Woman held in Dubai with daughter after drinking wine on flight

[dowie]

Since @Diddums thinks I'm slacking on the RSS feed front....

Saw this pop up today on my iPhone newsfeed (where usually I get all the best stories from the Daily Fail, the sun and the mirror).

Frankly this sort of thing just highlights for me why the conservative/fundamentalist side of religions don't deserve any protection from criticism or ridicule at all no matter how much some people screech "racism". Here we have a country that on one hand tries to court tourists and on the other hand still can't detach itself from its messed up conservative interpretation of Islam (thanks mostly to the influence of its larger neighbour).

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...daughter-for-drinking-glass-of-wine-on-flight

A woman was detained in Dubai for three days with her four-year-old daughter after drinking a complimentary glass of wine on a flight from London, an NGO has said.

Ellie Holman, a dentist originally from Sweden who lives in Sevenoaks, Kent, with her English partner, Gary, and their three children, was denied water and made to clean toilets while in custody, according to the human rights group Detained in Dubai.

[...]

In a statement from the group, Holman claimed the guards tried to rip out her hair extensions and described the prison as hot and “foul-smelling”. She said the pair were made to sleep on a “filthy” mattress and she was told to clean toilets and floors.

“My little girl had to go to the toilet on the cell floor. I have never heard her cry in the same way as she did in that cell,” she said.

Now she's spent a 5 figure sum on legal fees, will be stuck in the country for possibly up to a year and I doubt her dental practice back home is going to do too well either.... all because she consumed a glass of wine that the state owned airline gave to her....

Granted it was bad luck and is unlikely to happen to any given individual but if it does then you're going to have your life turned upside down and end up blowing a load of $$$$$. Most people who go there don't even seem to realise that alcohol consumption could get them arrested, they think it is legal because it is served in hotels when, as tourists, they're actually breaking the law if they drink it and could potentially be locked up if unlucky enough to be caught.

 

[dowie]

If you read the article she was held for both.

 

[dowie]

There's more to this story than they're making out, I've been plastered many times in the UAE, and never had any bother.

One glass of wine on a flight does not get you in prison.

Only possible thing I can think of is that either it was many glasses of wise and she appeared drunk to officials, or at a push they could smell booze on her even if she wasn't drunk, which is far less likely.

Or she'd upset the wrong official...

Just because you didn't spend time in jail doesn't mean it's fine, you broke the law there too and if you'd attracted the attention of authorities there you could have the same issue as this woman.

 

[dowie]

This doesn't sound like a simple case of "arrested for drinking one glass of wine" as the headline and first paragraph of the article suggest. This all started because her visa was not valid.

I've read the article thanks, her visa being invalid isn't the reason for her being arrested it is simply the reason for her coming to the attention of the authorities. Once the guy was apparently rude to her (I guess the attitude towards women there can be dubious) she's then filmed him (illegal) and he's asked about her alcohol consumption (also illegal)... those are the two reasons we've got for her arrest - you'll see also that she had a blood test (again related to the illegal alcohol consumption).


Yes people drink there all the time, no it isn't legal for tourists. So long as you have no grounds for the authorities to have to deal with you then no one is likely to care...

 

[dowie]

She had one glass of wine that was given to her by the state owned airline, it's hardly comparable at all...

 

[dowie]

It seems it was nothing to do with alcohol - visa issues and then filming (or otherwise upsetting) the officials!

Yet another example of the Daily Mail sensationalising a minor part of the story to get views!

Clearly you've not even read the article as you've got the details wrong and can't even name the publication.

What makes you think it was nothing to do with alcohol - did you miss the part where she was questioned about alcohol consumption, given a blood tests and charged for drinking alcohol? She's not been arrested for having an invalid visa!

 

[dowie]

here is another publication covering it

https://www.news.com.au/travel/trav...t/news-story/bfe8481739e1b08a1dddbf6224326727

She admitted to the glass of wine before filming, she started filming after she was told that consuming the wine was a criminal offence... though unsurprising too see the apologists focusing on it and trying some how justify this (as though filming in an airport somehow justifies what she went through).

 

[dowie]

The comparison is the authorities letting something go until knobs start being knobs, not the level of alcohol involved.

no evidence she was being a knob though and she got in trouble for the glass of alcohol before she started filming

 

[dowie]

How much trouble was she going to be in? She may have been on course for being told to be careful, but then kicked off, for example. But we don’t know. All we know is what she’s selling. The fact this doesn’t happen all the time suggests to me that there’s more to the story than we’re being told... more to the story which she doesn’t want us to know.

Not necessarily, there are plenty of cases of people getting locked up in Dubai for trivial reasons.

You're seemingly assuming that this dentist with her 4 year old daughter by her has done something to deserve it. You can just as equally assume that the local man who checked her visa has a backwards view about women and doesn't like one talking back to him.

 

[dowie]

It's not hard, why bother filming officials when you've got an invalid reason? Does getting shirty and filming someone help your chances of being let into the country? I'd imagine if you did the same in the states you might spend some time in the cells depending on what language you use.

Presumably because she didn't realise drinking a glass of wine on the plane, given to her by the state airline meant she was breaking the law, she'd just admitted it to him and he's just told her that she's committed a criminal office... She got the phone out after being accused of a crime and she doesn't realise she's committed a crime.

 

[dowie]

It's one of many reasons she's in prison and theyve just lumped it on just for good measure.

Many reasons? There are two it seems, firstly the alcohol and the. secondly filming in the airport after being told that she'd committed a crime by drinking alcohol.

Like I said, I've been many times, had drinks there and managed to not get myself locked up for years. They don't go looking for things to find, but if you give them lip they're quite happy to lock you up.

She's been before she should know better

And if some other drunk western person bumps into you or starts a bit of aggro when leaving a hotel bar/club and the staff just point the police at both of you then you're potentially rather screwed.

This is a country that arrests and prosecutes rape victims, you can't just dismiss it all as though the people who end up on the wrong side of the law somehow had it coming simply because you were OK when you too knowingly broke the law over there.

 

[dowie]

It is legal for tourists under conditions. Where it's consumed/bought mainly. It is illegal to be drunk.

No, sorry but you've got that wrong, you need a licence and you can't get one as a tourist, as an ex pat sure but not when you're on holiday. The Hotels won't stop you from breaking the law and seemingly neither will the state owned airline in the case of this woman - she had one glass on the flight, she wasn't drunk, she'd simply consumed alcohol.

I don't even want to defend the place, I've no intention of going back... But these stories are always the same. Constant tabloid tosh to stir up disbelief. In every single one of them it's a Brit Abroad losing their temper and complaining about how they think things should be done under a nonsense headline.

You don't know that. What about this case then?

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-arab-emirates-nightmare-ordeal-a7426421.html

Was the rape victim a "Brit Abroad" losing their temper?

 

[dowie]

Think the license only permits you to buy it in supermarkets, not a requirement for in the hotels.

You're now devolving the argument into questioning all their laws. We can do that for every other country in the world if you want it to be fair?

I'm devolving it into? The thread topic itself is about a woman being prosecuted for drinking a glass of wine on a flight after seemingly arguing about a visa with some airport official.

And you're wrong about the licence, it is a requirement for the person purchasing/consuming the alcohol, the hotels (like the state airline) will seemingly be happy to allow you to break the law.

https://www.guide2dubai.com/living/laws-and-regulations/alcohol-licence-in-dubai

http://whatson.ae/dubai/2015/12/need-know-getting-alcohol-license-dubai/

Then if you look at the requirements for a licence, they include having to be a resident so not really something a tourist can get anyway - ergo you were unwittingly breaking the law there and if the police had had to deal with you for any reason then you could have potentially been locked up too.

 

[dowie]

I mean, if I had parked my car illegally, and was then arguing with the police officer about it and he said 'have you had a beer tonight' before arresting me for kicking off, would the paper print that I had been arrested for having one beer? Because that's essentially what's happened here

She wasn't arrested for kicking off though.

 

[dowie]

As far as I'm aware she hasn't been found guilty either, so why don't we all save the rage for the court case.

Why? Did you miss what had happened to her already?

 

[dowie]

Well presumably they didn't have an invalid visa and an official who had gotten upset at being argued with by a woman.

Fact still remains that the couple you saw could have been charged for that if the authorities had some other reason to have to deal with them.

 

[dowie]

What a great culture that ensures Visas are on point and police forces are not attacked. Perhaps that's where we're going wrong

Where are you reading that she attacked him?

Turns up in dubai with invalid visa, argues with and films immigration officials, and tries to claim it was all about the wine.

she didn't get arrested for an invalid visa and the filming happened after the alcohol issue was brought up (presumably because she didn't realise she'd committed a crime and thought she was being stitched up)

She's now received an apology from the govenment, and has been allowed to go home.

well that's good news, bit of media exposure does seem to help

it is interesting to see the various reactions in this thread, people accepting this sort of thing from the authorities or assuming she's done something more to somehow deserve it - some people were also clearly unaware (just as this woman was) that drinking alcohol was illegal.

Would be interesting to see the mobile phone footage, I suspect she wasn't kicking off like some angry chav but just (as reported) asking to buy a visa or trying to find out if there was some other way to resolve the situation. It is hardly unsurprising for officials there to be rude etc.. and she'd just got off a long flight with her 4 year old daughter.

 

[dowie]

She had an expired visa. She got shouty when questioned, whilst drunk at the airport and started to film it. They banged her up for being a stupid **** but let's not let facts get in the way.

You haven't presented any fact, you've just speculated that she was shouty and you've erroneously claimed she was drunk when the only fact we have is that she had one glass of wine on the place (she was travelling with a 4 year old so I doubt she got hammered) and that she readily admitted to that when asked by the official + underwent a blood test.

Also if the above posted by Bowdon is true that she actually could have bought a visa then it isn't surprising that she argued with the official/didn't just accept turning around and getting another long haul flight back to the UK with a 4 year old kid.

 

[dowie]

But instead she became self entitled, yelled at the immigration officer and then started recording him. Plenty of other countries would do the same. She got what she deserved.

How do you know she yelled at him or acted self entitled?

 

[dowie]

It was reported that she became argumentative, as was her filming which in its own right is a serious offence.

So you don't know she was yelling at him then... the filming happened after he told her that she'd committed a criminal offence by drinking a glass of wine on the plane.

Seemingly he'd just gotten the visa rules wrong (if she is in fact allowed to buy one there, she did too by assuming her in date visa could be used more than once) and was about to send her back on a another long haul flight with a 4 year old... it isn't all that out of the ordinary that she might question that.