Ah yes quite right!
What watch do you wear?
- Thread starter Doran
- Start date
Ah yes quite right!
The biggest issue I have with grand seiko is that they're still basically a seiko, albeit a higher quality one, and even though I like some of their watches, I just can't get past the fact that there could be qc issues with a watch that is now starting to hit rolex pricing....not to mention I can't honestly say I can see where the quite significant extra cost is coming from over the £1000ish seiko's with in some cases basically the same movement....
Yes reviews say everything is 'top tier' and they don't have issues etc but I've seen plenty of online posts which are showing the same issues you get on their consumer tier non grand seiko watches.
Grand Seiko costs are justified because every GS is hand made (movement) and the cases and every component is hand finished. There have been a number of GS videos posted in this thread and the watchmakers at the Micro Artist Studio at Seiko exclusively design and make GS watches with exceptional dedication to the craft, a skill that is passed down through years of training. Personally I value a GS higher than a Rolex which comes off a production line and is then QCd by a human.
I guess one aspect of GS is that because everything is done by hand, there are some natural imperfections which some like and others dislike. You get this with other high end brands from the Swiss too though.
Check this out:
I guess one aspect of GS is that because everything is done by hand, there are some natural imperfections which some like and others dislike. You get this with other high end brands from the Swiss too though.
Check this out:
Soldato
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Have to say I do like the grand seiko's. If I was spending that sort of money though, I'd probably buy an omega, iwc or jlc though.
Deleted User 298457
Deleted User 298457
I think this is an odd stance to take on the GS re: servicing but I also have that same niggle. They need servicing so infrequently in the grand (pun intended) scheme of things but that is one of the few things that puts me off. I will add a GS ********* to my collection one day, though.
Heard lots about Seiko QC issues on their normal range. Not a fan of the big X on the Prospex/rebranded Seikos from elsewhere as Prospex. Their prices are creeping very high as well.
This is the thing, my background is in product design, so I know all about realistic tolerances etc. Even with finishing being done by a person, I still don't see the 'finishing' on a GS as making the watch look/feel 3-4k more. I'm not doubting the Japanese dedication to 'perfection', that is something that is very 'Japanese'.
Now, don't get me wrong, I appreciate that hand finished/produced items take more time and should cost more but I'm not sure they're worth 'that much more' if you get me. Now if this was the Credor sub brand within Seiko then I can fully understand why it costs so much... most of the dial work is done by one person with a brush for example.
Soldato
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I think that's a common thing and I feel the same. If I am spending that kind of money, there are other brands that I'd turn to first. GS produce some absolutely amazing pieces though.
I have seen at least one Youtube video where someones Seiko was delayed in servicing. I agree they should not require servicing often however, how I would get the seals done every 10 years if taking into water.
I'm a bit spoilt with Rolex servicing, as I have a Rolex AD only 3 miles from my house. I just walk in the store with the Rolex, and they deal with everything else. So when I was criticising Seiko servicing I was comparing somewhat to this, that's a bit unfair of me given Seiko don't have many places you can take a watch to. But yes I do still like grand Seiko a lot, and don't rule out buying one at some point.
The problem with Rolex is the prices have just gone bonkers, to put in perspective.
In October 2018 I purchased a 42mm Explorer II pre-owned, full box and papers, with a new Rolex Service from a Rolex AD for £5450, that watch now is over £9000.
In 2000 I purchased my Rolex Sub Date pre-owned for £1600, again full set, new Rolex Service, again from local Rolex AD, that watch is now £10k+ as it's tritium dial / bezel and all original still. People don't think Rolex's were that cheap 20 years ago, but I have the sales recite I can post if no one believes me.
When I purchased these watches I never did it for them to increase, but putting into context how hard it is now to buy one compared to the past.
Then what makes it worse is unless you have any history with your local AD you struggle even buy a Rolex new any more.
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Soldato
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£205 customs fee to pay to FedEx for the Stowa
Looks liek this will be the last expensive watch I buy outside of the UK no thanks to those of you who voted leave.
Bloody hell, You're around the Portsmouth area aren't you? Could you not avoid those charges by having it delivered to a Post Office in France, then jump on a Ferry with your bike to pick it up. Should only be about £50 return.
Not serious I'm sure but if the delivery address was in France then German VAT would be charged at the point of sale which defeats the object of the exercise. There might also be complications bringing the watch through customs in the UK.
tbh, even with the stupid markup due to the artificial supply limitations and we all know rolex could knock out more if they wanted to, not to mention the AD wait list/keeping warranty cards etc, I still think rolex are overpriced, even at retail... imo you're paying for the brand more than the watch imo. Just think how good the fakes are getting for far far less outlay, some are supposedly so good that even some AD's struggle to tell them apart, and they cost a fraction of a real rolex.
I kind of feel the current pricing on rolex is a bit like most cryptocurrency.... far too high for what it actually is.
Besides if I was spending 'rolex money' on a watch I'd personally be looking at JLC (reverso and polaris), they just look nicer overall imo. At the end of day if someone wants to buy a rolex (and can jump through all the hoops etc), or any other brand, it's their choice and I wouldn't stop them if they were dead set on it, although if it was someone I was friends with I would play devils advocate and make sure they really know what they're doing lol.
Deleted User 298457
Deleted User 298457
Of course you are paying for the brand. That is the same for any
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Yeah the customs fee has been broken down as per previous posts and is in fact actually less than the cost of a new AAA game on STEAM so all has actually worked out just fine 
Too blingy. If we are talking El Primero then it has to be something professional looking and worthy of the name Zenith:
https://www.mappinandwebb.com/Zenit...7_1620075757_9ea387120c7bb15755f4c425955e57c3
Too blingy. If we are talking El Primero then it has to be something professional looking and worthy of the name Zenith:
https://www.mappinandwebb.com/Zenit...7_1620075757_9ea387120c7bb15755f4c425955e57c3
Short supply of Rolex is on purpose, as people desire what they can't buy.
The supply problem has been made worse, as Rolex shut down factories during Covid.
Regarding price, well the market is setting price and people are still buying them.
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Obviously but that premium only has value to the individual if you believe the 'marketing' or hype or whatever they're using to create that illusion of value. I don't believe that the rolex brand has the premium value they're trying to portray and as such I think it's overpriced because they've put to much of an 'artificial' premium on the watch.
It's the same with say cars... can you honestly say that the improvements a Bentley has over a VW/Audi is worth the price premium, for someone who like bentley they'd obviously say yes, for someone who just sees the bentley as another car then it would be no, for someone being subjective about it the likely answer would be yes the bentley is better but not 'that much' better.
Just because a company says something costs x, doesn't mean it's worth that value to someone else, essentially price and value are not the same thing.
The thing is I would suspect a large portion of the people into watches would agree/say that is TAG is hugely overpriced in most cases, their cheaper quartz definitely are that's for sure.
So the question is then more about is if the rolex price in comparison to TAG is probably correct but we see TAG as overpriced, could that not mean that rolex is also overpriced (we all know they are on the second hand market)
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Associate
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2nd hand & grey dealer Rolex prices are a bigger bubble than Heuer a few years ago. It's driven by speculation more than demand as evidenced by the swathes of watches available.
IMO Rolex know this as well which is why we haven't seen ever larger RRP hikes.
As for watches to buy, as someone who likes variety, I'd rather have 10 interesting and unique watches than 1 or 2 big ticket options. I'd also rather have an Alexander Shrokhoff than a Tag or Tudor, or a Habring² than an Omega or Rolex. Variety of choice is good and if everyone followed the advice of Jason (which many already do) then watches would be very boring indeed.
IMO Rolex know this as well which is why we haven't seen ever larger RRP hikes.
As for watches to buy, as someone who likes variety, I'd rather have 10 interesting and unique watches than 1 or 2 big ticket options. I'd also rather have an Alexander Shrokhoff than a Tag or Tudor, or a Habring² than an Omega or Rolex. Variety of choice is good and if everyone followed the advice of Jason (which many already do) then watches would be very boring indeed.
Loads of citizens for that price.