Caporegime
-
Competitor rules
Please remember that any mention of competitors, hinting at competitors or offering to provide details of competitors will result in an account suspension. The full rules can be found under the 'Terms and Rules' link in the bottom right corner of your screen. Just don't mention competitors in any way, shape or form and you'll be OK.
Doom Vulkan with different CPUs
- Thread starter D.P.
- Start date
I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about. Exactly how many game engines have you worked on or developed?
Have a look at the unreal engine, all the graphics APIs are abstracted away in wrappers. No sane programmer on the planet wants to constantly access low level API commands, this is even more the case with DX12 and Vulkan. This is the entire purpose of these new APIS, the developer has to create a more encompassing wrapper that takes more control over the command queue and state
Soldato
Was it the Talos dev that said Vulkan is Mantle except everyone can use it and it took him three months to code it all by himself as an ogl>Vulkan as a proof of concept?
As long as your hardware is AMD and can do hardware Async
, hopefully there's more love to ground for Nv hardware as ID said they were working with them for more gains.
As long as your hardware is AMD and can do hardware Async
, hopefully there's more love to ground for Nv hardware as ID said they were working with them for more gains.They are just as true as any other Vulkan game.
The developers may not have spent as much efforts optimizing for particular hardware, but that is an important aspect of the new low level APIS. Instead of AMD and NVidia optimizing everything, the develop has far more responsibility.
Doom isn't a Native Vulkan game either by your definition - it has both an OpenGL and Vulkan support abstracted away under wrappers.
Caporegime
The Talos Principle is a game that I have bigged up on many occasions and those who enjoyed Portal/Portal 2 will really enjoy it. And being the first game to have Vulkan was a nice touch. I did a thread here with it but not much take up on it, which is a shame but it was really good to see it running.
Soldato
Least with Doom it was built alongside the game and used to its full potential, other so called Vulkan games are not using it how it should be, reason performance increase is lacking.
ID love OpenGL and Vulkan will have been jumped on by them long time ago Doom is the first truly Vulkan API game.
Caporegime
You do make me chuckle how Doom is the one to use but The Talos Principle isn't, even though they both have Vulkan as a wrapper and neither are native Vulkan. I guess it is only fair use when a certain brand is winning but all good fun
Soldato
You do make me chuckle how Doom is the one to use but The Talos Principle isn't, even though they both have Vulkan as a wrapper and neither are native Vulkan. I guess it is only fair use when a certain brand is winning but all good fun
It's quite obvious, 1 is coded to fully use the API while the other isn't.
It's just like using Nintendo game running dx12 not say how I done it but it gains nothing over openGL or DX11 it's just a wrapper.
Associate
So all of the data presented at the link I gave in a previous post and everything I've measured for myself over the past 10 or more years including several recent AAA games is totally wrong then. Interesting.
No, with Doom they first coded in openGL and then they added Vulkan as a patch.
How do you know Doom is using Vulkan to it full potential? I would hope there are much more optimization to come in the future otherwise it is very disappointing.
Why are other games not using Vulkan as it should be? Can you provide any links to how Vulkan should or shouldn't be used?
Soldato
Enough information here has to why Vulkan API isn't being used to its full potential
http://steamcommunity.com/app/257510/discussions/0/412447331651720139/
Not got time to dig through the developer videos from Doom but if you want to learn something go right ahead.
Caporegime
I don't care AMD are winning in 1 game me
Last edited:
Soldato
AMD aren't strong in openGL to start with. Id imagine dx11 vs Vulkan to be less impressive. I'll settle for 20% gains 
Soldato
I don't care AMD are winning in 1 single game
I honestly couldn't careless, I just want best performance that my pc can do and Vulkan so far seems to be leading the way. Well kinder so far least on my setup Vulkan and dx12 is 1 to 1 Doom is excellent and so is FORZA 6 both pushing high frame rates at great settings.
If I cared so much about winning I would be involved in benchmarking and running the latest hardware all the time.
This whole 'truly' thing strikes me very much as a 'true Scotsman' sort of fallacy. If you're using the Vulkan API, you're using the Vulkan API. This talk about 'wrappers' and whatever nonsense is kind of ridiculous.
Vulkan and DX12 are like any other API in that they can be used to great effect or to poor effect or anywhere in between. At any point on the scale, it is still a 'DX12/Vulkan' title. Just like a DX11 title is still a DX11 title even if uses none of the multi-threaded capabilities it offers. Really, even moreso when it comes to a low level API because there's an entire world of optimization that you can bother with or not bother with depending on your level of experience/talent/resources/time/motivation/etc. Which is again why it's very dangerous to go around making blanket statements about what it means for a game if it's using one of these low level API's.
I'd say that even by your own True Scotsman definition, Doom will probably not be considered a 'true' Vulkan game in 5 years time when DX12/Vulkan have advanced far enough and engines have inherent adaptability with the new API's and there are far better gains to be seen. Or rather, what I expect to happen is not for games to simply be 'DX11 + better performance', but I think the extra capabilities will be used for actual game design advancements. The huge increase in draw calls possible make for game design decisions that simply aren't possible with DX11/OpenGL. But it also requires that DX11/OpenGL be ditched completely. So I think it's quite foolhardy to go around saying that Doom is a 'true' Vulkan game when it's still very much rooted in OpenGL development as a fundamental base.
This really. The increase in draw calls will allow some interesting advances in the future, but these aren't possible if a game still supports DX 11 or OpenGL. Even then it requires new generation of game engines.
Soldato
Read the Q&A above even the developer say they need to code more to get more out the API and gain performance. It's not using Vulkan the same way ID is on DOOM.
ID also need to do more to get more performance out of Vulkan, that is the nature of software development.
None of this makes the Talos Principle results any less relevant than Doom's. They both are useful sources of information as valid as each other.
Soldato
Ok then Doom is the first Vulkan game to truely showcase what Vulkan can do. Maybe that is a better way of putting it.
Talos a Vulkan title that isn't showcasing any benefits at this moment, is pointless taking about it. It's still in development far as I know so still has time to gain performance.