processor thats not direct competition, but good in other areas... they want something to knock intel off their purch. As do I!