Worth paying more for an Audi over a Skoda?

[Gixer]

My old 2004 Audi A4 B6 1.8T (red T) is showing signs of age now. I've owned it the past 11 years. It's just going to pass 117k miles which in the grand scheme of things isn't many alas the bills are getting higher to keep it going. It's in for a thermostat replacement at the moment.

I am looking at buying an estate of a similar size to the A4. I would like petrol over diesel. Whilst I have been driving a remapped 1.8T for some time I think something with the 1.4 / 1.5 VAG TFSI engine in would do these days. So I have been looking at Skoda Octavias and Audi A4s. Ideally sub 50k miles and 2017 or newer. Budget wise £18k tops ideally.

Current car cost wise hasn't been too bad at all really, even with a few big bills over the years. The suspension is just starting to feel a bit loose which considering the mileage on it I am impressed with as it is all still original. I know the Audi suspension setup is vastly different to that of the Skoda. As you can tell I like to keep my cars for a lengthy period. So would you think it worth paying a few grand more for an Audi with the more robust suspension setup over the likes of a Skoda Octavia?

I'm also keeping my eye out for Passat's but they aren't so common and seem to have a higher premium too.

 

[Gixer]

Thanks for all the replies folks. I have been looking at superbs however they are bigger still, same size as an Audi A6 I think. I don't think that'd be an issue though it's just not a needed for the car to be any bigger than A4 size. I did also look at golf estates / Focus estates however I think they're a smidge on the small side. Same with the Leon, as I think that's the same size as a golf estate. I'd avoid any Ford engine with a wet cambelt setup, I've heard about ridiculous service costs to change the cambelt and stories about bits of belt breaking off and blocking oil ways, which isn't ideal.

Interesting about the 1.5 engine. I'll go reading about why it is unreliable, I didn't realise it was. All I know is the 1.4TFSI is a pretty good engine so assumed the 1.5 would follow in its footsteps.

I only mention suspension as I think the Octavia uses a MacPherson strut type setup which I personally don't think is as solid as the Audi setup I have on the front of my current A4. I don't think the 1.4 Octavia uses a torsion bar setup on the rear that I can see.

Pigeonguy UK, I saw that A6 last night. I did an MOT history check and last years advisories didn't sit well with me. No problem if the parts have been fixed / replaced but as they're only advisories they may well not have. Good to see the Octavia clocks up 100k without many major issues. I had my clutch replaced at 90k on my Audi, only as the gearbox was out to be fixed, and the garage said there was still a good bit of life left in it, which surprised me.

Ref diesels. A fair few of my journeys are quite short and I don't think a diesel engine is best suited for that reason. Can't be bothered with cleaning / replacing DPFs and any other re-circ / cleaning systems due to gunking up.

I'll go take a look at some. I'm not a badge snob but would be willing to pay a little more for extra reliability / quality is all.

 

[Gixer]

Thanks Zairs. I didn't realise the Passat was superb / A6 size. I thought it was Octavia sized. Interesting to read you had so many issues with the Passat too, not something I'd have expected to read. Which engine did you have in the Passat? was it mostly engine troubles?

 

[Gixer]

I have been looking similar skoda vs audi. Mechanic who deals in performance vehicle and 30+ years experience told me to avoid the 1.5 tfsi as they arent reliable. They are also underpower when pulling about a heavier estate.

Any info on what is so unreliable with the VAG 1.5TFSI? I've just been reading and can see that when paired with a manual gearbox there were numerous experiencing a kangarooing effect in 1st and 2nd gear at low speed. It seems there were software updates released and that those problems 'should' have disappeared by now? I wonder if a remap would have fixed that issue? Strange all is OK when the engine is paired with a DSG / auto box.

 

[Gixer]

Just looking and now wondering how a Ford would compare. The 1.5 Ecoboost engine doesn't have a wet cambelt and has reasonable economy. I could get a very low mileage car for quite a reasonable price. Would it last as long as a VAG car though...

Ford Mondeo

 

[Gixer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xemd7cuYZvQ might be worth a watch.

The coolant intrusion does not sound good. I will dig a little to see if that has been happening in the UK. The rest of the common issues I could live with or don't cost that much to fix. Most happening around 100k mile mark which will take me a long time to get to.

 

[Gixer]

Do they not share most of the mechanical components with the Octavia? Why would they be less reliable if they have the same engine and gearbox etc?

I was thinking along the same lines.

Though VAG gearboxes aren't all that great at times. My pinion shaft bearing died at around the 90k mark. The hardened surface on the roller bearings must have started to flake off. Having the 1.8 red T did not help me here either as the gearbox is slightly shorter ratio than the 1.8 non red T. So that cost me a fair bit to get fixed. Must have been due to a dodgy bearing batch I assume as those bearings sit in oil the whole time.

 

[Gixer]

but the japanese are short on estates ? mazda 6 perhaps but biggish car for 165bhp




mk4 https://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/477903-irs-or-torsion-bar/

so if the 1.5 is a bad egg => thirstier 2L, probably vrs

e: quite nice A4/41K/2L https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202304106142407
but, hadn't realised the newer ones are doomed MHEV
e2: but, nomark tyres .... saw my first 'goodride' tyre the other day.

I've looked at the Jap stuff. Honda civic looks a bit too small. Toyota would be good alas the 1.8vvt engine will need to be revved hard to get it going anywhere. Being an NA engine though there is no turbo faff to go wrong. I did look at Mazdas too a while back but didn't think they were as reliable as either the Honda or Toyota.

I find the newer Audis a bit odd. Many use the same 2.0l block and they just detune the engine for the slower models, like the 35. Granted a remap sees massive gains on these. I appreciate from a manufacturing perspective it may save costs but I can't help but think a smaller capacity engine of the same power would be more efficient overall.

 

[Gixer]

The 1.8T in my car has a strange setup. A dry cambelt drives one camshaft. Then inside the engine at the other end of the camshafts a wet chain links the two camshafts together. So there are two places timing can jump potentially in my engine. I got lucky that I requested a seal below the cam chain tensioner be changed due to a small oil leak last year as it was discovered that one of the cam chain tensioner feet had broken but luckily not disintegrated. That would have been a dead engine had the cam chain tensioner given up totally.

 

[Gixer]

The 1.8T was great before the last cambelt change. I assume the timing must have been altered a bit when the cam chain tensioner and cambelt were changed. Prior to the last cambelt change I'd see up to 48mpg on a long run. Only seeing around 42mpg at the moment. Around town in very slow moving traffic it's around 28mpg. City roads with little hold up due to traffic I see about 37mpg.

Not decided yet. I've started looking at Volvo V90's but I'd have to spend 20k - 25k for one of those and I'm not sure I'm comfortable with spending that much on a depreciating asset. If I start looking at V90s I should probably also consider a BMW 5 series. It's all up in the air, just like the rest of my life at the moment

 

[Gixer]

I've noticed that the Audi 35 TFSI is much more common than the 40 TFSI. That's not really a big deal though. One small remap later and your problem is solved. It will be better MPG wise to have the lighter car though.

 

[Gixer]

I've never been that impressed with the 3 series boot. I'd probably have to go with a 5 series if I went BMW.

 

[Gixer]

It's exactly the same size as the one in the Audi A4.

I think it's the shape of the space. A4 is more useable, if that makes sense? The suspension seems to intrude more into the BMW 3 series boot space. From when I last took a look anyway.

 

[Gixer]

The split tailgates on BMWs gives me a divided opinion. I can see how it could be useful but it also adds the potential of getting a leak at some point, unlike a mounted window would.

 

[Gixer]

yes good point
As a 2nd hand owner I would not want the liability of powered mechanicals failure as they age, I doubt there is a manual fall-back functionality? - replacing the rear struts on my touring didn't break the bank.

You replaced the struts? I just close the boot gently on mine I did replace the bonnet strut though as that's the only thing that holds the bonnet open!

 

[Gixer]

The only thing with French stuff is the fun you can get with the electrics. That said I had a Peugeot 306 gti6 for several years and the few electrical niggles I had with that were solved by pulling all electrical connections apart that I could see and applying silicone grease to them.

My current car is 210 - 220hp so pretty much everything I'm looking at has less power. That doesn't bother me though. Engine rpm pick up isn't that fast however in my current car. I reckon the flywheel must weigh a ton!

 

[Gixer]

I had the 1.5tsi in a Passat. Needed a new gearbox after 9000 miles and was woefully slow. Awful engine in a car that size.

What happened to the gearbox after 9000 miles? Was it an auto or a manual box? 150hp isn't going to move an estate car that size very quickly but with a remap you get a half decent gain which should see it accelerate at a more acceptable level. I rarely drive rapidly these days though. I'm sure I'd miss what I have for nipping past things when needed but 98% of the time I'm just bimbling around now.

 

[Gixer]

had you found any more details on this 1.5tfsi problems ... unfortunately seems as common as m*
kangarooing seems to be indicative of dmf issues

No. I figured I'd just avoid buying one. What I read though was it was due to software issues but who knows. Why the hell would a 1.5 need a DMF? That said my current Audi, which is petrol, has a DMF. I know it's supposed to smooth things out in a manual car. Never had any issues with a car that didn't have a DMF though. As those kangarooing issues start at not very high miles it'd be concerning if it is DMF issues. Had my clutch changed at around 90k due to the gearbox issue (might as well do it whilst box is out). I still had meat left on the clutch plates and my DMF is halfway gone they said. Something about it's on notch 3 and there are 6. It's not making any dodgy noises, that's all I'd be concerned about.

 

[Gixer]

doing some further reading on the pariah vw 1.5

Cambelt Change - No Longer 5 Years ?

Cambelt Change - No Longer 5 Years ? All Skoda Karoq related discussions - Skoda Karoq Forums

www.karoqforums.co.uk

so a 5 year old car with fsh would have had cam belt done before skoda conveniently changed the rules last year.

Hmm, this seems like another reason to avoid the 1.5ACT engine??

 

[Gixer]

FWIW, I just swapped my '03 Octavia for the equivalent A4 Avant.
Engine-wise, it's the exact same thing, bulletproof, will do moon miles if properly maintained... but the ride is totally different. Audi really overengineered the suspension on this thing, and the difference is evident even to passengers who don't drive. Everything in the Audi is smoother, quieter and more subtle, where the Škoda is more raw and rough - This isn't a bad thing as you have the tolerance to misuse and abuse it a bit, making it great as a first car or a thrashabout.

The interiors are about the same standard, although my previous was an L&K trim. The Audi cup-holders and glove box are broken, of course, and it lacks some of the finer convenience features of the Škoda.
Electrics and all that are yet to be seen, but several friends have this same era A4 B6 and have not experienced any of the issues that the Octavia was starting to show. The downside of being a thrashabout is that previous owners will likely have thrashed it about already.

Split boots, or those with opening tailgate/taildoor windows are of some use, but this seems to only become apparent once you own one.
The wife has it on her CR-V and we obviously found it worked for certain situations with the dogs, but accessing upper sections of a fully loaded boot, loading stuff for a tip trip or packing in extended loads like wood from the DIY shop, all things you can't (so easily) do with a taildoor.

That was one of my original questions. The suspension in Audi's is very much over engineered and seems pretty solid. At 117k miles mine is just starting to feel loose enough for me to think work may be required soon. In contrast my brother bought a 2017 Octavia VRS and has already had to change lower arms / ball joints sub 50k miles. Could be due to hitting pot holes, we don't know what the previous owner did to it. Alas when I look at Audi suspension compared to Skoda's the Audi looks sturdy.

I'm not a badge snob, I'd buy anything. Being an aerospace engineer though I do look at how things are manufactured, which is why I had that question in the first place.

My glovebox is still working fine, but that's because I read about the common issue and lubed it all up! It's never been a problem for me.

I went to the local Volvo dealer today to see if I could get eyes on a V60 and V90 to compare boot space. Alas none in stock, only XC60s and I'm not sold on the boot space in those. Started to begrudgingly look at SUVs too as that's what the wife prefers. They have awful boot spaces though IMO, compared to the equivalent estate.