Actually, the polls that are better for labor are using a more traditional turnout model with figures from recent elections and trying other methods to unskew the data, the models with a larger 10+ conversation lead are blindly adding a 6-8% adjustment in favor the Tories which is less typcial than the historic average but would have better prediction 2015. No one yet know why 2015 had a much higher Tory turnout so it isn;t very safe to assume it will be repeated. Likewise, the models using more advanced techniques to get less biased data are more experimental in nature. ougov are quite honest in stating they are unsure of the accuracy of their changes but they wlll learn a lot come june 9th.
Poll: Poll: UK General Election 2017 - Mk II
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Actually, the polls that are better for labor are using a more traditional turnout model with figures from recent elections and trying other methods to unskew the data, the models with a larger 10+ conversation lead are blindly adding a 6-8% adjustment in favor the Tories which is less typcial than the historic average but would have better prediction 2015. No one yet know why 2015 had a much higher Tory turnout so it isn;t very safe to assume it will be repeated. Likewise, the models using more advanced techniques to get less biased data are more experimental in nature. ougov are quite honest in stating they are unsure of the accuracy of their changes but they wlll learn a lot come june 9th.
Soldato
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As a random point the following ECONOMIC EXPERTS SUPPORT LABOURS COSTED MANIFESTO:
Dr Adotey Bing-Pappoe, lecturer in economics, Alan Freeman (personal capacity), Alfredo Saad Filho, Professor of Political Economy, SOAS University of London, Andrew Cumbers, Professor of Regional Political Economy, University of Glasgow, Andrew Simms, author of The New Economics, co-director New Weather Institute, Andy Ross FAcSS, Visiting Professor, Birkbeck University of London , Andy Kilmister, Department of Accounting, Finance and Economics, Oxford Brookes University, Ann Pettifor, Director of PRIME Economics (Policy Research in Macroeconomics), Dr Antonio Andreoni (PhD Cambridge), Senior Lecturer in Economics, SOAS University of London, Anwar Shaikh, Professor, New School for Social Research, USA, Arturo Hermann, Senior research fellow, Italian National Institute of Statistics, Rome, Italy, Professor Ben Fine, Department of Economics, SOAS University of London, Robert Rowthorn, Emeritus Professor of Economics, University of Cambridge., Bruce Cronin, Professor of Economic Sociology, Director of Research, Director of the Centre for Business Network Analysis, University of Greenwich, Dr Bruno Bonizzi, Lecturer in Political Economy, University of Winchester, Carlos Oya, Reader in Development Studies, SOAS University of London, Carolina Alves, PhD Economics, Carolyn Jones, Director, Institute of Employment Rights, Cem Oyvat, Lecturer, University of Greenwich, Christopher Cramer, Professor of the Political Economy of Development, SOAS University of London, Ciaran Driver FAcSS, Professor of Economics, SOAS University of London, Professor Colin Haslam, Professor of Accounting and Finance, Queen Mary University of London, Costas Lapavitsas, Professor of Economics, SOAS University of London, Cyrus Bina, Distinguished Research Professor of Economics, University of Minnesota, USA, Dr Dan O’Neill, Lecturer in Ecological Economics, University of Leeds, Daniela Gabor, Professor of Economics and Macro-Finance, University of the West of England, Daniele Archibugi, Professor, Birkbeck College, Professor Danny Dorling, University of Oxford, Writer and Academic, Dean Baker, Co-Director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research, Washington, DC, Dr Deborah Johnston Pro-Director (Learning and Teaching) SOAS (University of London), Diego Sánchez-Ancochea, Associate Professor in Political Economy, Director, Latin American Centre, University of Oxford, Dr Dimitris P. Sotiropoulos, The Open University Business School, Elisa Van Waeyenberge, Lecturer of Economics, SOAS University of London, Dr Emanuele Lobina, Public Services International Research Unit, University of Greenwich, Dr Faiza Shaheen, Economist (in a personal capacity), Frances Stewart, Professor of Development Economics and Director, Centre for Research on Inequality, Human Security and Ethnicity, University of Oxford, Gary Dymski, Professor of Applied Economics, Leeds University Business School, Geoff Harcourt, Honorary Professor, UNSW Australia, Gerald Epstein, Co-Director, Political Economy Research Institute, and Department of Economics, University of Massachusetts Amherst, USA, Dr Giorgos Galanis, Lecturer in Economics, Goldsmiths University, Gregor Semieniuk, Lecturer in Economics, SOAS University of London, Guglielmo Forges Davanzati, Associate professor of Political Economy, University of Salento, Italy, Dr Guy Standing FAcSS, Professorial Research Associate, SOAS University of London, Ha-Joon Chang, University of Cambridge, Hannah Bargawi, Lecturer in Economics, SOAS University of London, and Research Partner, Centre for Development Policy and Research, Dr Hassan Hakimian, Reader in Economics, SOAS University of London, Professor Dr Heiner Flassbeck, former Chief Economist of UNCTAD, Geneva, Heikki Patomäki, Professor of World Politics, University of Helsinki, Howard M. Wachtel, Professor Emeritus of Economics, American University, Washington, DC, USA, Howard Reed, Director, Landman Economics, Dr Hugh Goodacre, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Westminster, Teaching Fellow, University College London, Hugo Radice, University of Leeds., Hulya Dagdeviren, Professor of Economic Development, University of Hertfordshire, Ilhan Dögüs, Department of Socioeconomics, University of Hamburg, Germany, James K. Galbraith, Professor of Government, University of Texas, USA, Jan Toporowski, Professor of Economics and Finance, SOAS University of London, Dr Jane Lethbridge, Public Services International Research Unit, University of Greenwich, Jeanette Findlay, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Glasglow, Jeff Faux, Founder & former Director, Economic Policy Institute, Washington D C, Dr Jeff Powell, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Dr Jeff Tan, Economist, Aga Khan University in the UK, Jeremy Smith, co-director, PRIME Economics (Policy Research in Macroeconomics), Dr Jo Michell, Senior Lecturer in Economics, UWE Bristol, Professor John Grahl, Economics Department, Middlesex University, John Palmer, former Political Director of the European Policy Centre, Dr Johnna Montgomerie, Senior Lecturer in Economics, Deputy Director of the Political Economy Research Centre, Goldsmiths University of London, Jonathan Dawson, Coordinator of Economics, Schumacher College, Professor Jonathan Michie, Professor of Innovation & Knowledge Exchange, University of Oxford , Dr Jonathan Perraton, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Sheffield, Jorge Buzaglo, Associate Professor of Economics, University of Stockholm, Sweden, Dr Julian Wells, Principal Lecturer of Economics, Kingston University, Kate Bayliss, Research Fellow, Economics Department, SOAS University of London, Professor Kate Pickett, University of York Champion for Research on Justice & Equality, Dr Kevin Deane, Senior Lecturer in International Development, University of Northampton (personal capacty), Dr Kitty Stewart, Associate Professor of Social Policy, London School of Economics and Political Science, Klaus Nielsen, Professor of Institutional Economics, Birkbeck University of London, László Andor, Associate Professor, Corvinus University, Hungary, Leslie Huckfield, Yunus Centre for Social Business & Health, Glasgow Caledonian University, Malcolm Sawyer, Emeritus Professor of Economics, University of Leeds, Marco Veronese Passarella, Economics Division, Leeds University Business School, Maria Nikolaidi, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Dr Mario Seccareccia, Full Professor, Department of Economics, University of Ottawa, Canada, Dr Martin Watts, Emeritus Professor of Economics, The University of Newcastle, Massoud Karshenas, Professor of Economics, SOAS University of London, Dr Matteo Rizzo, Senior Lecturer, Department of Economics, SOAS University of London, Mehmet Ugur, Professor of Economics and Institutions, University of Greenwich Business School, Michael Roberts, financial economist and author of The Long Depression, Professor Mushtaq Khan, Department of Economics, SOAS, University of London, Professor Ozlem Onaran, Director of Greenwich Political Economy Research Centre, University of Greenwich, Pallavi Roy, Lecturer in International Economics, SOAS, University of London, Paulo dos Santos, Assistant Professor of Economic, New School for Social Research, USA, Paul Mason, economics writer, Prem Sikka, Emeritus Professor of Accounting, University of Essex, Dr Pritam Singh, Professor of Economics, Oxford Brookes University, Radhika Desai, Professor, Department of Political Studies, University of Manitoba, USA, Richard McIntyre, Professor, Chair, Department of Economics, University of Rhode Island, USA, Richard Murphy, Professor of Practice in International Political Economy at City University of London and Director of Tax Research LLP, Richard Parker, Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University, USA, Richard Wilkinson, Emeritus Professor of Social Epidemiology, University of Nottingham, Dr Robert Calvert Jump, Lecturer in Economics, Kingston University, Robert Neild, Professor Emeritus of Economics, University of Cambridge, Robert Pollin, Distinguished Professor of Economics and Co-Director, Political Economy Research Institute, University of Massachusetts Amherst, USA, Roberto Veneziani, Queen Mary University of London, Susan Himmelweit, Emeritus Professor of Economics, Open University, Dr Sara Gorgoni, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Dr Sara Maioli, Lecturer in Economics, Newcastle University, Dr Satoshi Miyamura, Lecturer in the Economy of Japan, SOAS University of London, Shawky Arif, The University of Northampton, Simon Wren-Lewis, Professor of Economic Policy, Oxford University, Professor Steve Keen, Department of Economics, Kingston University, Professor Engelbert Stockhammer, Kingston University, Simon Mohun, Emeritus Professor of Political Economy, Queen Mary University of London, Dr Sunil Mitra Kumar, Lecturer in Economics, King’s College London, Susan Newman, Senior Lecturer of Economics, University of West England, Dr Susan Pashkoff, Economist, Dr Suzanne J Konzelmann, Director, Postgraduate Programmes in Corporate Governance and Business Ethics, Director, London Centre for Corporate Governance and Ethics, Co-Executive Editor, Cambridge Journal of Economics, Tom Palley, Former Chief Economist, US-China Economic and Security Review Commission, Tomás Rotta, Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Trevor Evans, Emeritus Professor of Economics, Berlin School of Economics and Law, Germany, Will Davies, Reader in Political Economy, Goldsmiths, University of London, Dr William Van Lear, Economics Professor, Belmont Abbey College, USA, Yanis Varoufakis, Former Minister of Finance, Greece, Yannis Dafermos, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of the West of England, José Gabriel Palma, University of Cambridge, Yulia Yurchenko, University of Greenwhich, Laurie Macfarlane, Economics Editor, Open Democracy, Meghnad Desai, London School of Economics, Clive Lawson, University of Cambridge, Professor Lawrence King, University of Cambridge
Dr Adotey Bing-Pappoe, lecturer in economics, Alan Freeman (personal capacity), Alfredo Saad Filho, Professor of Political Economy, SOAS University of London, Andrew Cumbers, Professor of Regional Political Economy, University of Glasgow, Andrew Simms, author of The New Economics, co-director New Weather Institute, Andy Ross FAcSS, Visiting Professor, Birkbeck University of London , Andy Kilmister, Department of Accounting, Finance and Economics, Oxford Brookes University, Ann Pettifor, Director of PRIME Economics (Policy Research in Macroeconomics), Dr Antonio Andreoni (PhD Cambridge), Senior Lecturer in Economics, SOAS University of London, Anwar Shaikh, Professor, New School for Social Research, USA, Arturo Hermann, Senior research fellow, Italian National Institute of Statistics, Rome, Italy, Professor Ben Fine, Department of Economics, SOAS University of London, Robert Rowthorn, Emeritus Professor of Economics, University of Cambridge., Bruce Cronin, Professor of Economic Sociology, Director of Research, Director of the Centre for Business Network Analysis, University of Greenwich, Dr Bruno Bonizzi, Lecturer in Political Economy, University of Winchester, Carlos Oya, Reader in Development Studies, SOAS University of London, Carolina Alves, PhD Economics, Carolyn Jones, Director, Institute of Employment Rights, Cem Oyvat, Lecturer, University of Greenwich, Christopher Cramer, Professor of the Political Economy of Development, SOAS University of London, Ciaran Driver FAcSS, Professor of Economics, SOAS University of London, Professor Colin Haslam, Professor of Accounting and Finance, Queen Mary University of London, Costas Lapavitsas, Professor of Economics, SOAS University of London, Cyrus Bina, Distinguished Research Professor of Economics, University of Minnesota, USA, Dr Dan O’Neill, Lecturer in Ecological Economics, University of Leeds, Daniela Gabor, Professor of Economics and Macro-Finance, University of the West of England, Daniele Archibugi, Professor, Birkbeck College, Professor Danny Dorling, University of Oxford, Writer and Academic, Dean Baker, Co-Director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research, Washington, DC, Dr Deborah Johnston Pro-Director (Learning and Teaching) SOAS (University of London), Diego Sánchez-Ancochea, Associate Professor in Political Economy, Director, Latin American Centre, University of Oxford, Dr Dimitris P. Sotiropoulos, The Open University Business School, Elisa Van Waeyenberge, Lecturer of Economics, SOAS University of London, Dr Emanuele Lobina, Public Services International Research Unit, University of Greenwich, Dr Faiza Shaheen, Economist (in a personal capacity), Frances Stewart, Professor of Development Economics and Director, Centre for Research on Inequality, Human Security and Ethnicity, University of Oxford, Gary Dymski, Professor of Applied Economics, Leeds University Business School, Geoff Harcourt, Honorary Professor, UNSW Australia, Gerald Epstein, Co-Director, Political Economy Research Institute, and Department of Economics, University of Massachusetts Amherst, USA, Dr Giorgos Galanis, Lecturer in Economics, Goldsmiths University, Gregor Semieniuk, Lecturer in Economics, SOAS University of London, Guglielmo Forges Davanzati, Associate professor of Political Economy, University of Salento, Italy, Dr Guy Standing FAcSS, Professorial Research Associate, SOAS University of London, Ha-Joon Chang, University of Cambridge, Hannah Bargawi, Lecturer in Economics, SOAS University of London, and Research Partner, Centre for Development Policy and Research, Dr Hassan Hakimian, Reader in Economics, SOAS University of London, Professor Dr Heiner Flassbeck, former Chief Economist of UNCTAD, Geneva, Heikki Patomäki, Professor of World Politics, University of Helsinki, Howard M. Wachtel, Professor Emeritus of Economics, American University, Washington, DC, USA, Howard Reed, Director, Landman Economics, Dr Hugh Goodacre, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Westminster, Teaching Fellow, University College London, Hugo Radice, University of Leeds., Hulya Dagdeviren, Professor of Economic Development, University of Hertfordshire, Ilhan Dögüs, Department of Socioeconomics, University of Hamburg, Germany, James K. Galbraith, Professor of Government, University of Texas, USA, Jan Toporowski, Professor of Economics and Finance, SOAS University of London, Dr Jane Lethbridge, Public Services International Research Unit, University of Greenwich, Jeanette Findlay, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Glasglow, Jeff Faux, Founder & former Director, Economic Policy Institute, Washington D C, Dr Jeff Powell, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Dr Jeff Tan, Economist, Aga Khan University in the UK, Jeremy Smith, co-director, PRIME Economics (Policy Research in Macroeconomics), Dr Jo Michell, Senior Lecturer in Economics, UWE Bristol, Professor John Grahl, Economics Department, Middlesex University, John Palmer, former Political Director of the European Policy Centre, Dr Johnna Montgomerie, Senior Lecturer in Economics, Deputy Director of the Political Economy Research Centre, Goldsmiths University of London, Jonathan Dawson, Coordinator of Economics, Schumacher College, Professor Jonathan Michie, Professor of Innovation & Knowledge Exchange, University of Oxford , Dr Jonathan Perraton, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Sheffield, Jorge Buzaglo, Associate Professor of Economics, University of Stockholm, Sweden, Dr Julian Wells, Principal Lecturer of Economics, Kingston University, Kate Bayliss, Research Fellow, Economics Department, SOAS University of London, Professor Kate Pickett, University of York Champion for Research on Justice & Equality, Dr Kevin Deane, Senior Lecturer in International Development, University of Northampton (personal capacty), Dr Kitty Stewart, Associate Professor of Social Policy, London School of Economics and Political Science, Klaus Nielsen, Professor of Institutional Economics, Birkbeck University of London, László Andor, Associate Professor, Corvinus University, Hungary, Leslie Huckfield, Yunus Centre for Social Business & Health, Glasgow Caledonian University, Malcolm Sawyer, Emeritus Professor of Economics, University of Leeds, Marco Veronese Passarella, Economics Division, Leeds University Business School, Maria Nikolaidi, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Dr Mario Seccareccia, Full Professor, Department of Economics, University of Ottawa, Canada, Dr Martin Watts, Emeritus Professor of Economics, The University of Newcastle, Massoud Karshenas, Professor of Economics, SOAS University of London, Dr Matteo Rizzo, Senior Lecturer, Department of Economics, SOAS University of London, Mehmet Ugur, Professor of Economics and Institutions, University of Greenwich Business School, Michael Roberts, financial economist and author of The Long Depression, Professor Mushtaq Khan, Department of Economics, SOAS, University of London, Professor Ozlem Onaran, Director of Greenwich Political Economy Research Centre, University of Greenwich, Pallavi Roy, Lecturer in International Economics, SOAS, University of London, Paulo dos Santos, Assistant Professor of Economic, New School for Social Research, USA, Paul Mason, economics writer, Prem Sikka, Emeritus Professor of Accounting, University of Essex, Dr Pritam Singh, Professor of Economics, Oxford Brookes University, Radhika Desai, Professor, Department of Political Studies, University of Manitoba, USA, Richard McIntyre, Professor, Chair, Department of Economics, University of Rhode Island, USA, Richard Murphy, Professor of Practice in International Political Economy at City University of London and Director of Tax Research LLP, Richard Parker, Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University, USA, Richard Wilkinson, Emeritus Professor of Social Epidemiology, University of Nottingham, Dr Robert Calvert Jump, Lecturer in Economics, Kingston University, Robert Neild, Professor Emeritus of Economics, University of Cambridge, Robert Pollin, Distinguished Professor of Economics and Co-Director, Political Economy Research Institute, University of Massachusetts Amherst, USA, Roberto Veneziani, Queen Mary University of London, Susan Himmelweit, Emeritus Professor of Economics, Open University, Dr Sara Gorgoni, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Dr Sara Maioli, Lecturer in Economics, Newcastle University, Dr Satoshi Miyamura, Lecturer in the Economy of Japan, SOAS University of London, Shawky Arif, The University of Northampton, Simon Wren-Lewis, Professor of Economic Policy, Oxford University, Professor Steve Keen, Department of Economics, Kingston University, Professor Engelbert Stockhammer, Kingston University, Simon Mohun, Emeritus Professor of Political Economy, Queen Mary University of London, Dr Sunil Mitra Kumar, Lecturer in Economics, King’s College London, Susan Newman, Senior Lecturer of Economics, University of West England, Dr Susan Pashkoff, Economist, Dr Suzanne J Konzelmann, Director, Postgraduate Programmes in Corporate Governance and Business Ethics, Director, London Centre for Corporate Governance and Ethics, Co-Executive Editor, Cambridge Journal of Economics, Tom Palley, Former Chief Economist, US-China Economic and Security Review Commission, Tomás Rotta, Lecturer in Economics, University of Greenwich, Trevor Evans, Emeritus Professor of Economics, Berlin School of Economics and Law, Germany, Will Davies, Reader in Political Economy, Goldsmiths, University of London, Dr William Van Lear, Economics Professor, Belmont Abbey College, USA, Yanis Varoufakis, Former Minister of Finance, Greece, Yannis Dafermos, Senior Lecturer in Economics, University of the West of England, José Gabriel Palma, University of Cambridge, Yulia Yurchenko, University of Greenwhich, Laurie Macfarlane, Economics Editor, Open Democracy, Meghnad Desai, London School of Economics, Clive Lawson, University of Cambridge, Professor Lawrence King, University of Cambridge
Pretty embarrassing show all round, tbh.
However her attitude smacked of arrogance.
She seemed to think it was a privilege for the audience to come and listen to her.
She told the audience she was going to ignore anyone who didn't like what she was saying.
She wanted the adjudicator, then the police, to remove those who spoke against her.
That said the woman who stood up and shouted, "You're being rude!" sounded like she had mental problems to me. Lots of it down here. Lots of drugs too.
Remember we're poorer on average than Poland, Estonia, etc. It was only the EU putting money into Cornwall, and now that's coming to an end.
The Tories will basically keep Cornwall open as a county-sized 2nd home for the rest of the UKLife-support to run the odd Waitrose dotted around, and enough police to secure the seaside cottages. Then you'll have no-mans-lands where the locals hunt and eat vermin, and possibly each other.
True story.
sounds like a good plot line for fallout 5.................
Deleted member 66701
Deleted member 66701
Pah - what do experts know!
pfft experts, we have had enough of those according to Ferengi Gove...............
This, UKIP has collapsed, Labour has increased but Tories have been more static. Perhaps a vey slight decline.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_bank#Europe
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-them-to-food-banks-and-a6855371.html#gallery
http://www.express.co.uk/comment/co...ring-foodbank-use-Britain-is-not-going-hungry
Germany, 1.5m people use a food bank every week. Biggest economy in Europe and running a trade surplus. 4th biggest economy in the world.
France, twice as many food banks as UK, supermarkets legally required to give food to food banks, no sign of embarrassment there then. 6th biggest economy in the world.
UK, 0.5m people use a food bank every week. 5th biggest economy in the world.
Looks like UK is doing much better in terms of people who need food bank assistance compared to other EU countries of the same economic size.
Such as? There's nothing wrong by itself with the government (tax payers) being the customer of a private business. Also, you are conflating wealth and money.
What about whataboutery?
Anywhere I said that they should?
Again, what are you talking about? And what connection does it have to anything I wrote?
It happens every day. It's what's known as a Fiat Currency.
You just said that money can't be created out of nothing. I just explained that it can and is. Now you're agreeing with me. And saying that a product can also be created out of nothing. Which it can't. It takes labour or materials or usually both. Your statements are unintelligible.
Okay. Firstly, you need to use the terms wealth and money as the different things they are. You're confused as ****. No, it is not correct to say that any money in the hands of one person is money taken from someone else. A basic understanding of inflationary currency shows that. Also, sometimes money does end up more in some people's hands than others. If I give you a house, you give me money. Now I have the money that you had. Is that wrong? And in the process of that money changing hands, wealth (a house) has been created.
The flaw in the reasoning above is what I pointed out in the post you're replying to. It's to think that wealth is a finite that is shared out. The entire history of the species has been a moving away of wealth being stuff we find - land, berries, whatever. And towards stuff we create through our labour and skills. Given that wealth is created, the material enrichment of one person does not mean the material impoverishment of everyone else. Were that the case, people today would be living like cavepeople because the finite wealth could not be expanded. Again, if I built a house, that does not make anybody else have less wealth.
Not really. Also, social mobility is a great deal higher today than it has been for much of human history. What does all this have to do with the logical flaw I pointed out in my original post, anyway?
Not as much as you might think or there wouldn't be two sides to the debate. When you believe in a particular idea you tend to be biased towards the outcome that you want.
You might look at the figures and say:
"The increased cost of funding university courses will be offset by the higher taxes the graduates will pay therefore it works".
Or you might say:
"The increased cost of university courses will lead to an increase of students with pointless degrees that are of no value to society and there will actually be a decrease in employed youngsters due to graduates being unwilling to take jobs 'beneath' them."
You might say that increasing police numbers will help prevent terror attacks because you will have more eyes and ears on potential suspects. On the other hand, unless you are willing to detain people who have not actually committed a crime you will struggle to prevent attacks like the recent london one regardless of how many police you have.
There are experts on both sides of the fence on almost every single political point and both sides ignore or give more value to certain things that they feel are important. There is no 100% provable right answer.
Soldato
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OCUK, gotta hand it - I list a MASSIVE list of EXPERTS, countless names - and still someone says the opposite xD - or at least says its no more or less valid than another opinion xD
haha - erm nah, economic experts without to much of an interest in politics only maths, all agree
humanity got no hope
I wish we ran society on maths, science, experts and logic, rather than opinions and money - everyone would be so much better
haha - erm nah, economic experts without to much of an interest in politics only maths, all agree
humanity got no hope
I wish we ran society on maths, science, experts and logic, rather than opinions and money - everyone would be so much better
The question I asked was: "Are you happy with the state having to top up the pay of private companies?
You didn't answer meaningfully.
Answer this question: resources are a) finite or b) infinite.
You say "wealth is infinite", but I don't care how many paintings or Justin Bieber tracks you have bought, and nor do working class families. Things like housing are more pressing, and housing isn't infinite, nor is space, nor the building materials needed.
Social mobility is on a downward trajectory at this moment in time.
Citing the opinion of experts isn't always about proving which side is right or wrong. It's often about viability.
In this context, are Labour's plans for the economy viable? The quoted list of experts seem to think they are. That should be reassuring, given how complicated a subject economics is. It's far too easy for the Conservative Party to just go "Mumble mumble money tree. Mumble mumble economic nonsense. Mumble mumble bankrupt us all.", preying on the complicated nature of economics and most people's desire for simplicity.
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That term "wealth distribution"
Do you not believe that people shouldn't earn the money they get? Or just handed to them.
Life would become uniform and regulated, individuality and difference suppressed - better only if you are a machine.
I'd be wary of experts and Labour's costing - the face value numbers might add up - but there is a whole lot of wishful thinking behind where they come from - saying X billion will come from Y when even a child knows that if you actually go after that potential source of revenue you'd be lucky to actually physically grasp even a half of X.
I don't know what happening in the word of politics.... its literally gone mad. Trump was bad enough but there is an actual credible scenario where the UK could pretty soon be run by a party that has an actual self confessed Marxist as its chancellor (yes I know being in a shadow position in opposition doesn't mean that if your party gets elected you take on the post but Corbyn WILL be in power if Labor win and Corbyn DID choose McDonnell for the post)......
...... but its worse than that he's not one that will actually publically admit that he's a Marxist of course because lets face it the track record for government's that implement Marxist policies isn't exactly great now is it? (by implement Marxist polices I mean the countries that are actually run on these principles not authoritarian countries like China who call claim to be Communist or run or Marxist principles but in reality are not)
and just to hammer home the message for those not paying attention the Labor communication chief is a 'ex' communist! Yes I'm sure Andrew Murray really has renounced communism for capitalism! I cant wait to hear the latest updates from the ministry of propaganda communication about tractor production if Labor wins!
(note: I know capitalism is far from a 'perfect' solution but its outcomes are frequently a lot better for the populace as a whole that Communism/ Marxism)
and that's before we get to Corbyn who spent a lot of his time before his rise to power voting against the party he was supposed to be a member of... strangely the socialist and communist parties have decided not to field any candidates ... could it be because Corbyn might as well be one of them (albeit on the less extreme side of their extreme parties)?
But Corbyn sound 'nice' and 'compassionate' now and makes doesn't make many statements about withdrawing support from military alliances that have maintained a modicum of security in western Europe for decades... that's before we get onto his 'interesting' previous acquaintances and friends.....
Vote for who you see best but know what your voting for!
Note: I'm not fan of May or the Tories and I believe that socialized health care and core utilities are a good idea for the security and prosperity of a nation
...... but its worse than that he's not one that will actually publically admit that he's a Marxist of course because lets face it the track record for government's that implement Marxist policies isn't exactly great now is it? (by implement Marxist polices I mean the countries that are actually run on these principles not authoritarian countries like China who call claim to be Communist or run or Marxist principles but in reality are not)
and just to hammer home the message for those not paying attention the Labor communication chief is a 'ex' communist! Yes I'm sure Andrew Murray really has renounced communism for capitalism! I cant wait to hear the latest updates from the ministry of
(note: I know capitalism is far from a 'perfect' solution but its outcomes are frequently a lot better for the populace as a whole that Communism/ Marxism)
and that's before we get to Corbyn who spent a lot of his time before his rise to power voting against the party he was supposed to be a member of... strangely the socialist and communist parties have decided not to field any candidates ... could it be because Corbyn might as well be one of them (albeit on the less extreme side of their extreme parties)?
But Corbyn sound 'nice' and 'compassionate' now and makes doesn't make many statements about withdrawing support from military alliances that have maintained a modicum of security in western Europe for decades... that's before we get onto his 'interesting' previous acquaintances and friends.....
Vote for who you see best but know what your voting for!
Note: I'm not fan of May or the Tories and I believe that socialized health care and core utilities are a good idea for the security and prosperity of a nation
@h4rm0ny
You are - or appear to be - saying that the 5% can have an ever greater share of the nation's wealth without the 95% having less. Is that a correct summation of your argument?
Because it's not an argument that any commentator, economist, or politician has put forwards.
Nobody, in fact, appears to be saying this bar yourself.
You are - or appear to be - saying that the 5% can have an ever greater share of the nation's wealth without the 95% having less. Is that a correct summation of your argument?
Because it's not an argument that any commentator, economist, or politician has put forwards.
Nobody, in fact, appears to be saying this bar yourself.
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500,000 is <1% of UK population and we're supposed to be ruled by the nasty, heartless Tories. Germany and France are much more wealth distributive economies than the UK and yet many more people require food banks. I don't know why this is, as I would have thought the opposite were true; but it shows high taxes and public spending don't necessarily lead to the outcomes you would expect.
Soldato
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Depends where the public spending is.
Like if you spend in areas that give people a chance of bettering themselves, everyone gets a fair roll of the dice.
Where have all the adult education / qualification schemes gone? Employers use to be quick to chuck those at people (subsidized). Nothing of the sort now. Everyone is just stuck in a rut.
Doesn't surprise me there's hundreds of people on the terror watch list that were born here. Got an ounce of religious nuttery in you, martyrdom seems a far better prospect than a zero hours contract Poundland.
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