Valencia - Spain - EUROPEAN Grand Prix 2009 - Race 11/17

[TW]Fox;14724744 said:
Good to see Badoer was a good choice for Ferrari. Surely they'd have been better off not running a car?
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I believe I read somewhere that it's part of the Concorde agreement (this is a business contract basically) that a team *must* run 2 cars minimum at every race weekend.
 
NathanE said:
I believe I read somewhere that it's part of the Concorde agreement (this is a business contract basically) that a team *must* run 2 cars minimum at every race weekend.
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Certainly sounds feasable - I wonder if it was always there or if it was something to do with the budget cuts (obviously could be an advantage if you only ran one car with the same funds other teams where using to run 2 cars - on the other hand if you have two cars you can run comparisons with new/old parts live in the race, and also all eggs in one basket - or not. Not sure which is worse )

At the end of the day Bernie always wanted 20+ cars on the grid
 
Another one im going to miss, will be in the pub on Sunday because City are playing and its on the telly. Am going to record it and try and keep away from the results.
How will you cope without me :D
 
knip said:
Another one im going to miss, will be in the pub on Sunday because City are playing and its on the telly. Am going to record it and try and keep away from the results.
How will you cope without me :D
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*prepares text messages that may or may not be misleading...* :p
 
FrankJH said:
Certainly sounds feasable - I wonder if it was always there or if it was something to do with the budget cuts (obviously could be an advantage if you only ran one car with the same funds other teams where using to run 2 cars - on the other hand if you have two cars you can run comparisons with new/old parts live in the race, and also all eggs in one basket - or not. Not sure which is worse )

At the end of the day Bernie always wanted 20+ cars on the grid
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I'm pretty sure the 2 car rule has been there for a couple decades at least.

There is talk of Ferrari wanting the rule changed next year to allow either 2 or 3 cars because Ferrari wants to run a 3rd car as a way to get a competitive advantage in the testing ban era. The more cars you've got running using slightly different setups the more you learn and the faster you will be at the next race... I'm not sure how they will get this through because it seems to me like only McLaren and Ferrari and perhaps Red Bull could afford to run a 3rd car really. And it kind of goes against the cost cutting measures.
 
orderoftheflame said:
I wasn't impressed by Badoer in either session, Grosjean show's a bit of promise at least.
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To be fair to Badoer he spent most of the first practice session slowing down to let everyone else pass whilst he got to grips with the car and the track.

As far as "why Badoer", well, he's been their test driver for 10 years, he's obviously helped in that time with car development so Ferrari may use his car as a mule for new bits and bobs for the 2010 campaign, something they couldn't do with Kimi or Felipe.
 
philjohn said:
To be fair to Badoer he spent most of the first practice session slowing down to let everyone else pass whilst he got to grips with the car and the track.

As far as "why Badoer", well, he's been their test driver for 10 years, he's obviously helped in that time with car development so Ferrari may use his car as a mule for new bits and bobs for the 2010 campaign, something they couldn't do with Kimi or Felipe.
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Not sure how viable that is simply because - there is such a huge gap between where Kimi is and Badoer in performance, how will any results they actually collect from Badoer's car be applicable to a car next season

imo the whole point about F1 is that final 5 - 10% of performance is crucial to the reliabiility , you can do 100,000 miles testing something at 85% and it wont fail - but try at 95% and it could fail within 25 miles or something

Badoer will get better undoubtedly - but Im not convinced he will ever get to that final 5-10% of the other drivers abilities


NathanE said:
I'm pretty sure the 2 car rule has been there for a couple decades at least.

There is talk of Ferrari wanting the rule changed next year to allow either 2 or 3 cars because Ferrari wants to run a 3rd car as a way to get a competitive advantage in the testing ban era. The more cars you've got running using slightly different setups the more you learn and the faster you will be at the next race... I'm not sure how they will get this through because it seems to me like only McLaren and Ferrari and perhaps Red Bull could afford to run a 3rd car really. And it kind of goes against the cost cutting measures.
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You could well be right

I personaly dont like all these junior teams with the same chassis, manufacturers giving their engines over to multiple teams is bad enough (necessary in the current climate, but sad non the less imo) - but to have three car teams really shouldnt be allowed, its hard enough for even the midfield teams to get points imagine how it would be even if two big teams have a 3rd car , majority of the time all those 6 will be in the points and 8 or more teams (16 cars) fighting over two points finishes - making it harder and harder for those teams to justify being in F1 in the first place

I would love a proper season long fight between McLaren, Ferrari, Red Bull and Brawn (and my heart says Williiams as well but I think thats unlikely) next season
 
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FrankJH said:
I personaly dont like all these junior teams with the same chassis, manufacturers giving their engines over to multiple teams is bad enough (necessary in the current climate, but sad non the less imo)
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Presumably you either weren't around or weren't a fan of F1 when all you needed was a March chassis, Hewland gearbox, Cossie DFV engine and a few other bits and bobs to go racing rather than having to make everything yourself....

Customer cars and engines have been a part of GP racing since before the World Championship began. I don't see the problem with manufacturers selling chassis and engines for other teams to go racing with. It's part of what gave us much larger entry lists back in the day.
 
oops, looks like Vettels engine might have gone, oil on the track and session red flagged

edit: and the surprising scene of RBR mechanics on the track recovering the car. Looks like it stopped just on the corner before the pitlane entry.
 
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knip said:
How will you cope without me :D
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Erm let's see..

Leave us the cookies and I'm sure we'll manage somehow. Or at least we'll pretend.



As to the race, its good to be back, what a long month that was eh? It is a shame that most of the race pre-amble will centre around the aborted return of MS, but such is the way of things I suppose.

Hope that Brawn have remembered that racing is about evolution not devolution.
 
Wonder how anyone can find out how many new\used engines a team have gone through so far.


15mins clean up time.
 
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