Motorway cops - cops out of order?

snowdog said:
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can i get a WTF ?

a couple of things

1) the police dont set the law, the politicians do. The police are just the poor muppets who have to enforce it.

2) the fact they pulled him had nothing to do with it being 2 young lads in a CTR. They got it radioed by control of a reported fuel theft. They saw the car comming down the motorway and followed it as a result of directions from control. They hadnt even seen the driver when they decided to persue it

3)police do deserve respect. They're the poor fools who have to go and tell the parents of young idiots like the guy in the film that their little precious johnny was killed boy racing. Its a thankless task, and yes there are a few jobsworths who tarnish the police name, but by and large most traffic cops are decent blokes.

4) getting into the police car. the youth did have to get into the police car, he was arrested on suspicion of theft of a motor vehicle. With reasonable grounds as the plate was fake. When he arrests him, he has every right to demand he get out of the car, take out the keys and get into his police car

5) why are you ranting about our police when you live in holland ?
 
MrLOL said:
can i get a WTF ?

a couple of things

1) the police dont set the law, the politicians do. The police are just the poor muppets who have to enforce it.

2) the fact they pulled him had nothing to do with it being 2 young lads in a CTR. They got it radioed by control of a reported fuel theft. They saw the car comming down the motorway and followed it as a result of directions from control. They hadnt even seen the driver when they decided to persue it

3)police do deserve respect. They're the poor fools who have to go and tell the parents of young idiots like the guy in the film that their little precious johnny was killed boy racing. Its a thankless task, and yes there are a few jobsworths who tarnish the police name, but by and large most traffic cops are decent blokes.

4) getting into the police car. the youth did have to get into the police car, he was arrested on suspicion of theft of a motor vehicle. With reasonable grounds as the plate was fake. When he arrests him, he has every right to demand he get out of the car, take out the keys and get into his police car

5) why are you ranting about our police when you live in holland ?
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All traffic cops are the same, I'm not talking about normall police, I just dislike the ones patrolling in a civillian undercover car...


4) getting into the police car. the youth did have to get into the police car, he was arrested on suspicion of theft of a motor vehicle. With reasonable grounds as the plate was fake. When he arrests him, he has every right to demand he get out of the car, take out the keys and get into his police car
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He didn't steal nowt though, would you like to be arrested with the accusation of stealing a car just because someone matched your description or something?


I'm just saying, I disagree compeltly with traffic police, and believe they are only for the extra fines/tax income.
 
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Well I don't have a link really I just watch ''wegmisbruikers'' ( road abusers) every week and going into the cop car is requested for, but not required, you can refuse to watch the video and ask to just get on with it.
 
snowdog said:
Well I don't have a link really I just watch ''wegmisbruikers'' ( road abusers) every week and going into the cop car is requested for, but not required, you can refuse to watch the video and ask to just get on with it.
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So you're quoting Dutch Laws to a Britsih forums then?
Its a good job we sorted that one because theres some on here who would have believed you.
 
So in Britain you're forced to go with the police?
Bah don't people have anything better to do than hear the police moaning about how you drive, can't you really say: 'Just give me the fine please, I'm in a hurry' ?
 
snowdog said:
So in Britain you're forced to go with the police?
Bah don't people have anything better to do than hear the police moaning about how you drive, can't you really say: 'Just give me the fine please, I'm in a hurry' ?
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You're unbelieveable.
Why should the lad have a fine when he'd done nothing wrong?
Why not get in the Police car calmly and 5 mins later its all sorted?
Perhaps in Holland you don't have points taken off you which is more important than any fine.
Or perhaps your fines are only £5.
 
dmpoole said:
You're unbelieveable.
Why should the lad have a fine when he'd done nothing wrong?
Why not get in the Police car calmly and 5 mins later its all sorted?
Perhaps in Holland you don't have points taken off you which is more important than any fine.
Or perhaps your fines are only £5.
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He had a faulty plate I've heard ?

Because 5 minutes might mean the difference for some people to for example sell something to their next customer or coming too late and a customer refusing whatever.

Points are only given for heavy offences, one max per time: more as 30 kph than allowed, endangering others, etc... 3 points = lose licence. This only applies to new drivers that have got their licence in the last 5 years. No points for people having a lincence for 5 or more years.


Fine for minor offences like driving 7-10 kph too fast on the motorway is 14 €.

Less minor offences are very expensive though.
 
snowdog said:
So in Britain you're forced to go with the police?
Bah don't people have anything better to do than hear the police moaning about how you drive, can't you really say: 'Just give me the fine please, I'm in a hurry' ?
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If they've got reasonable grounds to suspect a crime has been committed, yes.

The cops saw the car, it had dodgy plates (often a sign the car is nicked), it had driven off from a petrol station without paying (probable theft).
The police had one very good reason to arrest him on the grounds of the driving off without payment that had been reported, and a second reason in that the car looked dodgy and they would need to check it out (people don't always notice their car has been nicked immediately so the officers are within their rights to detain someone whilst it's checked).


As for them pulling him out of the car, given the idiots on the motorway and the general level of awareness often displayed I wouldn't want to muck around standing on the traffic side of the motorway, even with a police car with all it's lights on fully behind me, so I can quite understand the officers not wanting to risk someone mucking about as they try to get them out of the car.

The plate was illegal, not faulty but either wrong registration, altered so that it's true number wasn't clear (illegal placement of lettering can make II look like a H if you put them just right with the screw between them for example), or coated with something to try and stop it showing up on camera etc.
 
Werewolf said:
As for them pulling him out of the car, given the idiots on the motorway and the general level of awareness often displayed I wouldn't want to muck around standing on the traffic side of the motorway, even with a police car with all it's lights on fully behind me, so I can quite understand the officers not wanting to risk someone mucking about as they try to get them out of the car.
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Given that he'd pulled over like a lamb rather than speeding off or just refusing to stop as he probbaly would have done had the car been stolen i'd have though an approach rethink and the line "would you mind stepping out of the car please?" would have been more becoming of the situation.

I accept that the police didn't know what they were getting into, but the same could be said of any pulling over of anyone.

It would seem from the thread on PH that there were goings on not shown on tv though we do only have the drivers side of that story. The taking of his keys leaving him stranded on the hard shoulder and then just chucking them out onto the hard shoulder is - if true - a poor reflection on the police force.

I think both party's behaviour left a lot to be desired.
 
Werewolf said:
As for them pulling him out of the car, given the idiots on the motorway and the general level of awareness often displayed I wouldn't want to muck around standing on the traffic side of the motorway, even with a police car with all it's lights on fully behind me,


The plate was illegal, not faulty but either wrong registration,
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due to the aggressive stop, the police car pulled in front of the vehicle in order to attempt stoping it from getting away. So to road users behind, they couldnt even see the flashing lights, just another car on the hard shoulder

as for the plate, it was made up wrong by the sellers. One of the letters was completely wrong. Hence when they did a search on it, it came back the number plate wasnt registered against any car.

snowdog said:
He had a faulty plate I've heard ?
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why are you even commenting on something you blatently know nothing about. As above, the plate was made up wrong by the garage. They put a wrong letter on, and as such his registration number didnt come up with anything registered against it. This usually happens for 1 of 2 reasons. 1) a honest mistake, as was the case this time. But these are very rare. Numberplate makers have to be registered, and have to put their details on their plate so they can be tracked back and reprimanded for such mistakes. So it doesnt tend to happen much. or 2) somebody has got a fake plate in order to conceal a stolen car, or to steal stuff and not be traced by the police. And guess what came over the radio ? a suspected petrol theft ! its easy to see why the coppers were so on edge.
 
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The fact that someone else made the mistake with the plates is irrelevant and doesn't factor into the "here and now" that cops have to act on. Look at the evidence, someone doesn't pay at a petrol station, the car looks like it's stolen owing to dodgy plates, it screams of something far more sinister. The cops had to pull the car over hard and fast because they were alone. Don't forget they spent several minutes trying to get some support for a more controlled stop. If this driver had indeed been a crook this would have been the most effective way of dealing with it.

Ok so he was innocent, if he was a mature individual he'd have accepted it and the reasons the cops had given were more than enough to be acceptable in their behaviour. I've been on a similar receiving end of police proactive policing it didn't bother me in the slightest - they even bought me a cup of tea! :D

I wish there was more proactive traffic policing as these officers demonstrated.
 
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Strictly speaking, he still wasn't innocent, as he was still driving a week later on his illegal plates. If you listen carefully, he mumbles about being told it was ok to drive home... But he really didnt care, and was driving as if the plates were fine.

Sure the cop was a little hasty pulling him from the car, although it very quickly became apparent that the kid wouldnt come quietly. If he had behaved better, he would probably have gotten an apology about that, but he was a loudmouthed idiot. Probably would have got the fine for the illegal plate even if he had been a perfectly well mannered middle age guy.

It wasnt simply an incorrect font, or spacing on the number plate.. the letters/numbers on the plate didnt match the car, so the driver was effectivly immune from speed cameras etc. Unfortunalty for the driver, modern cop cars carry number plate recognition systems, and quickly spot a non existant plate.

The cops have a job to do.

Oh, and these cops on the TV show are virtually all driving in marked cars.
 
The main reason people display such attitudes is because they have something to perhaps hide or worry about, its human nature to be like that sometimes, well if your an idiot it is. Any sensible person who goes about their business will take satisfaction from an appology from the Police, which you will get if you don't act like an idiot or become abusive in such situations. They have a job to do and like EVERYONE they don't always get it right, so wind your neck in, be civil and be on your way. If you feel you can't because you feel put out then you deserve all you get. I have been stopped a few times in my life and have never once given abuse or been cocky with them, and without exception I have been treated in a polite and grown up manner, even when I was 17!
 
snowdog said:
All traffic cops are the same
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What a load of nonsense. And not just that one sentence, either.

Freefaller said:
The fact that someone else made the mistake with the plates is irrelevant and doesn't factor into the "here and now" that cops have to act on.
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Agreed. People seem to forget or choose to ignore the simple fact that the police rarely have all the facts when they're doing their job. Suspicion and assumption are paramount in all areas of policing; if anyone thinks they shouldn't be, you're being very naive to what policing involves and how the job has to be done. The officers were operating on limited info at the time, and while yes, it did appear that the primary officer there was somewhat heavy-handed with the driver (albeit we have no idea whatsoever how co-operative the Civic driver was being prior to the camera being there), there was still no excuse for his appalling attitude towards the officers.

Respect is a two-way thing; treat the police with respect and decency and you'll very often get that back. Quite simply, you are going to be caused more hassle by being cheeky, rude or by trying to be a smartarse with them, regardless of their attitude towards you in the first place.
 
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I got pulled in my Skyline once for having "reg plates not conforming to regulations" - (basically they weren't some lame italics font or anything, the plate was just slightly smaller to fit the recess on the bumper).

Got pulled a second time the same week (at the time I had no intention of changing them and figured I'd try my luck) by a proper traffic cop and managed to talk my way out of another FPN simply by not being a Grade A ***k like this guy was, I simply said I'd already been given a warning about it a week ago and was in the process of getting the plates changed.

General consensus on the Civic Type-R forums is that this guy gave us all a bad name.... :(
 
Having watched the episode on iPlayer I must say the guy wasn't as bad as I was expecting...

For one thing he was just yanked out of his car for no apparent reason (from his perspective), on camera as well - most people would suspect that the cop was playing up to the camera.

As for the swearing I also agree with Booner - it didn't seem like he was swearing at them, it was just part of his conversation. To threaten him with S5 Public Order when he's sat in a Police car (i.e. not in a public place) doesn't make a lot of sense.

He was pretty lippy but all things considered I think the two guys could've at least been a bit more conciliatory towards him. They didn't apologise for yanking him out of the car and their attitude towards him was at least as bad as his was to them. Whilst I respect the Police have a tough job to do and wouldn't give them a hard time "just cos", I do think respect is a two-way street.

Errors on both sides in my opinion.
 
dmpoole said:
How do you know the film hadn't been doctored to just show the yanking out of the car?
There could have been a build up towards it.
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Not sure what you mean. The programme showed the cop pretty much pulling the guy out of his car, it wasn't a scene in a TV drama or something. I'm fairly confident they didn't pull the car over first and say "right we're going to yank you out of the car now, pretend you're really put out by it". They're Police officers, not actors.
 
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