Two schoolgirls abused by 60 men in Aylesbury child sex ring, court hears

[SeriousBusiness]

no convictions vs population %.

iirc its 52 out of the last 60 men for these gang grooming siutations have been ethically Asian, for a population that's what 1% of the total population thats a worrying disproportionality.

I'm sure if you look at all the cases nationally, the numbers would be a lot lower instead of just going off the ones that are reported in the news. Either way, it's not about what their ethnicity is, its about bad people taking advantage of vulnerable children.

 

[RDM]

Who were you btw?
Five year old account using the name of a one year old childrens show in a thread about paedophiles. Anyway, i don't recall who you were, so I am assuming name change?

You can't use an arguement of people are picking on paedophiles for being muslim, while in the same reply saying a good isn't a good muslim for dating a heterosexual male white man.
Insanity. It demonstrates your judgement of someone you have never met, your condemnation of her, for either being female, or loose in morales, or dismissive of her own religion while in the same breath saying ithers shouldn't judge Islam on the actions of it paedophilic followers. Well true they shouldn't. Instead the can judge it directly in your judgemental dismissive statements.

So who were you? Can someone enlighten me?

majnu I believe, which explains the posting style quite well.

 

[asim18]

Seriously, reading the first 2 pages and all you can argue about is race and religion.

It's like those 2 schoolgirls are non existent. Sheesh

In the world of psychology it's known as a defence mechanism, specifically projection.

Basically, when one partakes secretly in societally unacceptable things (peadophilia), one will strongly portray that this societally unacceptable taboo is the cause of an external race of people with whom they do not belong to or do not associate with.

Anyone remember when that study revealed something like 1 in 10 people were paedophiles? OK keep that fraction in your head for a minute, now lets just assume people are correct and that 3/10 of all Pakistanis are paedophiles.

Now lets get on with some lovely statistics...

According to Census, white population in Britain is 55,010,359, therefore according to the fraction there are 5,501,035 white paedophiles in Britain today.

Pakistani population is 1,174,983. 3/10 of that is 352,494 Pakistani paedophiles.

So yeah, lets all focus on the minorities, while the elites can get on with their paedophilia. Yep, you heard it from me first, the authorities (1/10 of whom a paedophiles as well!) planned a charade to get people to shift focus by turning a blind eye to Asian paedophiles specifically.

Is this the whole reason why the authorities turned a blind eye to gang rape by ethnic minorities for such a long time, so that it could be anchored as a problem stemming from ethnic minorities so then the focus shifts on one type of person who can potentially be a paedophile, while the majority of paedophiles don't have anything to worry about?

Call me paranoid all you want, I strongly believe most news articles are a form of mind control.

 

[SonniLombardi]

Eleven men on trial at Old Bailey accused of committing sexual offences against youngsters allegedly conditioned into believing abuse was 'normal'

NORMAL?! gtfo of Britain.

 

[dowie]

Oh the "My mate is Muslim" or in your case "My G/F is Muslim" angle lmao
If she was a good practicing Muslim then she wouldn't even be with you in the first place.

I'm growing sick and tired of the same old people circle jerking and blaming Islam for the actions of a few. Let's get those Muslamic Ray Guns out shall we.

that depends on perspective really

IMO a 'good' muslim would be one who doesn't take it too seriously and can date non muslims, perhaps just does Ramadan for tradition/family etc..

in your opinion it is something different

in the opinion of some a 'good' muslim should be joining ISIS...

different strokes for different folks... hopefully as education improves and people become more integrated into mainstream society then the people who don't take all this religious stuff too seriously will be in the majority...

 

[Mark A]

Wait, so the girl was abused by 60 men and only 6 are being convicted?

 

[Tefal]

You are aware that a byproduct of this is a strong incentive for child abusers to kill their victims after to reduce the chance of getting caught.

not really most kids don't report abuse, and as has been shown those that do don't get listened to.

dead children though attract police attention.

of the 5 child abuse victims i know 3 didn't report it, 1 did and got no where and the other did report it but gave up as found it too hard.

 

[Tefal]

Are some people deliberately ignoring the fact that the majority of abusers are from the Indian subcontinent? Doesn't that in itself point to a specific issue rather than a religious one which covers all ethnic groups?

its ok to blame race and ethnicity but not religion

 

[Tefal]

Wait, so the girl was abused by 60 men and only 6 are being convicted?

its almost impossible to track down the blokes who've only met them once for an hour in a hotel room after paying the gang.

 

[Tefal]

I'm sure if you look at all the cases nationally, the numbers would be a lot lower instead of just going off the ones that are reported in the news. Either way, it's not about what their ethnicity is, its about bad people taking advantage of vulnerable children.

nope that's the convictions not the news.

and the main issue with ethnicity has been these cases were KNOWN to be happening but were ignored because officers and social workers did not want to appear racist.

children got raped, and sold into prostitution and tortured because people were afraid to say there was a problem...you're now doing the exact thing those people were worried about.

 

[bitslice]

If she was a good practicing Muslim then she wouldn't even be with you in the first place.

Much of what constitutes a "good {female} muslim" in such communities derives solely from the associated repressive and medieval patriarchal culture, and has absolutely sod all to do with islam.

 

[Raz]

its ok to blame race and ethnicity but not religion

Lol...I'm blaming culture mate.

What's the solution? Send them back? Nope.

Identify and support vulnerable children and people in general, including looking at and tackling root causes e.g. abusive parents, substance abuse.
Provide good effective support for victims
Harsher sentences for perpetrators
Tackle cultural issues and engage community leaders so that they take a lead role

 

[SeriousBusiness]

nope that's the convictions not the news.

and the main issue with ethnicity has been these cases were KNOWN to be happening but were ignored because officers and social workers did not want to appear racist.

children got raped, and sold into prostitution and tortured because people were afraid to say there was a problem...you're now doing the exact thing those people were worried about.

How did you conclude that I was worried about being racist? Like I said, it doesn't matter who you are, if you take advantage of a minor then you suffer the consequences.

 

[Tefal]

Lol...I'm blaming culture mate.

a culture based on religion?

Tackle cultural issues and engage community leaders so that they take a lead role

the community leaders typically being the imams?

 

[Raz]

a culture based on religion?

No, as there are common issues across the major religions in that area. For example, honour based killings and arranged marriages are found in Muslim, Hindu and Sikh communities.

the community leaders typically being the imams?

Not necessarily but could include them obviously.

 

[semi-pro waster]

I'm actually generally not supportive of the death penalty. As you say whether it's a deterrent or not really is in question. From what I've read there's very little evidence to suggest it is - in most cases.
The trouble is we don't know whether it would be a deterrent for crimes below the levels of premeditated murder or not. Generally if you're willing to take a life you're a special kind of starfish anyway so whether you can truly contemplate the outcome of that action is questionable.
However...if you know you'd get nothing more than a slap on the wrist for a minor crime you might be willing to risk it for the gain. You know on the other hand that if it risks death it just probably isn't worth stealing those pokemon cards!

If you're assuming a logical thought process as a precursor then perhaps some people are put off crime by the punishment but that does also assume a high likelihood of being detected and the crime being brought to bear at the perpetrators door - otherwise it's simply a risk factor to be weighted in the decision to commit the crime.

It also assumes that the crime is one that would be attractive but for the punishment which follows and I'm not sure that most people would wish to commit crimes irrespective of the punishment. Some people would but it's perfectly possible (probable?) that there's a lack of control there and they would commit crimes regardless as they couldn't help themselves (for want of a better phrase).

The question you should be asking is does it occur equally across all groups and the evidence suggests that is not the case and that does directly bear on the thread topic doesn't it.

Demonising particular cultures or religions isn't especially helpful when most of them can live perfectly healthy ordinary lives without issue and child abuse sadly exists across all group of people. You may be right that it's not equal across all groups although given the issues with reporting it's difficult to say with any degree of certainty precisely what the figures are. If there's evidence that child abuse is more prevalent in particular groups then of course it should be tackled there. However I don't think that horrible crimes such as child abuse should be used as a way to push an agenda against particular groups, the mavity of the crimes mean a bit of cheap point scoring at the same time is distasteful to say the least.

 

[Sega Mega Dave]

It's actually 7% (as of the 2011 Census).

Will continue to grow at an alarming rate. Delightful.

 

[Xordium]

Demonising particular cultures or religions isn't especially helpful when most of them can live perfectly healthy ordinary lives without issue and child abuse sadly exists across all group of people. You may be right that it's not equal across all groups although given the issues with reporting it's difficult to say with any degree of certainty precisely what the figures are. If there's evidence that child abuse is more prevalent in particular groups then of course it should be tackled there. However I don't think that horrible crimes such as child abuse should be used as a way to push an agenda against particular groups, the mavity of the crimes mean a bit of cheap point scoring at the same time is distasteful to say the least.

Who said anything about demonising? It is helpful, effective and efficient to target the populations and the areas where crime has been shown to occur. I have never said it should be used as an agenda - I actually think you are completely missing the point - investigations are not being pursued and people are not being prosecuted and children were not helped because of an agenda. Whether that agenda is Islam, Catholicism, media popularity, or political position I frankly don't give a flying **** - children should be protected and people actively stopping them from being protected for some warped PC ideal cause should be challenged.

No-one should be hidden from facing the consequences of their actions and the denial and the 'it's not helpful' remarks are the not helpful things. Or did you think the BBC shouldn't have had any self-examination of their past and current actions because that too wouldn't 'be helpful'. I find it distasteful that people have suffered because we are not allowed to challenge certain groups because they are protected. So I guess we are very very different in our opinions here.

If you look at the WHO data it is clear child abuse is more prevalent in some cultures and we know from crime statistics and data in this country it is more prevalent in some cultures and institutions and amongst certain individuals - the common component being those people who exercise power over children and who have the ability to prevent sanction against their actions.

 

[bitslice]

However I don't think that horrible crimes such as child abuse should be used as a way to push an agenda against particular groups

Misogynist cultures produce misogynist crime, this isn't pushing an agenda, this is stating the obvious.

And as such that culture needs to be universally challenged and to be expected to change, in the same way our 'Lad' culture is challenged.

Nobody gets a free ride to be an ****hole just because they are ethnic, and nobody should be allowed to perpetuate their ****hole culture just because that's how their parents behaved back home.

 

[Danthus]

Misogynist cultures produce misogynist crime, this isn't pushing an agenda, this is stating the obvious.

And as such that culture needs to be universally challenged and to be expected to change, in the same way our 'Lad' culture is challenged.

Nobody gets a free ride to be an ****hole just because they are ethnic, and nobody should be allowed to perpetuate their ****hole culture because that's how their parents behaved back home.

Evidence says they do.