** Summer Transfer Window 2011/12 Season Rumours/Signings **

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With the greatest of respect we are doing it from the position of being title winners and CL finalists. We can afford to buy for "the future" as "the current" has just proven itself to be good enough to lift trophies.

You are doing it NEEDING a return to CL football. You need these players to peform NOW. We dont so much.

Your £20m midfielder should be a £20m player closer to CL qualification. Our £16m defender can learn from Vidic and Rio with no pressure.
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Right now I want £20m spent on a player who will give my team a decade or more of play, a team who can grow and build together as Utd did with the generation of players who are now coming to an end. What we NEED, imo, is to build a legacy not to simply achieve short term glory. What I have, is faith in what our manager chooses to do , I dont believe he is simply throwing around wads of cash for the hell of it.

I guess its funny to me that £16m spent on Jones is considered to be an ok signing by some yet £16m spent on Henderson is considered to be a bad signing. I dont know if thats down to the shirts they will be wearing or what. Its just amusing to me.

The prices are high, they are universally high, for all teams wanting to buy young english players, not just Liverpool. I'm just glad that this year we can target someone that Chelsea or Arsenal or Utd would like and not have to give up the chase because we cant spend the money.
 
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£80m for Ronaldo was a bargain. Agreed
There is no relationship between £80m for Ronaldo and £35m for Carroll for example. Totallly agree

Carroll is a good player but is horribly over priced. He may go on to give Liverpool £35m worth of service but at the time of signing it was far too much money. Carroll was probably a £20m player at the time but the "English player" tax of £5m + £10m fee for the latness in the window of the transaction / difficulty of replacing such an important player.


Henderson looks great and may go on to be a quality player ( I suspect he will) but at the time of signing he wasw far too much money.

£20m is a lot of money undoubtedly - but too much......hmmm Im not sure really.
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Tombstone said:
I guess its funny to me that £16m spent on Jones is considered to be an ok signing by some yet £16m spent on Henderson is considered to be a bad signing. I dont know if thats down to the shirts they will be wearing or what. Its just amusing to me.
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Really?

I think its quite clear.

Lets be honest, both players are overpriced.

However one player is going into team that is coming off a bad season and doesnt have CL football.

The other is going into the team that won the league and reached the CL final.

Your need for players NOW is surely greater than ours. While you are building for the future you need to get the CL back.

Personally i think Henderson will be quality but if the money spent on him doesnt bring CL football next season does it really matter if he will develop into a great player in a couple of years?
 
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It doesnt matter about Torres. It doesnt make Carroll a better or worse signing.

What did Carroll bring between Jan and May that made the premium worth it?

Both transfers were a disaster in that respect.

Carroll was bought for £35m when there was no rival bid, no prize to chase and frankly no need. He was a £15m player at best.

He can go on to be a huge success at Liverpool ( and i think he may) but that doesnt make it good business.
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Firstly there was a rival bid; Spurs were said to have bid ~£25m for him.

As for what Carroll brung to the side between January and May to justify paying a premium, that's the beauty of hindsight.

The club claimed to have identified Carroll as their main summer target even before Torres decided to leave. So when Torres was off they had a decision of going for him in January (knowing we'd pay a premium as it was a last minute deal) - enabling him to bed into the side earlier and providing us with a striker for the remainder of the season - or waiting until the summer and possibly getting him cheaper.

The fact that we had £50m from the Torres sale sitting in the bank account meant that clubs would demand a premium for their players, whether we spent it in January or in the summer.

And to be honest, how much cheaper could we have got him for in the summer? Given the fees for lower profile players and the fact that strikers always come at a premium, we'd be lucky to have got him in the summer for less than £30m. Not to mention the risk of losing out on him.
 
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FrankJH said:
I agree with the sentiment entirely - just thinking of the slim possibility of Berba going back to Spurs......

Utd have been desperately short of goals from CM for farrrrrrr too long, Im going to hope we buy experience to get some of those goals back
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Completely agree, the CM simply doesn't contribute enough goals. Were it not for the strikers and Nani, United would barely have scored any goals last year. Scholesy used to score a fair few goals from midfield, but not in recent years, and we really need an attacking midfielder who can pop up with goals as well as assists. Anderson, Carrick and Fletcher simply aren't going to do that, as good a players as they are in other respects. Actually, if you look at it that way, does Modric really score that many goals either? The best person I can think of would be Sneijder, as he scores and assists a fair few goals.
 

Frank, i dunno how to quote you when you edit my post!! :D

I dont think there was an "English tax" on Carroll in Jan. Liverpool could have done anything with that money. There was no need to buy.

Lets put it this way - If it had been Hodson rather than Dalglish in charge in January and the same events had unfolded how do you think it would have been recieved?
 
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Really?

I think its quite clear.

Lets be honest, both players are overpriced.

However one player is going into team that is coming off a bad season and doesnt have CL football.

The other is going into the team that won the league and reached the CL final.

Your need for players NOW is surely greater than ours. While you are building for the future you need to get the CL back.

Personally i think Henderson will be quality but if the money spent on him doesnt bring CL football next season does it really matter if he will develop into a great player in a couple of years?
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Depends what you are seeking if you ask me. If we didnt get CL football next season, but Henderson developed into a great player and we got CL football for the next 10 seasons after next season with him in midfield then I'm fine with that.

Up until the very tail end of the season, there was talk of us maybe nabbing 4th even this year. Thats with a poor season, with a mess of managerial times, with a terrible squad. If we can get close like that, with all that mess, then one might query just how much is needed to get 4th again soon. Maybe its not as much as some might suggest.

As I say, what we NEED can be ruminated over with many different outcomes, the CL next year would be nice and there is frankly stacks of the transfer window left to go (and I suspect stacks of money in the kitty yet) in which all manner of signings might occur. But if you asked me what I would prefer, a team that can gel together and last a decade around the top, or the CL next year, I will take the former thanks :)
 
Tombstone said:
Right now I want £20m spent on a player who will give my team a decade or more of play, a team who can grow and build together as Utd did with the generation of players who are now coming to an end. What we NEED, imo, is to build a legacy not to simply achieve short term glory. What I have, is faith in what our manager chooses to do , I dont believe he is simply throwing around wads of cash for the hell of it.

I guess its funny to me that £16m spent on Jones is considered to be an ok signing by some yet £16m spent on Henderson is considered to be a bad signing. I dont know if thats down to the shirts they will be wearing or what. Its just amusing to me.

.
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Spot on - even if it hurts to agree with a supporter of THAT club - lol
 
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BaZ87 said:
And to be honest, how much cheaper could we have got him for in the summer? Given the fees for lower profile players and the fact that strikers always come at a premium, we'd be lucky to have got him in the summer for less than £30m. Not to mention the risk of losing out on him.
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Being equally honest, if you were going into this transfer window with the Torres money in your pocket would you be bidding for Carroll?
 
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Really?

I think its quite clear.

Lets be honest, both players are overpriced.

However one player is going into team that is coming off a bad season and doesnt have CL football.

The other is going into the team that won the league and reached the CL final.

Your need for players NOW is surely greater than ours. While you are building for the future you need to get the CL back.

Personally i think Henderson will be quality but if the money spent on him doesnt bring CL football next season does it really matter if he will develop into a great player in a couple of years?
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If we're signing Henderson at the expense of players that are going to improve the side now, you would have a point. I don't think that's the case though and as I suspect you'll see, Henderson is only the start of a very busy transfer window for Liverpool.

If we've got the money, why miss out on signing players for the future?
 
Tombstone said:
As I say, what we NEED can be ruminated over with many different outcomes, the CL next year would be nice and there is frankly stacks of the transfer window left to go (and I suspect stacks of money in the kitty yet) in which all manner of signings might occur. But if you asked me what I would prefer, a team that can gel together and last a decade around the top, or the CL next year, I will take the former thanks :)
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From a football perspective id totally agree with you but the reality of the situation is a club like Liverpool NEEDS to get back in the CL as quickly as possible. 2+ years without it and you will struggle IMO.
 
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From a football perspective id totally agree with you but the reality of the situation is a club like Liverpool NEEDS to get back in the CL as quickly as possible. 2+ years without it and you will struggle IMO.
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I dont care about football perspectives or not, I only care about my perspective and from my perspective I dont mind a couple of seasons without the CL if it means a long term forming of a highly capable team in the long run which lasts a decade.
 
BaZ87 said:
If we're signing Henderson at the expense of players that are going to improve the side now, you would have a point. I don't think that's the case though and as I suspect you'll see, Henderson is only the start of a very busy transfer window for Liverpool.

If we've got the money, why miss out on signing players for the future?
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Agree totally. I guess the issue will be who else is brought in then.

Id still say £55m(ish) for Henderson and Carroll would make most eyes water!
 
Tombstone said:
I dont care about football perspectives or not, I only care about my perspective and from my perspective I dont mind a couple of seasons without the CL if it means a long term forming of a highly capable team in the long run which lasts a decade.
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Well your perspective needs to get with the programme then. Try signing a player of any note and keeping your owners happy if you are kicking around the Europa League for a couple of seasons.
 
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Well your perspective needs to get with the programme then. Try signing a player of any note and keeping your owners happy if you are kicking around the Europa League for a couple of seasons.
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I dont think my perspective needs to get with the "programme" at all. I support my team because I enjoy the entertainment of watching them, success is merely a bonus. I'd follow and enjoy the team even if we werent in Europe for another 20 years. Many have exclaimed that the people who follow the big teams are just gloryhunters, I like to think I'm proof that glory and trophies is not at the top of my agenda. Sorry if thats not the right "programme" for a supporter, but its mine and I'm happy with it.
 
placeholder said:
Agree totally. I guess the issue will be who else is brought in then.

Id still say £55m(ish) for Henderson and Carroll would make most eyes water!
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I made no sectret of the fact that I thought Carroll's fee was extortionate but not Henderson's. £16m for 1 of the most promising midfielders in the country that's already established themselves in a EPL side isn't that expensive in this day and age.

But either way, I'm not going to be complaining about us paying ott on players if it means we're getting our first choice targets rather than missing out on players for the sake of a couple of million and ending up with the 2nd, 3rd and 4th choice targets.
 
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