Why would anyone use Windows?

[manic_man]

I can tell you why I am still using Windows as my main OS.

On my Dell XPS M1730 laptop, I spent literally a week finding a distro that supported its software RAID setup without me having to boot into a live cd and pre-install software RAID drivers etc in order to even run the installer. Eventually found Fedora Core 8+.

Then, once it was installed, I needed the latest NVIDIA drivers for my 8800M GTX SLI setup, got em, spent ages learning how to install them (init 3, install the kernel development pack, update the kernel, update dev-pack, then run installer, allow it to build the driver kernel and allow it to modify the X server) BAM, nothing.

Then I spent another 2 days finding the kernel options scattered around the web to get my desktop and more importantly OpenGL support back. Finally got it all working but its slow as a dog. Do some more reading, another whole day later I have modified many many lines in my X Server config and have something that resembles a reasonable desktop.

All the time, I was using trusty Vista to lookup how to fix my problems.

I realise many of these problems are down to the NVIDIA drivers etc and an open source system is never going to be as accomplished or polished as a commercial system, but still, thats the reason right there.

And for those that say, its ok for old hardware, well I gave up on the above setup as the 2D performance was still too slow, tried it on my old 1.7Ghz P4 machine with an FX 5200, load of totally different problems with regards to the networking adaptor and other bits and pieces...

All told, nearly 3 solid weeks of just messing (in my spare time) just to get to the point where I can run my OpenGL code in Linux...

Windows is just easy. If i want to install a driver for my latest hardware, I can, in seconds. If I want to install onto a soft RAID setup, I can, without even thinking about it.

Both have their places in peoples usage patterns, but the above is my answer as to why "everyone" is not using Ubuntu (which currently basically does not work if you have a soft RAID setup, for the record).

 

[FatRakoon]

Sorry, but I find that a complete load of B/S

My Opteron 285 is running SLI and Sabayon Linux with the full 3D Compiz junk, transparent Cube Desktop and windows turning into paper airplanes and fly on/off when they shrink & expand
I play a number of 3D Games, such as Open Arena ( Quake 3 ) UnReal Tournament 2004, Doom3, and Quake 4 all perfectly fine and the installations issues I had was...
Well, none, it did it automatically for me.

My LapTop however is ATI, and on that, I run KUBUNTU and in order to get the LapTops 3D Stuff all running properly I had to tick a box...

So, to judge Linux on your experience with only one distro, I find rather insulting to the entire linux / gnu community.

Try another distro and you may very well find as many do, that Linux has a hell of a lot more to offer than you first think.

 

[manic_man]

I have been using Linux for nearly 5 years now, uni forced it upon me. But I rarely have to configure it, this is where my bone of contention lies.

What I just gave was an account of why your average, PC user who just wants to use their PC as a tool (and is not a clued up user) would, at the moment, find Linux a hard OS to get to grips with.

The simple fact that I have to stop and manually modify the X Server to install a new display driver is example alone (and that would be even if it worked) of why it is not currently a viable alternative to commercial ventures such as Windows.

I of course did not intend to offend millions and millions of people (as lets face it there are millions in the Linux community...)

If you know of any other distro that supports soft RAID out of the box and wont require me to boot into a Live cd and hack around with pre-installing drivers etc. and does not slow to a crawl with the NVIDIA drivers installed, please please let me know as I desperately wanna run my code on my nice 8800M SLI setup rather than the FX 5200!!

My above post was a bit venemous, but that only reflected the fact I found this thread after nearly 3 weeks banging my head against wall after wall.

The currentl glut of Linux distros and shells etc are very impressive when you consider where they came from and how quickly they have done it. They are, however, not yet a replacement for Windows or Mac OS for the majority of users.

 

[FatRakoon]

Ok, we must agree on that.

Both yours and my posts had venom, we are both right in what we are saying but both wrong too!

With regards to my own nVIDIA and ATI installations, I have found it to be far more easier than Windows, but thats not to say I always have, and every distro has been different too.

I mean, I have not utried Fedora since FC2 and recently I tried 9 and I loved it... I absolutely fell head over heel in love with it... I felt like I was having an affair and I went behind Kubuntu's back to be with Fedora, but then I realised that in order to play MP3s, I was offered 3 choices of codec packs, then to play Videos ... Well, Linux has free alternatives and if Fedora cannot or will not offer me the free alternative, then Im sorry, but it can just go and get lost... I now have no intention of EVER giving Fedora another try.

Ubuntu is the opposite... I hate everything to do with DEB, being RPM based 100% and I also hate Gnome, being KDE all the way, and yet I love ubuntu... DEB based with Gnome???

Ok, Im using kubuntu on the laptop but only for the KDE apps.

I have to be honest here, but Im not too sure that I have any issues at all with ubuntu?

So, give it a try at the very least yeah?

 

[Mattus]

Then, once it was installed, I needed the latest NVIDIA drivers for my 8800M GTX SLI setup, got em, spent ages learning how to install them (init 3, install the kernel development pack, update the kernel, update dev-pack, then run installer, allow it to build the driver kernel and allow it to modify the X server) BAM, nothing.

Then I spent another 2 days finding the kernel options scattered around the web to get my desktop and more importantly OpenGL support back. Finally got it all working but its slow as a dog. Do some more reading, another whole day later I have modified many many lines in my X Server config and have something that resembles a reasonable desktop.

All the time, I was using trusty Vista to lookup how to fix my problems.

I had the same thing. Tried to install the nVidia display driver and it just killed my X server. Cue half an hour's googling to try and get my Ubuntu install working again. Back to Windows I went!

 

[manic_man]

Ok, we must agree on that.

Both yours and my posts had venom, we are both right in what we are saying but both wrong too!

With regards to my own nVIDIA and ATI installations, I have found it to be far more easier than Windows, but thats not to say I always have, and every distro has been different too.

I mean, I have not utried Fedora since FC2 and recently I tried 9 and I loved it... I absolutely fell head over heel in love with it... I felt like I was having an affair and I went behind Kubuntu's back to be with Fedora, but then I realised that in order to play MP3s, I was offered 3 choices of codec packs, then to play Videos ... Well, Linux has free alternatives and if Fedora cannot or will not offer me the free alternative, then Im sorry, but it can just go and get lost... I now have no intention of EVER giving Fedora another try.

Ubuntu is the opposite... I hate everything to do with DEB, being RPM based 100% and I also hate Gnome, being KDE all the way, and yet I love ubuntu... DEB based with Gnome???

Ok, Im using kubuntu on the laptop but only for the KDE apps.

I have to be honest here, but Im not too sure that I have any issues at all with ubuntu?

So, give it a try at the very least yeah?

Sadly I have tried both Ubuntu and Kubuntu with little to no success because of this laptops soft RAID setup.

I have got a little of the way in, booting from a live cd, manually installing dmraid etc etc but in the end I bottled it as the windows partition on this thing is very important (getting them to lend me the Uni's Vista CD again would be a nightmare for a start...).

If Ubuntu just worked on soft RAID, as only Fedora seems to, I'd be down with Ubuntu I know for a fact it works FAR better with the current NVIDIA drivers.

This is all my point though. Vista works perfectly with both the soft RAID and the SLI graphics setup, out of the box, with no need for me to spend my valuable time messing about.

I'm sure Linux will get there in the end, but until it does there is simply no way it can replace windows.

I also dont think the current crop of distros will ever end up with a windows style installation and driver system as clearly the devs like their system the way it is, allowing them to tinker with it in detail. Until someone decides to make a distro that totally hides Linux workings from the user, from the ground up, its always going to be Windows for the masses, Linux for the smaller geekier minority.

 

[mdjmcnally]

I also dont think the current crop of distros will ever end up with a windows style installation and driver system as clearly the devs like their system the way it is, allowing them to tinker with it in detail. Until someone decides to make a distro that totally hides Linux workings from the user, from the ground up, its always going to be Windows for the masses, Linux for the smaller geekier minority.

Like OSX?. Other then gaming I intend to ditch windows at home altogether.

Of course OSX comes with other issues such as the hardware and lack of choice for it but that is a different story.

I don't really see Linux replacing Windows on the Desktop as is more a power users OS, where you can get the full power. Not everyone wants that. Certainly corporate doesn't want users having that ability to tinker, as they like to lock down.

Fortunately there is room for everyone.