When are you going fully electric?

[OspreyO]

He is giving his opinion, I don't know why people get so defensive if their own opinion differs. You quoted his post which said "inferior to buttons for me" the FOR ME part shows he is talking about just his own opinion, not stating it is fact.

Its not really a discussion when some just repeats dogma of an opinion of one and refused to consider other people opinions, or industry and safety studies and opinions.

Putting buttons on a touch screen is primarily a cost saving measure. But it requires the drive to take their eyes off of the screen, and controls to use it. That should be self explanatory and if its not, explaining it won't help. Saying "but voice controls" is an admission thats touch screens have severe limitations.

"... study funded by AAA found it took drivers up to 27 seconds to regain full attentiveness after giving their phone or car a voice command, and another study from the same group that year tested several then-current infotainment systems and found their voice recognition abilities to be highly inadequate...."

Its go nothing to do with EVs though as ICE have it too. Many manufactures are adding buttons back. Interesting a lot of Chinese cars seem to retain the buttons. Perhaps that because they aren't as pinched on costs as the western auto makers.

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

Major flaw of touch screens per se . is that with RHD cars have to use your left/non-dom hand, it's lower precision makes it a pain/less-safe (imagine doing that in kitchen work)
my older parents just wouldn't contemplate it - if I was ambidextrous maybe it would be a don't care.

Have Mazda relented yet, they had said we'll never have touch screens, from safety perspective.

less safe?
Other than pressing the ejector seat by mistake what exactly is a safety issue from a touchscreen having to use your off hand?

FWIW I find that when static using the touchscreen far faster and easier for eg inputting a postcode is far faster than wheel scrolling, drawing the letters etc. But on the move then physical buttons /switches are far better. (Assuming car familiarity and your not looking all over for eg the rear demister)
I can adjust all the main controls in my car from either reaching across and changing them without looking, or maybe a very quick glance, to the rest being mainly available via the steering wheel on the drivers cockpit

 

[Terminal_Boy]

I’ve found that being right handed in an LHD car makes the centre console controls and satnav display unconsciously easier to use than in my last RHD vehicle despite having 7 years muscle memory of the controls.

I just wish my satnav could be viewed without taking eyes off the road.

 

[OspreyO]

I have no idea what your on about now.
Honestly just give it you made a load of incorrect assumptions and now your trying to split the difference between absolute silence and low background noise because you made an incorrect assumption it was noisy.

They have had to address the problems caused by EVs as they are silent. ICE are not silent. Its really not hard.
They have been there for years, same layout, same process, no drama. Ive used them for charcoal for years, just visit more now as I have a log burner.
Its just the same as the other example I gave, a common one, people assuming there are no cars as there are no car noises in carparks.
We see it as well with my other halves hybrid when we pull away.

When your wrong your wrong, just suck it up buttercup.

Anyway your going on ignore now as you seem to be just here to argue with no clue.

I'm not the one trying to redefine noise and silent, flip flopping between them like a yoyo. You're complaining about bad parking, and that wasn't invented by EVs. They put reversing sound warnings on lots of things with engines, and its not because they are quiet. It because people don't pay attention and do dumb things, while looking at their phone and not paying attention. It not my fault your arguments make no sense buttercup. People step in front of ICE in car parks. Have always done.

• Two thirds of drivers report driving while distracted in parking lots
• Over half (56%) of drivers report texting while in parking lots

Shopping centre car parks represent 50% of pedestrian injuries reported and 76% of all pedestrians injured in car parks and/or shopping centres were injured in daylight.

Thats from 2009

 

[Simon]

He is giving his opinion, I don't know why people get so defensive if their own opinion differs. You quoted his post which said "inferior to buttons for me" the FOR ME part shows he is talking about just his own opinion, not stating it is fact.

From what though. He’s basing it on what he’s read. Not what he’s driven by the looks of it.

 

[Ace Modder]

From what though. He’s basing it on what he’s read. Not what he’s driven by the looks of it.

Well that's speculation.

Our new car has a mix of both physical and touchscreen style buttons. Opinions on one vs the other doesn't bother me either way. But allow people to have their own views.

(Note my photo, but one from Hyundai's website - which I self hosted)

 

[jpaul]

less safe?
Other than pressing the ejector seat by mistake what exactly is a safety issue from a touchscreen having to use your off hand?

takes longer with eyes off road ... I've been in a lhd for 25+ years, so maybe I'll grow into rhd I got last month. (not an aston though)

 

[Kenai]

Have Mazda relented yet, they had said we'll never have touch screens, from safety perspective.

I presume there's more context to this, as we have a Mazda with a touchscreen and it's fine.

 

[OspreyO]

I’ve found that being right handed in an LHD car makes the centre console controls and satnav display unconsciously easier to use than in my last RHD vehicle despite having 7 years muscle memory of the controls.

I just wish my satnav could be viewed without taking eyes off the road.

That's more of left hand right hand dominance sort of thing.

 

[CaptainRAVE]

With pretty effective voice control on many of the newer screens the lack of buttons starts to become a non-issue.

 

[jpaul]

I presume there's more context to this, as we have a Mazda with a touchscreen and it's fine

V

on the touch screens - as I say mazda believe the safety issue is compelling

Why Mazda is purging touchscreens from its vehicles

Tablet-like touchscreens have become the ubiquitous interfaces of choice, and they’re seemingly everywhere in daily life, on everything from thermostats to coffee makers and refrigerators. But Mazda really doesn’t think they belong in cars—or at least anywhere near the driver’s seat. It wasn’t a...

www.motorauthority.com

Physical buttons outperform touchscreens in new cars, test finds

Physical buttons are increasingly rare in modern cars. Most manufacturers are switching to touchscreens – which perform far worse in a test carried out by Vi Bilägare. The driver in the worst-performing car needs four times longer to perform simple tasks than in the best-performing car.

www.vibilagare.se

Spoiler: result

Car	Time to perform four tasks, seconds	Score, 1–5
BMW iX	30.4	4.0
Dacia Sandero	13.5	3.75
Hyundai Ioniq 5	26.7	3.5
Mercedes GLB	20.2	3.25
MG Marvel R	44.9	2.5
Nissan Qashqai	25.1	4.25
Seat Leon	29.3	3.25
Subaru Outback	19.4	4.0
Tesla Model 3	23.5	3.75
Volkswagen ID.3	25.7	2.25
Volvo C40	13.7	3.5
Volvo V70 (2005)	10.0	4.5

• Activate the heated seat, increase temperature by two degrees, and start the defroster.
• Power on the radio and adjust the station to a specific channel (Sweden’s Program 1).
• Reset the trip computer.
• Lower the instrument lighting to the lowest level and turn off the center display.

it's the other driver you have to worry about.

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

takes longer with eyes off road ... I've been in a lhd for 25+ years, so maybe I'll grow into rhd I got last month. (not an aston though)

You shouldn't be adjusting anything when its not safe to do so. Thats not new its been part of the highway code forever.
If the fact your using your left hand makes it unsafe (vs your right being safe) as your eyes are off the road longer moves it from safe to unsafe then logically you shouldn't be adjusting it...

 

[Kenai]

V

In that case, to answer your question, yes they presumably have relented.

 

[Kenai]

Personally, I think the entire topic is somewhat overblown as the vast majority of cars aren't moving critical or frequent controls into the touchscreens anyway. Things like volume are very frequently on the steering wheel now, climate control is a set and forget system anyway, demister is a 'before you drive off' function, sat nav shouldn't be getting adjusted on the move beyond a typical 'accept alternative route' prompt etc. etc.

 

[OspreyO]

From what though. He’s basing it on what he’s read. Not what he’s driven by the looks of it.

I use a touch screen almost every time I drive. The built in car voice system is brutal. I use Android Auto or Apple Car Play for voice. Luckily all the most often used functionality is also on buttons. I driven quite a few cars with almost no buttons at all. But rather than get into confirmation bias, I prefer to see what the consensus is from studies and research. It a habit from working in development, and UX. Remove personal opinion, and look at the data. Whereas you've totally committed to personal confirmation bias. Each to their own.

 

[mrgubby]

touchscreen isn’t some alien technology that’s brand new to EV only. You hardly need to use the screen anyway when driving. Nav you can do before setting off and the heating will be on normal controls in most cars anyway.

You are looking for something hard to find and limiting car choices on a none issue.

Using a touchscreen or touch sensitive button in a car for a commonly used function is a safety risk.

 

[OspreyO]

Personally, I think the entire topic is somewhat overblown as the vast majority of cars aren't moving critical or frequent controls into the touchscreens anyway. Things like volume are very frequently on the steering wheel now, climate control is a set and forget system anyway, demister is a 'before you drive off' function, sat nav shouldn't be getting adjusted on the move beyond a typical 'accept alternative route' prompt etc. etc.

Some cars have haptic buttons the on the steering wheel and multiple functions on those buttons.

Any of the older ID3s I've driven with the older software were bad. Both touch controls and voice where very hit and miss. The new software and faster hardware I've heard are better not tested one lately.

I like having media, phone and ACC controls as physical buttons, same with heating controls, lights, air etc. Cars can mist up when driving.

 

[Kenai]

Some cars have haptic buttons the on the steering wheel and multiple functions on those buttons.

I like have media, phone and ACC controls as physical buttons.

Yeah, a minority have functions like that as touchscreen only and the 'touch buttons' on the steering wheel that VW tried was fairly quickly reversed anyway

Edit - did smirk slightly that to demonstrate your point you've used a video called "VW ID.3: The Touch Controls Are FINE"

 

[OspreyO]

Using a touchscreen or touch sensitive button in a car for a commonly used function is a safety risk.

News tesla's have reverse on touch screen which seems like a faff. That said I think a manual is far better at 3 point turn maneuvering than an auto.

 

[OspreyO]

Yeah, a minority have functions like that as touchscreen only and the 'touch buttons' on the steering wheel that VW tried was fairly quickly reversed anyway

Edit - did smirk slightly that to demonstrate your point you've used a video called "VW ID.3: The Touch Controls Are FINE"

Well I'm open to hearing his opinion, I really like Martin Karel videos, but I disagree with him here. But its good overview of the overcomplexity (IMO) of the steering wheel controls.

AFAIK VW only reversed it on the golf Passat and Tiguan, not other models.