i5 3570k or new amd trinity

[Martini1991]

Be objective, just don't come in saying ;

LOL,at this thread. People are debating the performance of a CPU which is being released in the next few days

Because that damn annoyed me, especially when you started further with the "You're attacking people" despite you saying the same thing, but then when I repeated it you said I'm defensive.

I am now, because of that bizarre display.

OTH,what if he could only afford an HD6850 and a Core i5 3570K?? He could probably get an A10/Core i3 for a similar budget. It really depends on the games he is playing.

He said GTX670.

I build plenty of PC's to suit the PC to the budget, I wouldn't suggest an i5 if it was a 6850.
I've handled 3 7850's in the past week for builds of similar power CPU wise, ranging from i3 3220's etc.

 

[lovelyhead]

There's previews of their performance.
And a G620 won't bottleneck a 7750, a 7750 > Trinity's IGP (We have performance figures of the IGP, it's less than a GT640)
Pricing won't be cheaper than current Llano, so you're looking at a little bit more, but gaming performance will be better.

If Trinity comes out at say 60 quid for the A10, do you really think I'd say get a G620? No, not a chance in hell, but it won't.

Apply some logic and common sense you can make a logical assumption which will likely be fact.

For the i3 3220? If an i3 2120 can relieve the bottleneck of a 7950 compared to a Phenom II X4, you can bet the i3 3220 won't bottleneck a GT670 much if at all.

I'm being defensive now Cat, because from my point of view, you're attacking me/questioning my stance, so I'm explaining.

EDIT : It's upto him to look at reviews when they come, not for me to tell him to, he shouldn't buy on my word, or anyone else's word, especially when we're speculating based on what's there now.



You're missing the point entirely though.

If it turns out a 5800k OC'ed can match/best a stock i5, what about when the stock i5 isn't enough anymore? You'll need to upgrade, the stock i5 can clock 40%, ergo lasting longer, thus better value.

The 670 will be a good card for at least the next 2 years. If the 5800K doesn't bottleneck it then brilliant. If I need to upgrade the 5800K down the line then I can sell it for at least £40 and then use the near £100 saving I made by not getting the 2500K + motherboard to go towards a better CPU.

Can you see where I am coming from? From a financial point of view the 5800K could be a very good CPU indeed.

 

[Martini1991]

The 670 will be a good card for at least the next 2 years. If the 5800K doesn't bottleneck it then brilliant. If I need to upgrade the 5800K down the line then I can sell it for at least £40 and then use the near £100 saving I made by not getting the 2500K + motherboard to go towards a better CPU.

Can you see where I am coming from? From a financial point of view the 5800K could be a very good CPU indeed.

No.
Because you're stating prices I simply wouldn't be buying at with the Intel set up.
There wouldn't be a 100 pound difference between the two set ups.

The 5800k will be a good CPU, that's for sure, but it isn't meant to be used as you're intending to use it. That's not the target market.

You'd want to be going to Vishera if you're hell bent on the "Value" AMD platform.

 

[lovelyhead]

No.
Because you're stating prices I simply wouldn't be buying at with the Intel set up.
There wouldn't be a 100 pound difference between the two set ups.

The 5800k will be a good CPU, that's for sure, but it isn't meant to be used as you're intending to use it. That's not the target market.

You'd want to be going to Vishera if you're hell bent on the "Value" AMD platform.

What is wrong with the way I intend to use it? If it doesn't bottleneck the GPU then it is sufficient for my needs. Spending any more speculating if a future graphics card a couple of years away will be bottlenecked by the 5800K is a waste of nearly £100 in my opinion.

 

[Martini1991]

Trinity is meant to be used for what it is, an APU.
That's the whole point in it, to also be thrown with a 6670 or whatnot to Crossfire with the IGP.

It's not meant for a high end CPU gaming solution.
That would belong to Vishera.

And you keep saying 100 quid, it wouldn't be 100 quid.

 

[lovelyhead]

Trinity is meant to be used for what it is, an APU.
That's the whole point in it, to also be thrown with a 6670 or whatnot to Crossfire with the IGP.

It's not meant for a high end CPU gaming solution.
That would belong to Vishera.

And you keep saying 100 quid, it wouldn't be 100 quid.

Why not? If it works, it works. I am only looking for a CPU that won't bottleneck a 670 at 1080p.

OK maybe not £100 but at least £70.

 

[Martini1991]

Because the Vishera should be better at a similar price to the Trinity for the 4 core.
It'll have the same cores, no IGP but L3 cache.
The point of Trinity is gaming on a budget as an all in one, not high end gaming, I can't repeat that enough.

And I'd say more like 60.
I'd pay the extra 60 quid to not have to upgrade my CPU earlier, while having consistently better performance, especially overclocked.

You're comparing two products that aren't meant to go up against each other for starters, Intel doesn't really have anything that can match Llano for gaming on a CPU as an all in one solution, let alone Trinity. Haswell should improve things somewhat for Intel in that area, but I don't think they'll best Trinity's IGP.

Just honestly wait for reviews and whatnot then buy your Trinity CPU and clock its balls off so you can elevate the bottleneck on a GTX670.
You won't be unimpressed with what it offers, but you obviously don't care enough to consider why other people wouldn't do that as you've repeated the same question and statement about 5 times now.

 

[Martini1991]

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/productlist.php?groupid=701&catid=1967&subid=1946


Surprised with the boards actually, they've gone really budget like H61, I figured they'd cost a bit more, but be really decent for the price.
Still can get H61 boards cheaper and at the same type of quality.
So, the difference between a H61 entry board and i5 3330 against a 5800k and entry board is like 35 quid.

 

[lovelyhead]

Seems I was being pessimistic with the prices!

The price difference between an Intel 2500K + Overclockable motherboard versus AMD 5800K + Motherboard = £136 in AMD's favour!

I used the cheapest Intel Z68 motherboard.

I don't know if the cheapest AMD motherboard will overclock well or not but that is a big price difference. If the performance of the 5800K can get close to the 2500K then this will be a bargain!

 

[Martini1991]

You're doing it wrong.
The difference between an i5 set up and 5800k set up is like 40 quid.

For a gaming rig with a dedicated GPU, a 5800K isn't the CPU for you, and it probably won't clock that well with the entry level board, so you'll end up with sub i5 performance.

That said, and I keep repeating, trinity isn't meant to be put with a GTX670, Vishera would be.

Don't know why I bother.

 

[lovelyhead]

You're doing it wrong.
The difference between an i5 set up and 5800k set up is like 40 quid.

For a gaming rig with a dedicated GPU, a 5800K isn't the CPU for you, and it probably won't clock that well with the entry level board, so you'll end up with sub i5 performance.

That said, and I keep repeating, trinity isn't meant to be put with a GTX670, Vishera would be.

Don't know why I bother.

If you are only buying the motherboard and CPU, according to the prices on overclockers.co.uk the difference is £137. Check for yourself if you don't believe me.

A good FM2 board for overclocking will probably be around £75 which takes the price difference down to about £110.

Again, and I keep repeating, if the CPU doesn't bottleneck the GPU what is the problem? If I don't plan on upgrading for a couple of years what have I got to lose?

 

[JonSmith]

As Martini says, the 5800k whilst being comparable to an i3 is not the best solution, since Vishera is going to be released in a couple of weeks and is likely to be much faster than either of them, but will still not compete with an i5 3570k. To summarise:

Value proposition: Vishera
Performance proposition: Core i5

I would suggest you wait a few weeks before making a decision.

 

[TALON1973]

sorry for being dumb .. and not read up on it .. but going by the ocuk descripton the 5800 can do 5 ghz on air cooling ...

isnt that good ... for a suposed budget all in one solution ?

 

[Martini1991]

sorry for being dumb .. and not read up on it .. but going by the ocuk descripton the 5800 can do 5 ghz on air cooling ...

isnt that good ... for a suposed budget all in one solution ?

Yes.
But he wants to pair it with a GTX670.

If the piledriver cores are good, and consistently clock, he'd be better getting Vishera and clocking that.

I'm not saying go Intel, I'm saying, don't get an APU for a GTX670.

Also, relative performance per clock of the Trinity stuff will be similar to a Phenom II.

 

[Martini1991]

If you are only buying the motherboard and CPU, according to the prices on overclockers.co.uk the difference is £137. Check for yourself if you don't believe me.

A good FM2 board for overclocking will probably be around £75 which takes the price difference down to about £110.

Again, and I keep repeating, if the CPU doesn't bottleneck the GPU what is the problem? If I don't plan on upgrading for a couple of years what have I got to lose?

Vishera would do the same thing better and at the same price.
And the i5 3330 and H61 board come to 180, it's like 40 quid difference.

 

[lovelyhead]

Vishera would do the same thing better and at the same price.
And the i5 3330 and H61 board come to 180, it's like 40 quid difference.

I was comparing a 2500K + cheapest overclocking motherboard which = the £137 / £110 (with a better motherboard) price difference compared to the 5800K.

 

[V F]

Buy AMD if you think it's best for you, just don't go telling us about the value argument.

But you can clearly state without a shadow of a doubt it isn't going to have i5 performance at stock as it stands out of the box, it just isn't going to happen.

Why is it AMD reminds me of the Ferrari F1 team? lost their pace in F1 from mid 08 and slowly coming back in 12 but still a long way to go. Sometimes AMD reminds me of HRT, Marussia etc that they just can't get their aero packages working after all these years.

I really miss the days from AMD like the X2's.

Sometimes in todays technology I see AMD as off road 4x4 vehicles where as Intel are like grunty sport cars.

 

[lovelyhead]

Seems you can buy the 5800K as cheap as £88.79. I really hope it gets good reviews.

 

[Martini1991]

Seems you can buy the 5800K as cheap as £88.79. I really hope it gets good reviews.

That 88.79 doesn't include P&P
Trinity will get good reviews, because it's a good APU, that's its purpose, not for high end gaming with a GTX670.
If you think Trinity will suit your needs, then wait for Vishera which will be the platform that is meant for high end gaming from AMD.

Why is it AMD reminds me of the Ferrari F1 team? lost their pace in F1 from mid 08 and slowly coming back in 12 but still a long way to go. Sometimes AMD reminds me of HRT, Marussia etc that they just can't get their aero packages working after all these years.

I really miss the days from AMD like the X2's.

Sometimes in todays technology I see AMD as off road 4x4 vehicles where as Intel are like grunty sport cars.

2009-2010 AMD were making their way back, Phenom II was decent enough for the price (Though being not enough these days) and Thuban added upto 50% performance + in some cases while bringing a much needed better IMC.

Just it all went a bit wrong in 2011, what with the massive wait from Thuban to Zambezi and the very disappointing overall performance.
2012's looking good, but CPU wise they're only where they should have been in 2011 (With Piledriver looking like around Phenom II clock for clock performance)

 

[V F]

2009-2010 AMD were making their way back, Phenom II was decent enough for the price (Though being not enough these days) and Thuban added upto 50% performance + in some cases while bringing a much needed better IMC.

Just it all went a bit wrong in 2011, what with the massive wait from Thuban to Zambezi and the very disappointing overall performance.
2012's looking good, but CPU wise they're only where they should have been in 2011 (With Piledriver looking like around Phenom II clock for clock performance)

Sadly I noticed my Phenom II X6 really struggling to drive CrossFire in Battlefield 3. More so Armoured kill. Even though I nearly got two years out of that chip.

Another good thing I've noticed since going Intel, my electricity meter isn't going through the roof from the overclocked Phenom II.