Forum "Disputes"

[Josh]

I think it is a good thing.

I have been rightly suspended for bad language on a couple of occasions I believe and now try and keep my posts clean. But I do see some odd warnings etc that go around.

I would have liked, at the time an avenue to speak to the mods involved, my posts were deleted with the catch line "speak to the moderating team if you have a problem" - which I found funny being banned etc.

But in all honesty they wouldn't have lifted the ban, it was a rule break and the punishment although annoying was correct.

Maybe give people a 2 day cooling off period after a suspension/ban before they can post in there? Not sure if it is possible to implement or not, but silly things get said in the heat of the moment.

Maybe suspend them for 7 days, but after 2 allow them to post in the disputes section, my last paragraph didn't come across very clearly after re-reading it.

 

[BuffetSlayer]

Never had any cause to contact a moderator or admin, but I guess a sub-forum as described would be useful.

I think making the forum public for all would be messy if you allowed posting. However, you could feasibly allow transparency by universal access but only the OP and mod team can post, the rest can only read. This would help to remove the veil, be it perceived or real. It would make both users and admins more accountable too because all would be under scrutiny and any decisions would have to be relevant and justifiable.

The other thing I wanted to mention is that if making the sub-forum open to all is not a favourable option, perhaps a public synopsis of outcomes based on grievances/disputes filed could be presented, or each dispute thread made public once it is concluded and locked.

As a mere bystander to moderating decisions I do not pretend to be in possession of all of the facts, but it does sometimes seem like there is inconsistency. But to be fair, the nature of moderating a forum this size is a tricky subject. Rules that are set in stone and ruthlessly upheld, like in MM, tend to be overbearing and do not allow for honest mistakes. I would not be in favour of such a system. But then if you open the rules up to moderator discretion, you will inevitably get some inconsistency and I think that is something some users here need to accept. To make a forum an enjoyable place to be you have to try and find the middle ground and to be fair some users push the rules on purpose just to get a response. That is not to say mods should be beyond reproach, just that a bit of give and take is needed. Likewise, mods need to step up to the plate and admit when they have got it wrong.

 

[tom_e]

Jesus wept, this thread really is showing that some of you need to get out more.

 

[BuffetSlayer]

Jesus wept, this thread really is showing that some of you need to get out more.

Says the man with over 17k posts!

 

[tom_e]

Says the man with over 17k posts!

That's nothing in almost 12 years

It's less about the post counts though and more about the sense of entitlement some people have when this place is provided for free for anyone to use and the amount of annoyance a bit of time away from it seems to cause.
Also never mind what you actually think of the mod team they put in a lot of their own free hours for some little oik to come along and get all arsey about a decision.

 

[BuffetSlayer]

That's nothing in almost 12 years

It's less about the post counts though and more about the sense of entitlement some people have when this place is provided for free for anyone to use and the amount of annoyance a bit of time away from it seems to cause.
Also never mind what you actually think of the mod team they put in a lot of their own free hours for some little oik to come along and get all arsey about a decision.

Aye, can't disagree with you there.

 

[Andybtsn]

That's nothing in almost 12 years

It's less about the post counts though and more about the sense of entitlement some people have when this place is provided for free for anyone to use and the amount of annoyance a bit of time away from it seems to cause.
Also never mind what you actually think of the mod team they put in a lot of their own free hours for some little oik to come along and get all arsey about a decision.

It's a thankless task at times and I'm sure all the Mods have thought what's the point but it's a community most of us have been in for years and I'd be lost without it!

There will be countless times we will be on a train, plane, in a meeting, at work, changing the babies nappy when RTM's come in that we have to deal with or ask another Mod to sort etc, we do work hard to ensure the place runs smoothly and I think it does and it's a credit to the hard work of us all.
However, the users make it what it is and it's not hard to moderate as most are well behaved and adhere by the rules. It's a good place!

Peace xxx

 

[Freefaller]

Well, we now have this sub forum for discussion. Whether this is a good idea or not is yet to be seen. Hopefully you guys will find it a useful pathway to contact the moderation team and help clarify why we took the action we did.

That said, I don't really feel we should/ought to have to defend our upkeep of the rules or how we run the forum, but at the same time there is enough interest and discussion about decisions over the forum that it detracts from threads or ends up (much to my chagrin) like this thread, where, in spite of our broad shoulders, we get a fair bit of flak for moderating a forum - it does get tiresome.

As a result, people do make perhaps harsher decisions, and perhaps our team does not always get it right 100% of the time. That said, many of the times that a person has contacted, and either apologised or explained their interpretation of the situation the decision has been reversed and/or the explanation from the moderating team's point of view has been clearer. Hopefully having this forum will allow people a more relaxed and less confrontational area where a well reasoned explanation/discussion can take place without peer pressure or other people muddying the waters.

The rules are guidelines, if we were to enforce them as black and white it would be a less fun place to be, but also, the fact we have a broad range of people in the team helps to make better decisions. Whilst a member of the team may suspend or act in a way that may not always be correct, generally tough decisions or uncertainties are discussed as a team to make sure there is a consensus. It does create a slightly less agile team, but because the user base is so massive here, and there are so many different cultures and types of people we will never be able to please every all of the time. I'd rather we upset people some of the time, and please people most of the time than the other way around.

People keep bringing up the past, as you are entitled to, but we are a very different place to where we were. If it wasn't we wouldn't have hundreds of new registrations a week (sometimes a day!). Also, people stick around, despite the moaning and the "unfairness" of it all, people stay here and contribute and enjoy being part of the forums. So from a slightly self praising point of view, I think we do a pretty good job of running this forum.

Irrespective of the minority who seem to think we are some sort archaic entity with antediluvian prejudices and opinions - on the whole we get it right nearly every time, generally with a soft touch. We do increase the thumb screw pressure when people take it too far, either on purpose or by lack of self control. It does very much work both ways - and whilst we haven't always got it right, boy oh boy you can be sure that many of you have stepped way over the line - yet, seem defiant and stubborn enough not to accept the consequences. That, in my opinion, is unfair on the team.

So hopefully having a place to discuss things will help diffuse issues going forward and keep the petty squabbles over moderation off the main part of the forum.

 

[pickle1972]

Well, we now have this sub forum for discussion. Whether this is a good idea or not is yet to be seen. Hopefully you guys will find it a useful pathway to contact the moderation team and help clarify why we took the action we did.

That said, I don't really feel we should/ought to have to defend our upkeep of the rules or how we run the forum, but at the same time there is enough interest and discussion about decisions over the forum that it detracts from threads or ends up (much to my chagrin) like this thread, where, in spite of our broad shoulders, we get a fair bit of flak for moderating a forum - it does get tiresome.

As a result, people do make perhaps harsher decisions, and perhaps our team does not always get it right 100% of the time. That said, many of the times that a person has contacted, and either apologised or explained their interpretation of the situation the decision has been reversed and/or the explanation from the moderating team's point of view has been clearer. Hopefully having this forum will allow people a more relaxed and less confrontational area where a well reasoned explanation/discussion can take place without peer pressure or other people muddying the waters.

The rules are guidelines, if we were to enforce them as black and white it would be a less fun place to be, but also, the fact we have a broad range of people in the team helps to make better decisions. Whilst a member of the team may suspend or act in a way that may not always be correct, generally tough decisions or uncertainties are discussed as a team to make sure there is a consensus. It does create a slightly less agile team, but because the user base is so massive here, and there are so many different cultures and types of people we will never be able to please every all of the time. I'd rather we upset people some of the time, and please people most of the time than the other way around.

People keep bringing up the past, as you are entitled to, but we are a very different place to where we were. If it wasn't we wouldn't have hundreds of new registrations a week (sometimes a day!). Also, people stick around, despite the moaning and the "unfairness" of it all, people stay here and contribute and enjoy being part of the forums. So from a slightly self praising point of view, I think we do a pretty good job of running this forum.

Irrespective of the minority who seem to think we are some sort archaic entity with antediluvian prejudices and opinions - on the whole we get it right nearly every time, generally with a soft touch. We do increase the thumb screw pressure when people take it too far, either on purpose or by lack of self control. It does very much work both ways - and whilst we haven't always got it right, boy oh boy you can be sure that many of you have stepped way over the line - yet, seem defiant and stubborn enough not to accept the consequences. That, in my opinion, is unfair on the team.

So hopefully having a place to discuss things will help diffuse issues going forward and keep the petty squabbles over moderation off the main part of the forum.

That's a very good post

 

[Admiral Huddy]

A positive move indeed

 

[Delvis]

Don't think it deserved a suspension though... I did question it to the Don in question at the time. A lot of people get away with saying some far worse things on here, inconsistency is what bothers me. It wouldn't bother me so much if everyone got suspended for saying something like that.

That's called being human, that and the fact each moderator is different, it's not as if they need to pass a test and get more than 90% on all the answers before being on the mod team.

Seriously, it happened, it's been and gone, done - now you have a specific forum section to post in the next time it may happen.

Ignorant fool is an insult at the end of the day, even if what they are posting seems ignorant to yourself

 

[BuffetSlayer]

Spoiler

Well, we now have this sub forum for discussion. Whether this is a good idea or not is yet to be seen. Hopefully you guys will find it a useful pathway to contact the moderation team and help clarify why we took the action we did.

That said, I don't really feel we should/ought to have to defend our upkeep of the rules or how we run the forum, but at the same time there is enough interest and discussion about decisions over the forum that it detracts from threads or ends up (much to my chagrin) like this thread, where, in spite of our broad shoulders, we get a fair bit of flak for moderating a forum - it does get tiresome.

As a result, people do make perhaps harsher decisions, and perhaps our team does not always get it right 100% of the time. That said, many of the times that a person has contacted, and either apologised or explained their interpretation of the situation the decision has been reversed and/or the explanation from the moderating team's point of view has been clearer. Hopefully having this forum will allow people a more relaxed and less confrontational area where a well reasoned explanation/discussion can take place without peer pressure or other people muddying the waters.

The rules are guidelines, if we were to enforce them as black and white it would be a less fun place to be, but also, the fact we have a broad range of people in the team helps to make better decisions. Whilst a member of the team may suspend or act in a way that may not always be correct, generally tough decisions or uncertainties are discussed as a team to make sure there is a consensus. It does create a slightly less agile team, but because the user base is so massive here, and there are so many different cultures and types of people we will never be able to please every all of the time. I'd rather we upset people some of the time, and please people most of the time than the other way around.

People keep bringing up the past, as you are entitled to, but we are a very different place to where we were. If it wasn't we wouldn't have hundreds of new registrations a week (sometimes a day!). Also, people stick around, despite the moaning and the "unfairness" of it all, people stay here and contribute and enjoy being part of the forums. So from a slightly self praising point of view, I think we do a pretty good job of running this forum.

Irrespective of the minority who seem to think we are some sort archaic entity with antediluvian prejudices and opinions - on the whole we get it right nearly every time, generally with a soft touch. We do increase the thumb screw pressure when people take it too far, either on purpose or by lack of self control. It does very much work both ways - and whilst we haven't always got it right, boy oh boy you can be sure that many of you have stepped way over the line - yet, seem defiant and stubborn enough not to accept the consequences. That, in my opinion, is unfair on the team.

So hopefully having a place to discuss things will help diffuse issues going forward and keep the petty squabbles over moderation off the main part of the forum.

I think that is a reasonable response and sums up my thoughts.

I do think some people just don't like being reprimanded and that is a flaw in their character rather than a reflection on the forum moderator team being 'badmins'.

 

[McGray]

Internet forums, serious business.

 

[Hilly]

Internet forums, serious business.

^^

 

[Josh]

I henceforth would like to apply for the position of Junior Moderator, I think it would help me develop into a more well rounded human being and believe I have a lot to offer the role.

The above may or may not be true, I may or may not just be a noisy git and want to know who is moaning about what.

 

[Edrof]

There are some posts in particular which are directed at people which could be construed as rude and offensive or perhaps a personal insult who do not receive a infraction. Where is the line drawn as to what is acceptable and what is not?

RTM any posts you think contravene the forum's rules or contact a mod. You're most welcome to get in touch with me via my Trust anytime.

witty and intelligent and charismatic?
Do they get paid?
Do they work from home or do they have posh offices?
Do they wear a suit?

Yes, yes and yes.
Let's just say FF is generous with his loving.
Certainly, life as an underboss can take you anywhere around the world, sometimes at only a moment's notice. It's a dreary existence of fast cars, fine wine and beautiful women.
I always wear a suit (five-inch lapels, bell-bottoms, tartan).

I henceforth would like to apply for the position of Junior Moderator,

We always need more comrades to slave in the Haribo mines help behind the scenes.

 

[pickle1972]

RTM any posts you think contravene the forum's rules or contact a mod. You're most welcome to get in touch with me via my Trust anytime.



Yes, yes and yes.
Let's just say FF is generous with his loving.
Certainly, life as an underboss can take you anywhere around the world, sometimes at only a moment's notice. It's a dreary existence of fast cars, fine wine and beautiful women.
I always wear a suit (five-inch lapels, bell-bottoms, tartan).



We always need more comrades to slave in the Haribo mines help behind the scenes.

I like you. You are funny
I have always been attracted to rich powerful men though its a mystery

 

[Craigus]

Wow.

A place to discuss why you were banned from a forum. If you feel the need to discuss this type of thing, a break from the internet for a couple of days is probably a good thing for you...

 

[Cosimo]

Let's just say FF is generous with his loving.
Certainly, life as an underboss can take you anywhere around the world, sometimes at only a moment's notice. It's a dreary existence of fast cars, fine wine and beautiful women.
I always wear a suit (five-inch lapels, bell-bottoms, tartan).

All this and a life on the internet, it's enough to make 007 jealous.

 

[Redz]

Apparently calling someone an "ignorant fool" is a personal attack.

Because it is. Now if you had stated that the remarks were ignorant and foolish and provided evidence/argument to support your claim you would have refuted their standpoint.