Which brand CPUs does your company/employer work with?

[4K8KW10]

You're seeing conspiracy where non exist.

I bought my first AMD here on OcUK 20 years ago. You think this is new. It isn't.

"Conspiracy" is a fabricated term to protect the masses from seeing facts that are not in the interest of the ellite.

I mean this headline:
Intel Doesn’t Want to Talk About Benchmarks Anymore
Intel Doesn't Want to Talk About Benchmarks Anymore - ExtremeTech

Puget took some time to be convinced, but continuously their own benchmarks showing the superior performance of AMD meant they had to promote their AMD based machines as well strongly, I think that's what their tweet does. I don't know how many workstations they ship in the US, but they have a strong reputation so it's good to see. Intel are always going to be in people minds because of the volume they can ship. Apparently they've sold a lot of tiger lake machines last quarter and they ship more 10nm than 14nm now. I know where I work, Devs will get Dell Machines or Intel based Macs - they don't even need much grunt. But Puget supply big workstations for rendering and content creation and Intel are inferior in those quarters.

I am quite sure that AMD has still headroom to sell more CPUs that are not flying fast enough from the shelves.

The consumer DIY market cannot help a lot because the large volumes are in the OEM market.

 

[4K8KW10]

We've replaced all our laptops and desktops across our organisation recently and I'm pretty sure performance never was a consideration. It's whatever hits the price point.

Meh...The people who are interested in top end performance are a tiny % of computer users. So those articles are not pitched at the masses. But a tiny % who are mostly IT literate enough to see through those "articles".

What laptops did you get?
Some slow i3 or i5, that run hot and loud?

 

[4K8KW10]

As it happens they are Ryzen 5 Pro.

But the difference in benchmarks and the Intel equivalent is marginal. Sometimes the AMD is faster sometimes Intel. Not much between them.
Power consumption and heat is more or less the same, intel idles slower.
The only marked different is the integrated GPU on the Ryzen. But since it never used for games, it makes no difference.

But I know they were bought simply because of price alone.

We have to check the benchmarks, after all, in order to see the truth.

AMD performance:


PassMark - AMD Ryzen 5 5500U - Price performance comparison (cpubenchmark.net)

Intel performance:


PassMark - Intel Core i5-10210U @ 1.60GHz - Price performance comparison (cpubenchmark.net)

 

[4K8KW10]

You're missing the point. Even if that was the CPU which it isn't.

The point is that your company make irrational decisions, close to being even severely incompetent about what actually to do.

They must always look for the qualities of the things they purchase, otherwise it's money thrown to the trash.

 

[4K8KW10]

What you're up against is resistance to change and reluctance to take any kind of risk.

We are terrified of change, at least in this regard. But in other arenas too. Most people want an easy life, and that means sticking to suppliers you know and have existing relationships with.

Also, most don't want to rock the boat. Don't want to say, "Hang on, what we're doing might have worked years ago, but is it still the best option?" Nope, most just keep their heads down and do what they're always done. It's easy, predicable, and nobody will lose their jobs for doing what they've always done.

Conversely, if you are the driver of change and it doesn't work out 100% as management expected, or there's a hiccup, it's your ass on the line.

So people stick to what they know. What's been proven.

It literally doesn't matter if AMD delivers 5x the perf at 1/2 the cost. They represent change for many. They represent risk.

And it's really hard to overstate the aversion that most places have to risk and change. They hate it.

This does not sound serious.
There is no change - the brand AMD means as high reliability or even higher reliability than what Intel can offer. Security vulnerabilities with Intel CPUs?!
There is no risk to go all AMD. There is a risk with staying with Intel.

 

[4K8KW10]

Deadly serious. Perhaps I should have said "perceived risk".

There is always perceived risk with any change. When you have bought nothing but Intel system for the past 20+ years, then of course a non-Intel system is a change (and a perceived risk).

That applies to servers and client devices.

Ok, let's say it the other way - it may be serious but it shows severe lack of intelligence,

and corruption / support for a monopoly in the beings who practice it.

 

[4K8KW10]

Also believe it or not, AMD still has the kind of reputation among people here that Cyrix (etc) has. That they are a knock-off Intel clone. That they aren't a serious choice for the enterprise.

In fact mention AMD around these parts and you will be laughed at, by the people who've been here 20+ years. Laughed at as if you'd suggested we build our servers out of LEGO.

I've long since given up that fight, because the more I suggested AMD the more I looked like an idiot to the people above me. And those people aren't ready to consider anything but Intel. Not now, probably not ever.

Sounds like a company stuck in hole that needs a reorganisation.

Professionals who do not have sufficient knowledge of the industry trends, what's hot and what's not, the industry innovations and breakthroughs, and the basic characteristics of the products they are using.

I prefer to hurt somehow myself than to use something inferior when I know that I am using something significantly inferior.

 

[4K8KW10]

No change here.
We won't be allowed to have our own choice of hardware based on a determined budget for an employee.

That would be the best - everyone is free to buy their own hardware, with discounts from the company budget.

 

[4K8KW10]

Mostly Intel as far as I'm aware.

No one should buy Intel. So much corruption and unawareness of the performance of the available products



Intel is a sad joke, unfortunately
Core i9 12900K processor review - Performance - Corona Ray Tracing (guru3d.com)

 

[4K8KW10]

AMD's CPUs and APUs are miles, miles ahead in all of the important and key performance metrics - lower power consumption, higher performance per watt, higher absolute performance.
And in all market segments - Intel for sure doesn't own the mid-range. Quite the opposite.

 

[4K8KW10]

What you are forced to use at work*. Against your will.

 

[4K8KW10]

I'm not forced to do anything against my will. I recommended ThinkPads due to them meeting all requirements and having excellent build quality and service and support. The price was good. We got ThinkPads. I'm happy. 99% of the users are happy. The other 1% are trialling Surfaces.

Sorry, but why exactly do you need "build quality" for a stationary office machine that doesn't move or if does rarely?!

I prefer the performance of Ryzen that is much much higher.

 

[4K8KW10]

Given your posting history I'm not taking it off topic in here. Open a new one if you're really that interested.

Don't worry, I have started this thread. Follow the discussion as is here, if you will.

 

[4K8KW10]

Which part of no didn't you understand?

If you don't agree with someone, it doesn't mean that you have to mention "their posting history".
Because the forums are very biased as you prove it and not helping to reaching mutual understanding and cooperation.

If the market says that the AMD Ryzen is the better choice, you must listen.

 

[4K8KW10]

In a word - irrelevant. As usual with your opinions.
As for biased, LOL. You're the one making sweeping assumptions that we've got people in an office building chained to their own desk with a desktop PC in a cubicle like it's the film Office Space from 20 + years ago.

1) AMD might be outselling Intel in gaming PCs and self-builds, but that's a niche in the PC market. The mass produced laptops with integrated graphics that make up the majority of sales are Intel territory and eats up all the 14nm capacity they can muster.
2) 85% of our estate (comprising thousands of machines) is laptops. That's increasing because due to COVID everyone is still homeworking. The office is still closed to the majority of staff and most departments were hotdesking pre-COVID anyway, hence had laptops.
3) We're not ordering laptops off Amazon or nipping down to Currys. We're an large-ish organisation and have a purchasing framework for a number of years which gets us a significant discount. The supplier do offer AMD laptops now, but didn't when it was signed therefore the spec states Intel. Also remind yourself of point 1).
4) 99% of our users run normal office apps or access systems via with a web browser interface for which a quad-core 15W CPU in a laptop is perfectly fine. Ryzen would offer marginal benefits if at all.
5) Total Cost of Ownership. Build quality is very important. No point buying a cheaper faster machine because "OMG Benchmarks R Betterz", if it breaks when used by a normal human doing their job. The ThinkPads will generally take a beating, and the software and hardware support is good. Less support staff needed, easier to build, deploy and maintain.
6) Stable platforms are important. If the manufacturer start changing component choices between batches it becomes a pain to image the machines and maintain them going forward. Remember, we've got thousands.

That said ... Lenovo do offer AMD options in most ranges launched in the last 12 months. I persuaded the bosses to get some in for pilot testing due to security and supply concerns on Intel CPUs. First impressions are they're decent so they'll be considered going forwards given the security benefits.

I can compare two systems:

my own Acer Nitro 5 AN515-42 powered with Ryzen 5 2500U.
and a company HP Elitebook with Core i5-10210U.

Both are with 15-watt APUs but the Ryzen performs better with lower temperatures and lower noise from the fans.

If you put Ryzen 5 5500U (15-watt and much faster) in that machine, the HP will look like the most stupid product created ever!

 

[4K8KW10]

So you didn't understand a thing I wrote. Gotcha.

You have to ask the supplier for better options, if they don't offer.
Or return what you have over complaints that their systems are outdated and not up to the tasks.

Even simple web pages browsing these days is CPU-intense and pushed that poor Core i5-10210U to high temperatures, so that you have to listen to the fan noise all the time.

Don't tell me that AMD can not supply in quantities because it is not true.

 

[4K8KW10]

Again, proving you likely didn't read what I wrote. You might want to stop digging the hole you're in now.

You are wrong:

here:

Ryzen would offer marginal benefits if at all.

The improvements are not marginal, but very substantial.

and here:

Stable platforms are important.

Calling AMD Ryzen "not stable" is either lack of willingness to accept a changing PC landscape reality, or simply lack of knowledge.

 

[4K8KW10]

I'm not wrong. You are not reading what I wrote, then jumping to an incorrect assumption.

Stable platform doesn't mean system stability. It literally says so after the bit you snipped out :




Stable platform means that if I buy a ThinkPad T14 type 1AA now, it'll have the same components in as a ThinkPad T14 type 1AA I bought 10 months ago. Therefore the same driver pack and everything else will work on it. I don't suddenly find they swapped the WiFi card or webcam and there's suddenly missing drivers meaning we have to support two different versions of something that looks the same.

Well, but you can't expect thousands of your systems to be all the same specced. It is naturally not possible because the likes of Dell, HP and Lenovo may have different suppliers for its WiFi adapters and their websites do confirm that they work and have the necessary support software.

There are literally hundreds of available machines with Ryzen 5 5500U and Ryzen 7 5700U from these OEMs (up to 60% higher performance than equivalent Intel offerings).

The IT department's job is to provide support for normal functions.

 

[4K8KW10]

I can expect it. Lenovo and Intel promise it and deliver it.

https://www.intel.co.uk/content/www/uk/en/business/enterprise-computers/stability.html

I'm done indulging your trolling now. Toodles.

Absolute nonsense


https://pcsupport.lenovo.com/en/en/...-list/component?name=Networking: Wireless LAN

 

[4K8KW10]

We've got a waiting list of outstanding orders, despite the contract. 12+ weeks last I heard. If the manufacturers are short of components, they're short of components. Pre-pandemic there was buffer stock in the UK. That vanished within a week of lockdown. They'd order large shipments and get a discount for them going via slow sea freight.

Which is why we looked at the AMD versions and took a couple of batches. As you've said, supplies on those are now as constrained as Intel...

The DIY market is flooded with AMD CPUs which don't sell fast enough.

AMD problem is not that there is not enough wafer starts at TSMC but the wafer allocation afterwards - which chips where to go.

The GPU market is bad, too, with 100% higher scalper prices than the MSRPs...