The next Labour leader thread

Soldato
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A what now ? He's not in government. If he isn't quitting now why would he quit after getting pummeled in a general election.

No he is leader of an opposition. He won't go by fair means we know that. If they call a GE. If Labour lose he would step down.

[TW]Fox;29823943 said:
If it walks like a duck..

That's a poor argument to take. Especially when Corbyn has had people like the BBC run a smear campaign against him. Is he weak? I don't believe he is. His resilience over his tenure is down to Blairites who are sitting for the wrong party.

Want to know what Old Labour is that people clamour for? Look no further than Corbyn.
 
Soldato
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An excellent article from my friend at the Canary:-

http://www.thecanary.co/2016/07/14/...r-back-and-the-establishment-is-freaking-out/

We've been talking about Corbyn extensively over the last few weeks and she summarises my thoughts better than I ever could.

Send your friend my sincerest thanks for the truth that is before our eyes. Some ignore it, some let the MSM do their thinking and a few are now prepared to get the answers themselves and not believe the BS.

Just saw the film from earlier about the "small audience illusion". Told me old man: "You cant believe the news on Corbyn"
 
Soldato
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Theresa May looked surprisingly calm for a woman of the establishment that's meant to be freaking out over the working class -- define it, btw -- taking its power back. Classing a broken opposition, facing the prospect of being out of power for a generation, a split and perhaps obliteration as an entity, as the establishment is likewise a tad rich. Let's reconvene after her honeymoon period is out and Labour's election is done. Not much grist for the mill until then.
 
Caporegime
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Perhaps the PLP explain themselves better to start with?

Yeah they've been 100% clear from the word go. Everyone can see it. They want Corbyn gone because they want to appeal to Tory voters/swinging voters.

They want to start winning elections, and their policies will be determined by whatever they think will get them votes.

The PLP is like the kid who will do anything to make the other children like him. They aren't a party that represents anything anymore. Just an amorphous, shape-shifting mass trying to look human. But what would that shape-shifting mass turn into once in government? Nobody knows! Would they favour the bankers or the working poor? Do we actually know anything the PLP genuinely stand for? Or is it just sound-bites designed to have as broad an appeal as possible, whilst being deliberately vague.

Meaningless soundbites such as "Who will stand up for the poor* (*sometimes: 'low-paid, vulnerable workers') if Labour aren't elected?" As if New Labour they gave two craps about the poor. As if *anybody* gives two hoots about the poor these days. The bottom 20% don't help you win elections, apparently - so I was reading at least. And since New Labour don't have any principles at all, if those bottom 20% aren't getting them elected, they really don't care about them one iota.

Whereas Corbyn might actually believe what he says. That's pretty scary for a PLP MP desperate to get back into government.
 
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RDM

RDM

Soldato
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Soldato
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I live in the a Labour area, guaranteed 60%+ for the candidate at every election since the 40's. It is a socially deprived area, which seems to mean everyone eats a lot of takeaways, live in a terrace house and watch sky. The historic industries were destroyed by globalisation but things seems to be recovering slowly.

In this bastion of working class Labour belief I have seen nothing that suggests a resurgence in political activism. But if I go to work full of young professionals 30-ish degree educated, raised in middle class families the Labour love is strong. They've all signed up to vote Corbyn in for a triumphal vindication of momentum politics. Go downstairs and speak to the man and boy union members on the shop floor, not a dickie bird of interest in the modern political activism. Wages, job security, health service, migration yes. Any other of the political crap Labour talks about is like water off a ducks back.

Now I speak only for my narrow locale, I don't know what's happening elsewhere in the UK but it feels to me that this "new political awakening" is a very metropolitan, middle class, educated update on student politics.
 
Caporegime
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We've been talking about Corbyn extensively over the last few weeks and she summarises my thoughts better than I ever could.

Most of the people supporting Corbyn are middle class and metropolitan - or, at least, the one's joining the party are.

Corbyn's support hasn't come from the working class, so his rise isn't a working class revolt. The same with the SNP. Brexit is a bit more complex because although the lower social classes backed Leave; people actually working backed Remain.
 
Caporegime
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Perhaps there is a new working class?

Young people have no wage prospects, and wont for probably forever at this rate (the Minimum rate is a temporary trick for little gain), they were told by the blairites to go to University to learn diddly **** all and get in debt in the process.

Theres also the probably the mental capacity there to see beyond the facade of democracy in this country with FPTP and one party system (with occasional hints of a two party one).

It wont mean much however, there is no way a softer leader like Corbyn could win against the growing tide of hatred bellowing in the western world currently, It isnt really about him though, he is just a conduit of anger against an entrenched (though rather bruised at this point) establishment.


A lot of working class jobs are easily done by Synthetics anyway, they will be the mostly jobless class in 30 years, minus the few decorative industries that wont have a synthetic solution yet.
 
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Deleted member 66701

D

Deleted member 66701

Most of the people supporting Corbyn are middle class and metropolitan - or, at least, the one's joining the party are.

Hang on a minute - aren't the middle class metropolitans supposed to be Tory voters? Why are the Tories haemorrhaging membership support to Labour?

The Tories have 140,000 members and Labour has 450,000. That's got to be a concern to the Tories.
 
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Soldato
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Corbyn's support hasn't come from the working class, so his rise isn't a working class revolt. The same with the SNP. Brexit is a bit more complex because although the lower social classes backed Leave; people actually working backed Remain.

Given the support in the last elections for the SNP in previously stronghold Labour seats you are wrong on that point. When I was younger Glasgow, of the famous Red Clyde, was Labour through and through. Now Labour cannot get a seat from Glasgow. Last time I looked Glasgow had not transformed into a yuppie city.
 

Deleted member 66701

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Caporegime
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Given the support in the last elections for the SNP in previously stronghold Labour seats you are wrong on that point. When I was younger Glasgow, of the famous Red Clyde, was Labour through and through. Now Labour cannot get a seat from Glasgow. Last time I looked Glasgow had not transformed into a yuppie city.

Just because the SNP win in these areas does not make the SNP a "working class revolt". In fact, SNP support is pretty even across the income spectrum (source, graph on income inequality).
 
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