Zimbabwe.

Is it true China sold guns to Mugabe?

http://baraza.wildlifedirect.org/2008/11/10/zimbabwe-bartered-ivory-for-guns/

It is alleged that the ivory auctioned by Zimbabwe was flown out of Harare Airport on Thursday 6 November. If, then, the ivory for guns scam is true, the Chinese will bring Mugabe the guns sooner than latter. Apparently, an earlier shipping of Chinese military equipment bound for Harare had been turned away in the South African port of Durban. That could be the reason why China will fly in the new cache of arms.
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Chimerical said:
Is it true China sold guns to Mugabe?

http://baraza.wildlifedirect.org/2008/11/10/zimbabwe-bartered-ivory-for-guns/
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It wouldn't entirely be a surprise, China follows what is sometimes called a non-interventionist policy where it will trade with some rather abhorrent regimes on a basis of what seems to be "if we don't then someone else will". Their argument is that they cannot morally say what is and is not right for other countries to do so they will trade with them which is quite frankly a load of ordure, they'll happily state what they do and do not find acceptable but money talks as people say so moral judgements are put aside cf trading with Sudan for oil.
 
There's a massive case for intervention, however the USA won't do anything because it still smarts from what happened in Somalia when they went in for humanitarian reasons and so won't be going into Africa again imo, China and Russia won't do anything because they only care about their own "sphere of influences".

I could see Britain, and maybe other EU forces intervening but only in a leadership capacity of an African UN force, which means we need Zimbabwe's neighbours to actually see what a disaster Mugabe is for their region. With the exception of Botswana, all the other powers in the region got caught up in a wave of African pride and actually support Mugabe.

IMO what we're seeing in Zimbabwe today will be repeated in 10-20 years time in South Africa.
 
As other people have said, the financial cost of Iraq/Afgan has been truly immense.
Taking down Mugabe would not be hard but the after aftermath would be Iraq all over
again.

In an ideal world we would go in for a couple of weeks, get rid of Mugabe & gives his bullys a bloody nose (Georgia anyone?) but we would then become embroiled in a massive humanitarian mission & the reconstruction of Zim' from the ground up.

War is never black and white & a lot of coutries feel VERY reluctant to rock the boat after the disaster of Middle Eastern conflicts.
 
meghatronic said:
No, I don't think we went to IRAQ to find Osama.

I have my personal opinions and beliefs, and they'll stay that way... but if it was about the 'oil' as so many retards utter, then WHERE IS THE ****** MONEY!??!?! And why is it costing us so much? Why aren't we all wearing Armani suits??!?!?!
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You call those of us who believe we're only in Iraq for the oil 'retards', but you won't say why YOU think we're there. Come on, o fountain of all knowledge, you can't tell us we're all wrong in such offensive language and then not tell us what makes your unexpressed opinion inherently more correct than ours. Please tell me you don't believe all that crap about WMDs, probably one of the biggest lies ever fed to the electorate, by a Government that has raised lying to a whole new art form?

As for the main topic of the thread, I wholeheartedly agree with the OP's comments. If, as appears to be the case, the rest of Africa is prepared to either dither or turn a blind eye while this regime sets about wiping out the entire population of the country, through a combination of disease and/or state-sponsored murder, then there comes a point where it is down to the rest of the world to take action. That point has long been passed, but I sense the spectre of political correctness as a factor here - how can we do so without appearing to be the white man interfering in the affairs of a black country?
 
Chimerical said:
How's Nigeria doing?

Last I heard, they were okay.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigeria
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Thats probably because their GDP is propped up by ebay scams ;)

Seriously though, Mugabe was popular in Zimbabwe when he ousted the whites and if we were to go in, I still feel that the nation would kick off due to the whites intervening.

Unfortunately, the other solution I see is that after widespread suffering for a long enough period, they will start to see who really is to blame, and Mugabe's excuses of "it's the USA/UK's fault" won't hold up forever.

Either that or a carefully orchestrated CIA assassination, although arguably just another idiot could stand up and take his place. Worth a try though in my book.

I think an important question is, how much integrity does this Morgan Tsvangirai have?

Makes you wonder that with all the nutters in the world today, why cant one of them just assassinate him?
 
meghatronic said:
I have my personal opinions and beliefs, and they'll stay that way... but if it was about the 'oil' as so many retards utter, then WHERE IS THE ****** MONEY!??!?!
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iirc the reasoning is that Iraq was going to switch to the "oil euro" rather than the dollar which would cost them a lot. and hasn't most of the oil rights been given to certain foreign companies now?
 
meghatronic said:
I don't believe this is like cutting the head off a snake.... Remove Mugabe and someone will take his place... who knows... could be someone worse.
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In most cases, I'd agree with you. In this case, I'm not sure that someone exists (at least not in a position to do anything about it). By all accounts Mugabe shouldn't be where he is, but is on the grounds that he regards Zimbabwe as his own personal posession ("it's mine") to do with as he pleases, and **** anyone who isn't prepared to do his bidding. Point blank denying that his own people are dying of Cholera, for example.
 
I don't see the problem. Robert Mugabe has turned his entire population into billionaires. Surely this is an achievement worthy of the highest praise? :confused:
 
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