What so I can help you up to hang yourself?
ISIS and Islamic militants - discussion
- Thread starter robfosters
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What so I can help you up to hang yourself?
Soldato
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You made a mistake, no need to hang yourself...
Soldato
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now the west wants to arm the kurds........
that's going to work well you know since they don't want to be part of iraq they want to be their own independent country...
Let's not forget the same kurds had a truce with ISIS for months...
History shows the same weapons we give the kurds will be used against us in the near future.
It's happened every time the west has ever armed anyone in the middle east.
and we don't have a responsibility towards Iraq it's their own fault they are in this mess, they were giving everything an army needs and just abandoned it for the enemy it's not our problem.
How long will it take before the west bombs Abu Dhabi , Qatar and the rest of the countries that fund terrorists like ISIS ? we never even warn them against doing it just sit back selling them tanks, jets etc
that's going to work well you know since they don't want to be part of iraq they want to be their own independent country...
Let's not forget the same kurds had a truce with ISIS for months...
History shows the same weapons we give the kurds will be used against us in the near future.
It's happened every time the west has ever armed anyone in the middle east.
and we don't have a responsibility towards Iraq it's their own fault they are in this mess, they were giving everything an army needs and just abandoned it for the enemy it's not our problem.
How long will it take before the west bombs Abu Dhabi , Qatar and the rest of the countries that fund terrorists like ISIS ? we never even warn them against doing it just sit back selling them tanks, jets etc
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Soldato
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Not sure about the whole arming Kurds thing. They do need some sort of protection but I'm yet to be convinced this is the correct way of doing things. Just have a look a Libya, the West armed tribal waring factions against Gaddafi and how did that turn out. Not sure that Turkey would approve this either and being an important NATO allay in the region surely they'd get some say in the matter. At the end of the day the West royally ****** up Iraq and left it a total mess. The supposed rebuilding of a country and defense for was at best a poor joke. I've no issue with them however taking military action against ISIS to prevent their continuing violence and progession. Not too desimilar to Frances approach in Mali a while ago. We need a coalition of countries to step up and take action be it in the form of airstrikes or tactical assault teams on the ground.
If only there was an organisation that could unite nations in a joint effort to do this sort of thing, rather than be white helmeted ***** about as effective as jello. Well, in their absence i'll take a nation willing to make a stand.
Iraq may have been a disaster, but it was a lesson for the West as well. You can only do so much with air power, and it will eb a cold day in hell before combat troops descend into that mess. So we need someone to be on the ground, and the most logical course would be to arm fighters willing to do the immediate job. The only other option is to let them expand this caliphate until the whole ME is burning. Some might say leave them be, not our fight, but leaving them be is what got us here in the first place and who knows what they'll do next.
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i have no problem with arming the kurds - they are a moderate and kind people who take refugees of all faiths. They have also been screwed several times over the years by our governments, especially the US.
We have screwed them again by arming and encouraging ISIS, then leaving the kurds to handle the mess we made.
I hope the kurds get their independent state, although maybe the new irag pm will be more willing to include them, unlike the idiot last one.
We have screwed them again by arming and encouraging ISIS, then leaving the kurds to handle the mess we made.
I hope the kurds get their independent state, although maybe the new irag pm will be more willing to include them, unlike the idiot last one.
i dont think we armed ISIS - We did let them flourish by refusing to intervene in Syria, leaving their component parts to be the most effective force on the battlefield and therefore get the best of the war booty to the detriment of the moderate rebels (who ended up fighting them anyway, in some parts of the country in tandem with the SAA). We also armed the Iraqi Army who basically gave ISIS anything that would slow them down as they fled. But I cant think of anytime arms have been given to them directly.
Soldato
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The truce was that the Kurds and ISIS would stop killing each other, not to work together. I'm in favour of not only arming the Kurds, but helping them to establish an independent Kurdistan. They seem to be one of the few secular and benign groups in the Middle East.
think the turks will be just as upset over an independent Kurdistan , since they want southern turkey and have been killing Turkish nationals in a terrorist campaign for years.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkey–PKK_conflict
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkey–PKK_conflict
170,000 Syrian dead. I don't think we can talk.
I thought you were for non intervention, so wouldn't that be us doing exactly the same?
we aren't watching it happen through binoculars like the kurds were on their border within shooting range
Arming the Kurds would be the lesser of many evil but the long term implications would definitely need a lot of examination.
At face value they seem more interested in a moderate stance and keeping good relationships with the west and other stable entities in the region but I don't know enough about their history, possible repression, etc. in the past and so on as to whether that would all change if they became a powerful force to be reckoned with.
At face value they seem more interested in a moderate stance and keeping good relationships with the west and other stable entities in the region but I don't know enough about their history, possible repression, etc. in the past and so on as to whether that would all change if they became a powerful force to be reckoned with.
Soldato
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And they are meant to risk their people when the US/UK/FR won't? They don't even have a state, why should they interfere?
i say 'we', i guess i mean the US where it is an open secret that the CIA supplied them weapons so they could fight Assad with them - standard CIA practice.
well, they didn't have the means to stop it and were concerned with defending their own people. The central bagdad government has for years withheld weapons and money to the kurds in violation to the constitution they all sign up to.
again, things have changed recently - there is a real truce and turkey-kurd relations are very good now, mainly because they need each other for economic reasons (the selling of kurd oil/gas) - turkey have said that they want iraq to stay together but i doubt they will be bothered if a kurdistan appears - as long as they are peaceful.
exxon and a lot of US workers are in 'kurdistan' now so they seem to be starting to care - fickle bunch
