What defines a 'big club' and how well would Scottish teams do in the Premier League?

[McBain]

That statement alone shows you haven't got a clue. He wasn't a great player, he wasn't even a good player. Don't even get me started on how poor Rangers are at the moment, it's laughable.

Celtic are a massive club and would do fairly well in England, they're also probably better supported world wide than any English club apart from Man Utd and Liverpool.

Also, Man City didn't manage to beat us last season.

Captain of the national side, Scottish writers player of the year and Scottish PFA players player of the year of the transfer to us. He absolutely was the poster boy for Scottish football.

As for how good he was, I don't disagree, if you actually bothered to read the thread you'd see I thought he was garbage.

 

[HangTime]

Big club for me means some combination of the following (at least two):
-Large attendances / fanbase
-Historical success (major trophies)
-Recent success
-Spending power
-Elite human resources (usually related to one or both of the above)

As for Scottish clubs I'd like to see them in the Championship which would give them the opportunity to prove their worth in a short space of time. However that would be a bit unfair on other English teams.

 

[Illgresi]

Strangely enough I signed up to a Doncaster Rovers forum (I was looking for information about the Aberdeen vs Doncaster friendly) the other day specifically to answer the second question. This is a direct copy of what I posted:

...it's difficult to say with any certainty of course but I'd rate the teams as following:

Celtic - Lower EPL, they're better than the perennial yoyo teams such as Hull, but not quite at the level to push into the top half imo.
Aberdeen - Top half Championship, pushing for playoffs (assuming we get the manager's top transfer targets that is i.e. Maloney).
Rangers - Hard to say given they basically have a half a new team of foreigners, and a manager who so far seems like a special new breed of puddle drinker. Based on last season though, I'd say they rode their luck massively, and finished far above where their talent merits, so I'd say lower Championship, flirting with relegation.
St. Johnstone - Epitomise the phrase agricultural football. Very well organised and physical, which would suit the lower leagues down there albeit without the pace and technique to thrive in the championship. I'd say upper bottom half of the Championship, but still constantly in danger of relegation.
Hearts - Were a solid if unspectacular team under Neilson, but Cathro struggled to get them to perform. They've certainly made some intriguing signings, especially Berra, and if Cathro can get his ideas across I think they'll be strong again. On that basis I'd place them mid-table Championship.
Partick Thistle, Ross County, and Kilmarnock - All roughly upper half League One.
Motherwell, and Dundee - Lower half League One.
Hamilton - Upper League Two
Hibernian - Just promoted, but they have a solid team, and a decent manager (albeit a complete bawbag). I'd say Championship relegation/League One winners ish.

Edit: Of course, that's with current squads, it would be a different picture with the money available down there.

 

[opethdisciple]

What defines a big club?

Competitiveness and consistency over decades first and foremost. This is measured in terms of domestic and also European competitiveness.

Then net worth.

 

[mburn_83]

To me a big club is one that beats the opponents in front of it - Celtic is the biggest Scottish club, but I doubt they could compete with EPL teams over a season - but are close enough to give a match over a cup tie.

 

[Nemeses]

It's much harder to dominate in the prem now, than at any other time in the past, and certainly way harder than dominatinng in any other league

Take Spain, they only really got two big teams, and them maybe at the very most 3 others pushing, the rest just get hammered 3-0 +, and when one of them do win it's looked on as a huge upset.

In the prem almost any team can win lose in any given match, it is by far and away the most competitive league.

Arsenal certainly have done enough, have enough to be a big team, it's definitely one of the things that AW did for arsenal, he took them from a big English club to a huge world wide club, and that's no mean feat.

For my money big worldwide clubs in the EPL
Man Utd
Liverpool
Arsenal
-------
Then coming close due to huge money spent
Chelsea (no history zero class club)
Man City (spends mineboggling sums that always seem to avoid FFP)
Then we have the big English clubs
Spuds
Everton
Etc etc

No Scottish team of right now would win the EFL championship in this country,forget about the prem.

Most Scottish teams I think would be lucky to survive the EPL league one.

And this is not a baised view, just one that imo is honest, most people commenting here do it with biases to one side or the other.

The Scottish league is very weak right now, weaker than it has ever been (thanks in no small part to what happened to rangers, handled sooo badly) in a decades.

(To be clear if I had to choose a Scottish side to support it would most likely be Celitic and never Rangers, due to their disgusting supporters, and yes I have seen it first hand, no ones innocent here but boy theirs was the worst I have ever seen, and I have seen Russian supporters)

This is on the iPad, so all grammar failings is due it it

 

[Illgresi]

No Scottish team of right now would win the EFL championship in this country,forget about the prem.

Most Scottish teams I think would be lucky to survive the EPL league one.

And this is not a baised view, just one that imo is honest, most people commenting here do it with biases to one side or the other.

The Scottish league is very weak right now, weaker than it has ever been (thanks in no small part to what happened to rangers, handled sooo badly) in a decades.

(To be clear if I had to choose a Scottish side to support it would most likely be Celitic and never Rangers, due to their disgusting supporters, and yes I have seen it first hand, no ones innocent here but boy theirs was the worst I have ever seen, and I have seen Russian supporters)

This is on the iPad, so all grammar failings is due it it

Celtic would stroll the English Championship, and Aberdeen would be right up there fighting for promotion as well. There's certainly a difference in style between the countries, the lower leagues in England are far more physique based, whereas the Scottish Prem is work ethic and very tactical. The teams at the top end have no shortage of technique either, and most teams try to pass the ball out from the back these days.

The Scottish league certainly isn't particularly weak right now. It's a much higher standard, generally, than say a decade ago when Aberdeen last made it to the Europa League group stages. There are only at most two players from that Aberdeen team I'd have in the current Aberdeen squad.

The standard of the league has nothing to do with Rangers anyway, although I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment of their fans.

 

[Nemeses]

Th

Celtic would stroll the English Championship, and Aberdeen would be right up there fighting for promotion as well. There's certainly a difference in style between the countries, the lower leagues in England are far more physique based, whereas the Scottish Prem is work ethic and very tactical. The teams at the top end have no shortage of technique either, and most teams try to pass the ball out from the back these days.

The Scottish league certainly isn't particularly weak right now. It's a much higher standard, generally, than say a decade ago when Aberdeen last made it to the Europa League group stages. There are only at most two players from that Aberdeen team I'd have in the current Aberdeen squad.

The standard of the league has nothing to do with Rangers anyway, although I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment of their fans.

there is zero competition, which will every single time make it a weaker league, a win by 30 points does not indicate a strong league it's a sure sign of a weak league.

 

[Illgresi]

Th

there is zero competition, which will every single time make it a weaker league, a win by 30 points does not indicate a strong league it's a sure sign of a weak league.

In fairness, Celtic strolled it last season, but the two seasons before that we were right up with them until the last month. Outside that, it's as competitive a league as any I've ever seen. Aberdeen were comfortably second best last season yet still Hamilton beat us twice. Rangers finished far above where their ability merited, because it's a league where virtually anyone can beat anyone (except Celtic apparently).

 

[Nemeses]

In fairness, Celtic strolled it last season, but the two seasons before that we were right up with them until the last month. Outside that, it's as competitive a league as any I've ever seen. Aberdeen were comfortably second best last season yet still Hamilton beat us twice. Rangers finished far above where their ability merited, because it's a league where virtually anyone can beat anyone (except Celtic apparently).

Well sorry m8 then you not seen many, but people me included will always only see the best in what you like/support

 

[Illgresi]

Well sorry m8 then you not seen many, but people me included will always only see the best in what you like/support

I'm confident in predicting I've seen a lot more English football than you have seen Scottish. I'll make another prediction, that your opinion of Scottish football is based on pre-conceived prejudice rather than even a subjective opinion, let alone something quantifiable or backed up by facts and statistics.

 

[Nemeses]

I'm confident in predicting I've seen a lot more English football than you have seen Scottish. I'll make another prediction, that your opinion of Scottish football is based on pre-conceived prejudice rather than even a subjective opinion, let alone something quantifiable or backed up by facts and statistics.

Mmm this is going bit off track now, but don't see why you think I have something against Scottish football, or is it anyone that holds a different opinion must have some issue.

For the record I have zero issue prejudice or anything against Scottish football, in fact the very idea of having anything against any football league, sounds a bit silly tbh.

I'm just calling it as I see it, there is zero real competitions, no real money going in, think if it was a league that was exciting, people like sky would have inversted in it, but they did not. And it's not exciting because it not competitive in the least, did Rangers just not lose recently to a team of part timers

 

[Evo8]

Ththere is zero competition, which will every single time make it a weaker league, a win by 30 points does not indicate a strong league it's a sure sign of a weak league.

So the French league is a weak league? PSG won the season before last by 31 points.

Sky have invested in Scottish football, there's games on regularly.

Rangers lost to a part time team because they're woeful. I'm interested why you think the Rangers thing was handled so badly?

 

[Nemeses]

So the French league is a weak league? PSG won the season before last by 31 points.

Sky have invested in Scottish football, there's games on regularly.

Rangers lost to a part time team because they're woeful. I'm interested why you think the Rangers thing was handled so badly?

Er yes compared to the prem the french league is a weaker, although not as weak as the Scottish one. there is way more investment going in, until rangers get up to speed which may take 5 more years if not longer there will always unless there is a blip be only 1 league winner in Scotland, you can not say that about the German, French, Italian, English, or even the Greek league

Rangers and Celtic were the only two big teams, they kind of made the Scottish league way more Competitive, I fully understand that ranger, or more to the point the owner should have brought to task. But by pushing them into the 3rd (Irn-bru), division not only punished Rangers, it punished the entire league, never mind the most important people here the supporters.

Though Green should never have been allowed to do what he did, but in a league where you only have 2 big teams, to remove one was madness, it was more 25 of the 30 voting chairman all saw their clubs one spot up. and not as per normal not looking at the bigger picture that it would effect the entire league, money would dry up, less investment, less interest in the league outside Scotland, how can that be good for anyone. They should have suspended him and all his cronies, made them sell the club, maybe giving it a 2/3 year 20 points a season punishment, but kept it in the league.

At times the greater good is bigger than one club.

As to the Scottish league and the ongoing discussion, not gonna say a lot more on that as it would seem people are taking it personally.

 

[4K8KW10]

certainly agree with u there, city are on of the few clubs who literally and unequivocally a disgrace to football and sum up anything and everything that is wrong with the game nowadays.

Haters make us famous lol is an appropriate quote in response for this nonsensical opinion.

Could you please explain what is to be hated about Manchester City?

 

[Evo8]

They should have suspended him and all his cronies, made them sell the club, maybe giving it a 2/3 year 20 points a season punishment, but kept it in the league.

But it's a whole new club, the club was liquidated. You can't just start up a whole new club and just go back into the Premiership. That's like saying if Celtic went to England they'd go straight into the EPL. No club would accept that.