The next Labour leader thread

amigafan2003 said:
Really? Who on earth thought it would go any other way, especially with the stooges the PLP were pushing into the election?
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Honestly, the circles I move in plenty of people thought it would go the other way. Not based on evidence but based on their personal beliefs. It's the same way Economist magazine hilariously predicted a few years back that Hollande would never be elected as French President because he was "too socialist". I read that, laughed and asked myself if any of the staff at Economist had actually met the French. But the problem wasn't lack of evidence or indicators, it was an inability to see other people's point of view. They simply couldn't understand it. So yes, I know people who have literally laughed very derisively at the idea of Corbyn because in their mind and in their social circles, socialism is a synonym for failure and unfettered capitalism is the cure for all ills. I'm actually with them on much of that but unlike them (apparently), I have actually read my history books.

I'm not surprised Corbyn won even despite the various dirty tricks that were pulled to try and stop him. Such as setting an arbitrary cut off date to stop new members of the Labour party voting for him. Many joined just so they could do that.
 
Smith was a tactical shot better than Angela: resonated well in Scotland and better than expected in London; resonated better than Corbyn with younger supporters; did not have the Iraq baggage; could pivot back away to a less authoritarian centre position on things like mass re-nationalisation of key industry sectors; most notably would've tried to bring back the people of competence who'd deserted Corbyn's economics unit and the like -- the policy brain. The best of the best? No. Could've saved Labour from an impeding oblivion or serial rebellions? Yes.

Meanwhile, even as the Cameronites fire communications broadsides against the government, the numbers continue to look very favourable for May and grim for Labour. ComRes: http://www.comresglobal.com/polls/sunday-mirror-independent-political-poll-september-2016/. In all this mess, the support for a harder and faster Brexit is growing too. Whoever is telling JC this is all a huge media conspiracy and the numbers are wrong, should start waking up, interpreting the figures and finding a few core issues to retaliate on. For now a swathe of seats looks vulnerable. In a climate of limited resources and uncertainty, May's strivers-and-skivers-lite rhetoric, One Nation airs if not substance, and stunts like the fight over grammars will be enough to take them.
 
Arazi said:
Why, the guy is a complete fake and a stooge, no i don't vote Corbyn either.
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Yes, anyone would think that tptb what an ineffective opposition, i dont think Labour will get re elceted for at least two more terms, I would say we are heading for coalition again.
 
drs101 said:
Yes, anyone would think that tptb what an ineffective opposition, i dont think Labour will get re elceted for at least two more terms, I would say we are heading for coalition again.
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I think the Tories will walk it, I'm never voting lib dem or labour again, I'm loathed to vote Tory but what choice is there?

I think if the Tories fail to make a more equal society a right wing party of some sort will form.

My view is that the silent majority are just not interested in the left wanting to spend their taxes and give the money away.

I don't think the argument is really about how those on benefits are losing out, I think it's about those who are just making ends meet getting squeezed more and more.
 
Slam62 said:
I think the Tories will walk it, I'm never voting lib dem or labour again, I'm loathed to vote Tory but what choice is there?

I think if the Tories fail to make a more equal society a right wing party of some sort will form.

My view is that the silent majority are just not interested in the left wanting to spend their taxes and give the money away.

I don't think the argument is really about how those on benefits are losing out, I think it's about those who are just making ends meet getting squeezed more and more.
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They all seem the same to me, in the pocket of the multi nationals and big business, i dont think they have any interest in an equal society,

just look at Corbyn and how the professional politicians are treating him becuase he wants to change things, regardless if you agree with him or not whats going on is farcical,

Smith has as much chance or being elected as Corbyn, virtually none, so then it must all be about something else, i would say self interest.
 
Zethor said:
I don't agree with Corbyn on some things but I understand why there's so much support for him - protest voting.

It's interesting that on the left political spectrum the protest vote takes the shape of idealistic, harmless old hippies such as Bernie or Corbyn while on the right one we have authoritarian xenophobes like Trump or Le Pen.
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Or you could look at it as on the left the protest vote is for a self defeating losing position which means they never have to actually deal with or handle the bad situation.

The rights protest vote is for a single issue but forceful option that has a chance of winning
 
Labour resignations and possibly a new party to come, letters under embargo at BBC until tomorrow morning apparently.

Huge news if true...
 
good news if true. we need a decent opposition party and corbyn can never deliver that.
by sticking to his confusing and hypocritical points, he is screwing the country over by allowing tories to screw the country over unhindered.
 
Judgeneo said:
Labour resignations and possibly a new party to come, letters under embargo at BBC until tomorrow morning apparently.

Huge news if true...
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Where they going to get their funding from? Who are the grass-roots for this new party? Who is going to vote for a party of boring ex-New Labour MPs? I'm not surprised about the rumours of a new party, but I'd be surprised if it came to anything - it'd be political suicide for them to lose the Labour brand.
 
scorza said:
Where they going to get their funding from? Who are the grass-roots for this new party? Who is going to vote for a party of boring ex-New Labour MPs? I'm not surprised about the rumours of a new party, but I'd be surprised if it came to anything - it'd be political suicide for them to lose the Labour brand.
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If more than 129 mps go, they will get the opposition short funding for a start...

Doing it now with 4 years before the next election is a much better idea than waiting for deselection.
 
Dolph said:
If more than 129 mps go, they will get the opposition short funding for a start...

Doing it now with 4 years before the next election is a much better idea than waiting for deselection.
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Maybe, but I'm not sure 130+ MPs will be prepared to turn their backs on the Labour party after all this time. In any case it won't be enough funding for a party preparing for government - they need the union funding, like Labour has always enjoyed, or wealthy donors like who back the Tories and generally don't donate unless they think the party has a good chance of being in power.
 
Judgeneo said:
Labour resignations and possibly a new party to come, letters under embargo at BBC until tomorrow morning apparently.

Huge news if true...
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If it happens then the MPs that form a new party and still fail to make an impact in the polls will have to come up with something other than "blame Corbyn", and I can't see that happening.
 
scorza said:
Maybe, but I'm not sure 130+ MPs will be prepared to turn their backs on the Labour party after all this time. In any case it won't be enough funding for a party preparing for government - they need the union funding, like Labour has always enjoyed, or wealthy donors like who back the Tories and generally don't donate unless they think the party has a good chance of being in power.
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So basically we'd be facing one old-school Labour party, one old-school Tory party, one new-school Tory party pretending to be Labour and Lib Dems getting squeezed even further. Plus SNP if you're Scottish.

Time for PR before we get a majority government with even less of a mandate than usual?
 
Glaucus said:
good news if true. we need a decent opposition party and corbyn can never deliver that.
by sticking to his confusing and hypocritical points, he is screwing the country over by allowing tories to screw the country over unhindered.
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A Labour split won't deliver an opposition, it'll consign both Labour and the splitters to irrelevance for a decade or more. The sound of party poppers and champagne corks will be heard from Tory central.
 
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