What if God evolved?

ben_j_davis · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:43

I've been recently reading Richard Dawkins 'God Delusion' and why I consider it a good book so far; I have suddenly stopped reading about 1/3 of the way through.

Dakwins book tries to disprove the existence of God(s)/Intelligent Design.
Incredibly complex things such as a human eye or a wing can be (and was) created by evolution/natural selection. I suddenly realized therefore God(s)/Higher beings theoretically could have been created/may be created by the same process. We no nothing of what happened before the big bang and therefore such a set of life forms(?) Could have had a vast amount of time to evolve into what many people in the world consider God.

Now before everyone starts ranting I'm not in the slightest bit religious and consider myself an Atheist, however this question has thrown me slightly.

What does everyone else think?

Edit: BTW I'm using the definition of God as a creator, not some all seeing all knowing infinitely powerful being.

Mat · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:45

Read the rest of the book, you might find out who dunnit!

AJUK · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:48

I was considering getting the God Delusion on audio book the other day.

Gilly · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:49

How could the supreme being evolve?

I, personally, think a more pertinent question would be 'what if God existed?' but thats just me

robmiller · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:51

He wouldn't be god if that was true, though :confused:

Helium_Junkie · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:55

Gilly said:
How could the supreme being evolve?

I, personally, think a more pertinent question would be 'what if God existed?' but thats just me

Perhaps it wasnt always supreme? Evolution made it that way.

Gilly · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:58

Helium_Junkie said:
Perhaps it wasnt always supreme? Evolution made it that way.

Suppose it depends on your definition of God. How could a being that didn't used to be supreme evolve to be so? My definition of God as the all-powerful creator wouldn't allow that. What is your definition that does?

Mat · 1 Dec 2006 at 09:59

Surely the fact that if the supreme being has evolved then by definition, there are higher powers at work (working on the supreme being) than those of the supreme being itself.

ben_j_davis · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:01

Gilly said:
How could the supreme being evolve?

I, personally, think a more pertinent question would be 'what if God existed?' but thats just me

Yeah i think the whole thing is absurd, but through a chunk of the book he kept arguing that evolution could create incredibly complex things that were so improbable that it was amazing they even existed, my problem is that technically a being could evolve into something incredibly powerful able to incredible things with matter.

ben_j_davis · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:04

Mat said:
Surely the fact that if the supreme being has evolved then by definition, there are higher powers at work (working on the supreme being) than those of the supreme being itself.

I don't think there is any higher power, evolution is just a process.

Gilly · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:10

ben_j_davis said:
...my problem is that technically a being could evolve into something incredibly powerful able to incredible things with matter.

I think we as humans have already managed to do incredible things. Lets face it, us of 5000 years ago would view us now as godlike beings.

Helium_Junkie · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:17

Gilly said:
Suppose it depends on your definition of God. How could a being that didn't used to be supreme evolve to be so? My definition of God as the all-powerful creator wouldn't allow that. What is your definition that does?

God could indeed be some kind of supreme being. But to me this means an alien being of immense power and ability (through evolution) - the ability to create life on a massive scale (we can already create life ourselves, whats to say in the future we wont, via technology and science, have the same abilities that God has?).

Jesus then was a creation of God, an attempt at a new version if you will, more powerful than the standard human model. Other "mythical" characters with extraordinary abilities could be the same, giving rise to my belief that many myths/legends of superhuman feats could indeed be very true - an alien 'creator' testing new ideas.

I don't believe God is still here, I think it moved on to a new project.

Alternatively, the immensely powerful being created life via technology, instead of natural ability, and when we looked like we would soon be able to detect our maker through our own understanding of science and technological advancements, it scarpered.

scaramanga182 · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:27

Gilly said:
I think we as humans have already managed to do incredible things. Lets face it, us of 5000 years ago would view us now as godlike beings.

5000 years, I'd probably say 150-300 years, imagine landing an Apche helicopter in the Nepolionc (SP) era, using a laptop or driving a car!

checjb · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:34

The OP rings a few bells with me. I had thoughts alonmg a similar vein a few years back. My meanderings were along the lines of:

Given that mankind will continue to evolve and may evolve more rapidly due our technological prowess, who is to say that we could not eventually get to the stage where we understand everything. This could be argued as being one definition of a god. With such powers we would be able to manipulate time and matter and so we (as gods) could actual travel back and create the basis of life on earth. Hnce we would become our own progenitors.

And before we get all the standard arguments about this being a time travel loop and therefore impossible, do you really think that at this stage we know everything and can utter such absolutes with complete certainty? That has been shown any number of times to be mankind's geatest arrogance.

Just my 2p.

C.

Mat · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:34

ben_j_davis said:
I don't think there is any higher power, evolution is just a process.

Regardless of what you call it, if its affecting what is supposed to be THE ultimate being then said being cant be as ultimate as we are lead to believe. The God vs evolution argument goes out the window if evolution is acting on God as well...

hendrix · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:44

checjb said:
The OP rings a few bells with me. I had thoughts alonmg a similar vein a few years back. My meanderings were along the lines of:

Given that mankind will continue to evolve and may evolve more rapidly due our technological prowess, who is to say that we could not eventually get to the stage where we understand everything. This could be argued as being one definition of a god. With such powers we would be able to manipulate time and matter and so we (as gods) could actual travel back and create the basis of life on earth. Hnce we would become our own progenitors.

And before we get all the standard arguments about this being a time travel loop and therefore impossible, do you really think that at this stage we know everything and can utter such absolutes with complete certainty? That has been shown any number of times to be mankind's geatest arrogance.

Just my 2p.

C.

The time travel thing was always a point of arguement at secondary school. "God exists, he went back in time and created himself" blah blah. I can't think of any reason to prove that God exists or does not exist. I just try and accept that I probably never will know. Sounds like an interesting read though, might ponder over reading it.

ben_j_davis · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:46

I guess it comes down to what we call God, if we think of some incredibly ancient and intelligent being or the one from the Bible.

Van_Dammesque · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:55

If god had/is evolving then the question remains why is there no proof what so ever of an evolved god? If god did evolve then there must be a race of gods and therefore merely a high intelligent race of beings. (To evolve you have to die!)

Helium_Junkie · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:55

Mat said:
The God vs evolution argument goes out the window if evolution is acting on God as well...

And why shouldnt it

Helium_Junkie · 1 Dec 2006 at 10:57

Van_Dammesque said:
If god had/is evolving then the question remains why is there no proof what so ever of an evolved god? If god did evolve then there must be a race of gods and therefore merely a high intelligent race of beings. (To evolve you have to die!)

Seeing as it/they have such extraodinary powers, it's reasonable to assume they could have moved to another area of the galaxy/universe.