Digging a hole, I'm really not. You are as blind as the people who think a plane does not take of on a runway. A twisted logic though not enough knowledge. Yours is the same, you believe you are right, but you really aren't.
You dont seem to be reading my posts properly. I dont believe the plane doesn't take off.
Again you need to look at where the forces are directly linked.
Cars tyres rotate, a conveyer belt moves and is in direct contact with tyres. Therefore forces are directly link, they cancel each other out and car stays stationery.
On a plane the force comes through the engine and into the prop, which moves air and pulls plane forward, the conveyor belt is in contact with the tyres. No directl link between forces. Plane moves forward and takes off. Only real difference is wheels move twice as fast.
As I said I never said the plane deosn't take off. There is a link between the forces though - friction in the wheel bearings. See below.
On to helicopter. Turntable is linked to helicopter boady. Engine internals can still operate and connected to blades. No dirt link between forces. Blades can still spin.
I dont know why, but you seem to keep suggesting that the rotating part of an engine/motor (the rotor/output shaft/crankshaft - call it what you want) can go at any speed relative to the non-rotating part (stator/case/block - call it what you want). You seem to be suggesting this relationship is entirely irellevant - that my car engine can do 6000rpm (which is crankshaft relative to block, I hope you understand), but that if I spin my whole car in the opposite direction to the engine rotation (and hence spin the engine block) my engine can do 16000rpm, 60000rpm, 1000000rpm - doesn't matter - whatever speed I spin my car, the engine crankshaft will still be doing 6000rpm relative to the ground. Can't you see that's ridiculous? So if the speed of the helicoptor engine has a limit (which means the speed of the blades relative to the heli body has a limit) and the engine is operating at that limit, then if you rotate the helicoptor body (hence the engine block/case) the same speed in the opposite direction, then the speed of the blades with respect to the ground is 0. How can you not see that????
What is 1000rpm anticlockwise + 1000rpm clockwise?
Yes, 0!!
You have yet to answer my post #69. If you answered those questions - went through that thought process, you might understand what I and others are saying.
For the record:
The helicoptor takes off! (if you are happy that the engine can happily run at double it's rated speed and therefore run at normal speed wrt the ground and produce lift, the heli doesn't fall apart etc etc).
or...
The helicoptor doesn't take off! (if you say the engine has a fixed rpm limit and you run it at that max rpm and spin the helicoptor the other way at the same rpm, in which case the blades
are stationary wrt ground so dont produce lift).
The plane takes off! (if you consider rolling resistance of the tyres and friction in the wheel bearings negligable. Then the engines thrust just powers the plane along and it takes off with it's wheels spinning very fast)
or...
The plane doesn't take off! (if you include friction in the wheel bearings resulting in drag on the plane, and allow the conveyor belt to spin so fast that drag from friction in the wheel bearings is enough to overcome the thrust of the engines. An equally 'correct' answer just requiring more impossible super-materials)
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