Greece Elections

watching the debate in Greek parl. live - (translated) - fascinating - and I'm not into politics

I'm really undecided as I've nowhere near enough info to make a real decision (or knowledge of the subject)

but I do feel like perhaps they made some bad decisions in past - but are now being fairly unfairly pushed down generations of problems and feel sorry for them
 
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Sometimes there's a case for politics to trump economics but in this crisis isn't onenof those occasions.

Greece was meant to have passed some new laws by midnight local time its now 1 o'clock in the morning in Athens, yet another deadline missed.
 
So the curtain rises on the next act. Now to see whether we can avoid contributing to Greece's short term cash needs which will be discussed today.
 
I think Monday will be the next interesting development as I highly suspect they won't have 3.5 billion down the back of the sofa to hand over to the ECB.
 
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Cosimo said:
So the curtain rises on the next act. Now to see whether we can avoid contributing to Greece's short term cash needs which will be discussed today.
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I don't think we'll be able to avoid this, but there'll probably be some sort of Osborne fudge to make it seem like we haven't, I expect some sort of meaningless "ring-fencing" terminology will be used.
 
Quick skim through the news shows these were the new laws passed:

Thursday morning's vote approved:
- VAT changes including a top rate of 23% to take in processed food and restaurants; a 13% rate to cover fresh food, energy bills, water and hotel stays; and a 6% rate for medicines and books
- An increase in corporation tax from 26% to 29% for small companies
- An increase in luxury taxes on big cars, boats and swimming pools
- An end to early retirement by 2022, increasing the retirement age to 67


So they're making a small start on finally taxing the rich.

I think they clearly still need to address their lack of an income tax system. I think something I came across the other day suggested Greece loses around 30bn euros a year from uncollected tax - that's insane!

It's about time the rich start paying their way to support their country. I just can't understand how it was ever allowed to get into this state (possibly some serious corruption) but surely anyone working in the tax office when lawyers and doctors are declaring their earnings as only 12k, would think, hang on, something isn't right here.

Also the end to early retirement, i would assume means if you haven't retired by 2022, then you're working till your 67. That's 7 years away, why not have that change implemented by 2016/2017.
 
Increase in luxury tax is pointless if you arent going to enforce it or collect it.

As I said earlier in this thread, out of 17,000 swimming pools in Athens only 324 people had declared them and paid the tax on them.

The tax rate can be 10,000 euros per pool but pointless if your collection rate is only 2%.
 
Semple said:
It's about time the rich start paying their way to support their country. I just can't understand how it was ever allowed to get into this state (possibly some serious corruption) but surely anyone working in the tax office when lawyers and doctors are declaring their earnings as only 12k, would think, hang on, something isn't right here.

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Corruption or just their attitude of dont care. After all on those same returns you put your debt repayments and since doctors and lawyers have on average larger debt payments than their declared income, every lawyer and doctor must be living on borrowed money for food,clothes etc. This was never addressed or questioned. And then mortgage lenders apply a 4 times multiple to doctors/laywers declared income to get their true approx income otherwise they would never get a mortgage.

Its not even hidden. Its just part and parcel of accepted life in Greece. As that Greek doctor said on the Greek phone in "only the stupid pay tax"
 
Greebo said:
Increase in luxury tax is pointless if you arent going to enforce it or collect it.

As I said earlier in this thread, out of 17,000 swimming pools in Athens only 324 people had declared them and paid the tax on them.

The tax rate can be 10,000 euros per pool but pointless if your collection rate is only 2%.
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this

the only tax changes that they will really collect on are the ones that will really hurt the bread and butter workers i.e VAT increases and increase in small business corporation tax. The bailout plan is idiotic, Tsipras has lost his balls (probably didn't have any to begin with). He was voted in on the "No Austerity" ticket and has now effectively sold his entire nation to the poor house for at least this and the next generations lifetimes.

The solution for Greece is to leave the Eurozone, clinging on for dear life as they are now will only result in further punitive measures being laid down on a lot of people who really can't take much more. The EU should kick this dead horse out now before it starts stinking the place up...................
 
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