Pico 4 out soon?

glenimp617 · 12 Jan 2023 at 17:04

ShiWarrior said:

I jumped on the kickstarter ages ago. Been wanting something like this since I got my Pico.

They said they have already made a better design, and will be shipping the new revision this week.

glenimp617 · 13 Jan 2023 at 11:30

This looks really good. You pull the back padding off, and completely replace it.

Not yet released.

BoboVR

Mr_Sukebe · 17 Jan 2023 at 20:00

With the more recent software updates, I bought a Pico 4 (again).
I managed to get it working successfully with DCS using OpenXR via VD. Looks great and isn't the stutter fest that I had on the first attempt.

However, since getting it working, I've found connectivity to be a REAL pain. My wifi clearly isn't great, and when my family are watching videos, it creates lots of lag issues.
The USB cable "should" be viable, but whilst I could get it working for a couple of days, I then had 6 hours trying to reconnect, with no obvious differences.

So, this one is being returned to. I'll definitely be working for a DP enabled unit next. Hopefully Neo will do a Pico 4 link, as if you ignored the connectivity, I was very happy the device itself.

melmac · 1 Feb 2023 at 16:26

Saw one of these for sale near me. Unopened present, Looking for around £300. It's the 128MB version.

Very tempted. But, I think I will wait until the next Quest.

djxput · 2 Feb 2023 at 10:36

melmac said:
Saw one of these for sale near me. Unopened present, Looking for around £300. It's the 128MB version.

Very tempted. But, I think I will wait until the next Quest.

I debated about returning mine as I dont use it really that much but now my kid likes it so kept it - to be honest 300 is a nice price for it unopened. To me this is much better then quest 2 - quest 2 felt like a brick on the head - this is much more comfortable. Only thing that irritates me about the Q3 is the better will still be in front - the pico balances it out a bit. prob wont see the Q3 till oct or so thou ...

Unseul · 2 Feb 2023 at 10:52

djxput said:
I debated about returning mine as I dont use it really that much but now my kid likes it so kept it - to be honest 300 is a nice price for it unopened. To me this is much better then quest 2 - quest 2 felt like a brick on the head - this is much more comfortable. Only thing that irritates me about the Q3 is the better will still be in front - the pico balances it out a bit. prob wont see the Q3 till oct or so thou ...

Add a powerbank to the back and it balances the weight very nicely, whilst of course adding to the overall battery life which is nice. Though some people find that too heavy overall.

djxput · 2 Feb 2023 at 12:52

Unseul said:
Add a powerbank to the back and it balances the weight very nicely, whilst of course adding to the overall battery life which is nice. Though some people find that too heavy overall.

ya was meant to say battery but - thats what people do with the quest 2 and soon to be 3 ... I have a battery pack I can add to the pico if need be but dont use it that much to need it.

Ravenger · 2 Feb 2023 at 15:29

I use the AMVR neck battery for the Quest Pro which like the Pico already has a battery on the back. Wearing it on your neck instead of strapping it to the headstrap means you don't affect the balance and comfort of the headset.

glenimp617 · 20 Feb 2023 at 08:03

Has anyone had any luck with openxr toolkit and opencomposite?

0h_no_not_again · 20 Feb 2023 at 13:54

Picked up the Pico 4 for £350 on special, and curious about wireless streaming.

Is Virtual Desktop still the go-to for PCVR? Streaming Assistant seems to be updated quite frequently, and have seen ALVR/ALXR banded about a bit as well. Have also seen Streaming Assistant Extender, that unlocks a bunch more options.
Any opinions?

For reference, I'm running a Vega 64 in the short term, but have a bunch of older games in my backlong from my OG Vive days, so performance should be _just_ acceptable. Will upgrade at some point, just not keen to gift NV/AMD a bunch of cash without a fight...

melmac · 20 Feb 2023 at 14:03

0h_no_not_again said:
Picked up the Pico 4 for £350 on special, and curious about wireless streaming.

Is Virtual Desktop still the go-to for PCVR? Streaming Assistant seems to be updated quite frequently, and have seen ALVR/ALXR banded about a bit as well. Have also seen Streaming Assistant Extender, that unlocks a bunch more options.
Any opinions?

For reference, I'm running a Vega 64 in the short term, but have a bunch of older games in my backlong from my OG Vive days, so performance should be _just_ acceptable. Will upgrade at some point, just not keen to gift NV/AMD a bunch of cash without a fight...

For Vega 64, Virtual desktop would be your best to get decent performance. The Pico 4 is a much higher res headset than the Vive. Your GPU might struggle a bit.

0h_no_not_again · 20 Feb 2023 at 15:44

melmac said:
For Vega 64, Virtual desktop would be your best to get decent performance. The Pico 4 is a much higher res headset than the Vive. Your GPU might struggle a bit.

Thanks for the input. I was coming to the same conclusion just based off VD being able to measure latency and datarate. Those 2 metrics seem essential for confirming everything is working as you'd expect.

My first attempt with streaming assistant had some hilarious "unstable" behaviour of rendering "fine" and then slowly decreasing the bitrate/resolution (unsure which) until there are 200 pixels, then slowly going back to "fine". Rinse and repeat every 20 seconds or so. Literally tried for 5 minutes, so expect I'll sort that out if I actually try.

I'm well aware my Vega 64 is going to be shocking with the high render resolution of the Pico 4. It'll be fine in the short term though, especially playing older unity titles.

ShiWarrior · 20 Feb 2023 at 15:51

test without buying VD first (pico streaming assistant)
when i bought my pico (on day 1) the pico assistant would not work for me, i bought VD, been using it ever since

glenimp617 · 20 Feb 2023 at 17:21

Funnily enough I tried streaming assistance over the weekend. My god it's bad. It's like a ps3 compared to a ps5.

ShiWarrior · 20 Feb 2023 at 17:26

TheOracle said:
Funnily enough I tried streaming assistance over the weekend. My god it's bad. It's like a ps3 compared to a ps5.

so the makers of the pico cant do there streaming for their own device properly, but someone else can make it look amazing lol

glenimp617 · 20 Feb 2023 at 17:30

ShiWarrior said:
so the makers of the pico cant do there streaming for their own device properly, but someone else can make it look amazing lol

Oh the difference is night and day

Ravenger · 20 Feb 2023 at 18:37

It takes a lot of very clever software engineering to make VR streaming work. Pico hardware is great, but unfortunately the software lags behind.
Luckily Guy pioneered this on Quest (and Meta/Facebook ripped him off), and has brought it to Pico and soon the Vive XR Elite.

glenimp617 · 20 Feb 2023 at 18:41

Ravenger said:
It takes a lot of very clever software engineering to make VR streaming work. Pico hardware is great, but unfortunately the software lags behind.
Luckily Guy pioneered this on Quest (and Meta/Facebook ripped him off), and is has brought it to Pico and soon the Vive XR Elite.

Yeah, he's clever. The fact VD can stream at the native res is awesome, and the sharpening technology is just icing on the cake. It really makes a big difference. Sharpening 0 to 35 is like upgrading your graphics card!

glenimp617 · 21 Feb 2023 at 12:55

I've managed to get OpenXR Toolkit and Opencomposite working. Enabled fixed fov rendering to the point I can't tell the difference and have a nice 5% performance boost

0h_no_not_again · 21 Feb 2023 at 15:44

Thanks for all the input peoples!

So I found a fundamental issue with my setup where my Wifi 6 router (GS-AX3000) when set to 20/40/60/80/160MHz "Channel Bandwidth" was only running at 574Mbps, which was occasionally bottlenecking the streaming: Slight audio glitches, slight judder with fast head movement, etc. Set to 160MHz, and I'm locked at 1200Mbps a room away from the router. Win.
I would guess the router has said "well 40MHz is working, and 574Mbps is enough for anyone, right?". No idea how that negotiation happens...

In terms of Virtual Desktop vs. Streaming Assistant:

Streaming assistant is either getting the bitrate wrong OR is somehow screwing with the render resolution, because EVERYTHING streaming from the PC, including steamVR graphs, slowly changing between crystal clear and literally 640x480 or lower, over and over in a gradual change. This pattern repeats every 20 seconds.
Virtual Desktop just worked, and looked really nice, even when I was limited to 574Mbps wifi bandwidth... With 1200Mbps it looks amazing.
Streaming assistant did have 4-5ms lower latency, when the image was subjectively the same as VD.

I was really hoping SA would do the job. I hate having to fiddle everything, but VD has definitely come through as the clear winner.

In terms of why is SA periodically turning everything to mush: I suspect some horrible interaction between SA and streamVR/AMD drivers/my ancient Vega64, but there's literally no way to tell what. I can't be bothered intesting any more time in it, so in the bin it goes!

NOTES:

SA 9.3.9.1, which has just been released
5800X, 16GB DDR4 3600
Vega 64 (*******, I know...)

Thanks again for your opinions/advice.

Pico 4 out soon?

Man of Honour