Poll: Syrian Chemical Weapon Attack

[scorza]

However, if the UN produce evidence that the Syrian regime used chemical weapons against it's people surely we would want a vote to decide whether or not to join an international coalition?

UN Weapons Inspectors aren't there to say who used CW, only if CW were used. You have to make your own judgement as to who used them.

 

[Schlong&Stable]

The reason, I really hate David Cameron. Because he destroying everythings with a massive cuts and the rich get richer, while the poor get poorest. The British hard working family is worse off than before. I do understand that UK are in serious debts but he shouldn't cutting everything too fast, far too fast. He also spending our money to foreign when we all need them.

What massive cuts? The cuts they have made were trivial!

 

[The Running Man]

Party politics aside for a moment, wouldn't it be a good thing if he calls another vote once the UN evidence (or lack of) is in? I agree calling the vote now was premature - but his hand was kind of forced by Obama.

However, if the UN produce evidence that the Syrian regime used chemical weapons against it's people surely we would want a vote to decide whether or not to join an international coalition?

The Un are not there to decide who launched the attack, merely to ascertain whether chemicals were used or not

 

[Orionaut]

This was a huge **** up by Cameron

To have this vote before the UN evidence is produced (or not) was suicide.
How ever this has nothing to do with Democracy or a new found faith in our MPs and parliament. It is purely point scoring and school boy bragging for Miliband who will never,ever make it as PM is and is an embarrassment to the nation.

Thats our real parliament, party politics, gutless everywhere else no matter who is in

Cameron failed to convince his own party that there was reason enough to go in and thats why he lost, he should have waited until the evidence was published, and come monday if there is undeniable evidence that Assad did it I have no doubt he will be back again for another vote

I dunno, A friend of mine this morning suggested that this might have been deliberate. By putting it to the vote and loosing Cameron can show himself to be trying to do the "Right thing" but without actually having to do it!

Ho Humm!

 

[platypus]

UN Weapons Inspectors aren't there to say who used CW, only if CW were used. You have to make your own judgement as to who used them.

The Un are not there to decide who launched the attack, merely to ascertain whether chemicals were used or not

I can see how you might have construed that from what I said, however the wording was quite specific. Not if the UN decide, rather if the UN produce evidence that the Syrian regime used chemical weapons. Unless you think I was suggesting they might fix the evidence, which I wasn't.

 

[Glaucus]

I dunno, A friend of mine this morning suggested that this might have been deliberate. By putting it to the vote and loosing Cameron can show himself to be trying to do the "Right thing" but without actually having to do it!

Ho Humm!

Yep it could be a brilliant move.
Keeps us/France etc on side, whisks going hands are tied.

But like normal too much politics, rather than doing what is right.

 

[platypus]

The reason, I really hate David Cameron. Because he destroying everythings with a massive cuts and the rich get richer, while the poor get poorest. The British hard working family is worse off than before. I do understand that UK are in serious debts but he shouldn't cutting everything too fast, far too fast. He also spending our money to foreign when we all need them.

I hate him really because he had costing my job lost. All his fault. I never voted for him, the UK didn't voted for him in last election. He got in because of bloody cheek of Nick Clegg.

I just hope David Cameron will resigned and give the job to Boris Johnson. I believe Boris Johnson is the right man for Tory leader.

I don't like Ed Miliband at all. David Miliband are the right man for Labour Party.

Is English your native language?

 

[wildman]

which is what will happen. If they have the best evidence available, the shells that were used, the SAA will just say they were stolen. Theres comms *apparently* about SAA positions being told to prepare for an attack, about low level commanders asking why they had shot the munitions etc. nothing will ever be 100% and im sure thats good enough for most people to warrant sitting on their hands.

stealing shells is one thing, having the delivery system is another. So if there is no evidence that the 'rebels' actually had control of they required delivery systems then a case can be built. However currently there is nothing other than supposition which is why I beleive the government were correct in having this vote pre UN report and should have another one post report when everyone has had an opportunity to examine the findings.

Obama has already decided it was Assad and that much is clear from his 'shot accross the bows' rhetoric. But last I checked Obama was not responsible for UK foriegn policy............................

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Is English your native language?

He could be typing on a phone??

 

[Devlish]

Yep it could be a brilliant move.
Keeps us/France etc on side, whisks going hands are tied.

But like normal too much politics, rather than doing what is right.

thats a bit naieve, almost everyone agrees his authority has taken a heavy hit, and thats what its 100% about when youre leader.

Milliband on the other hand has been playing politics, but nothing changes my opinion of that weasel.

As for France, they'll never work with milliband now, nor will the Democrats. As were not that keen on going into europe either, hard to see what influence we'll have on anything in the future, except for finanical - maybe thats the best way for our little isle.

 

[Glaucus]

Ratings go up and down all the time that's nothing new. What's more important is the international standing ATM. How many times has Cameron taken a hit, just for yougov polls to show him coming back. How many times has the coalitions about to implode according to the media.

Population have short memories and base there opinion on like the last two big new hitting policies.

 

[Devlish]

stealing shells is one thing, having the delivery system is another. So if there is no evidence that the 'rebels' actually had control of they required delivery systems then a case can be built. However currently there is nothing other than supposition which is why I beleive the government were correct in having this vote pre UN report and should have another one post report when everyone has had an opportunity to examine the findings.

Obama has already decided it was Assad and that much is clear from his 'shot accross the bows' rhetoric. But last I checked Obama was not responsible for UK foriegn policy............................

You have more faith in the UN than I do. I would hope a report would be strong in its conclusions but its more likely to be filled with 'ifs', 'buts' and 'maybes' once all the lobbying is done. Dont doubt it, at this moments the inspectors are coming under massive pressure - it will be from all sides, but theyll try and placate as many members as possible and end up with some middle of the road nonsense.

 

[dunker]

i think Dave did well, his "i get it" remark shows us he respects democracy and parliament.
it's looking like Obama is not showing the same respect for his own countrys constitution.

 

[wildman]

You have more faith in the UN than I do. I would hope a report would be strong in its conclusions but its more likely to be filled with 'ifs', 'buts' and 'maybes' once all the lobbying is done. Dont doubt it, at this moments the inspectors are coming under massive pressure - it will be from all sides, but theyll try and placate as many members as possible and end up with some middle of the road nonsense.

SO if there is no real evidence supporting one theory or the other, and the UK / US decide they will go ahead with air strikes...... exactly who will they be targeting and why ?

 

[Castiel]

i think Dave did well, his "i get it" remark shows us he respects democracy and parliament.
it's looking like Obama is not showing the same respect for his own countrys constitution.

The US doesn't have the same kind of parliamentary sovereignty as we do, so Obama is not bound by that comparison.

 

[Castiel]

thats a bit naieve, almost everyone agrees his authority has taken a heavy hit, and thats what its 100% about when youre leader.

I disagree, authority in the British Democratic System lies with Parliament, not the Prime Minister. The idea that this is some kind of judgement on Cameron himself is simply party politicking.

 

[sports_brah]

Who cares about these people? Let them sort themselves out.

 

[Efour]

I disagree, authority in the British Democratic System lies with Parliament, not the Prime Minister. The idea that this is some kind of judgement on Cameron himself is simply party politicking.

Exactly.

 

[Devlish]

SO if there is no real evidence supporting one theory or the other, and the UK / US decide they will go ahead with air strikes...... exactly who will they be targeting and why ?

Oh there will be evidence, you cant deliver that stuff and not have the delivery vehicles left behind - they dont go bang for the most part. So we'll probably have some shells. Of course they'll be able to say what it was - sarin etc. They can also establish what type of capability was needed to deliver it, whether it was actually delivered in that manner (as opposed to being placed there and detonated) and general telemetry data if it was.

So they can say on the balance of probabilities that the SAA have the capability and the evidence points to them firing it. But unless they have the guy who ordered it and the guy who loaded it and the guy who pulled the switch, you can never be 100% sure.

Waiting for 100% sure is a mugs game. Its like we dont prosecute anyone for murder unless they admit it. throw in the politics around the UN, the various influences and manipulations, the drafts for review and approval, the jobs on the line and the favours to cut...

WMDs are the new napalm apparently... not that the SAA didnt already use napalm on a kids schools yesterday, ok its the new napalm +.

Who cares about these people? Let them sort themselves out.

Go away troll.

 

[Theophany]

Yeah, how so. I'm getting irritated with all this, and again it goes back to the party politics and posturing. Perhaps he's lost some leadership within his own party by not wining the vote but so what?

It says everything about how bad our political system is that a PM doing what he's been forced into doing (by the US), but then taking the result of that vote and standing by it is considered to show him up so badly. The way the media have reported this is disgraceful, but then I'm not sure why I'm surprised.

Couldn't agree more. If anything it's a victory for democracy - although a sad indictment that this is not recognised and needs to be celebrated.