US kills Iran's General Soleimani

[MartinPrince]

I was perfectly clear, sorry you couldn't follow.

It is nothing to do with being clear or people not following you, you were just simply wrong, mistaken, and in error as already pointed out here.

You're first error was in trying to make out there is a difference between "sites important to Iranian culture" and "Iranian cultural sites" when the meaning is exactly the same.

Your second error was in your prose as shown below.

↑
...Trump didn't specifically mention "cultural sites", but did write about sites important to Iranian culture, that these sites are all linked to the Iranian revolution of 1979 and would include mouthpieces of the Iranian regime like newspapers and broadcasters.
You stated correctly that Trump did write "about sites important to Iranian culture" but then put a coma after that and continued on to say "that these sites are all linked to the Iranian revolution". The only way that can be read and understood is that Trump also said the latter.

If it was your speculation what you should have written is that, "....but did write about sites important to Iranian culture, I think that these sites are all linked to the Iranian revolution...."

As you seem the intransigent type I won't be responding to you again as I'm pretty sure it is clear to you where you went wrong, even if you won't admit it.

 

[StriderX]

I feel Iran is going to be quiet for awhile and just let it simmer, while they focus on upgrading to S-400 systems, but the interior domestic problems haven't suddenly disappeared, a lack of action might look weak to some in the country now that Soleimani is no longer around to be feared.

The revenge could merely be getting rid of other countries in Iraq, it's probably not enough for someone like Khomeini, but we can't read his mind.

 

[Rroff]

I imagine Iran is going to be quiet for awhile and just let it simmer, while they focus on upgrading to S-400 systems, but the interior domestic problems haven't suddenly disappeared, a lack of action might look weak to some in the country now that Soleimani is no longer around to be feared.

Though they seem to be developing something domestically that is supposedly equivalent I believe Russia currently won't allow them to acquire the S-400 system due to concerns about what Iran would/could do with the potential range of such a system.

EDIT: Though quick google shows an article (latest item on the subject) claiming Russia is open to discussions with Iran over the S-400.

In a report published on May 30, Bloomberg claimed Russia had rejected Iran’s request to buy S-400 missile defense systems, “concerned that the sale would stoke more tension” in the Middle East.

But a Russian deputy prime minister rejected the Bloomberg report back in early June.

The Russian official who spoke on Friday also stressed that Russia had “not received an official request from our partners on this matter yet.”

Doesn't really deny that Russia has/had concerns over Iran acquiring such a system though.

 

[StriderX]

Though they seem to be developing something domestically that is supposedly equivalent I believe Russia currently won't allow them to acquire the S-400 system due to concerns about what Iran would/could do with the potential range of such a system.

There appears to be contradictory reports out on that, so i wasn't really sure.

Regardless it's not the main issue with Iran, it's the inhospitable terrain and a military force willing to use it against an enemy that's the problem with ending Iran's current influence in other countries. Air defenses are merely for deterrence and space to breath.

 

[Rroff]

There appears to be contradictory reports out on that, so i wasn't really sure.

Yeah I had a Google after posting seems a recentish article as above that claims Russia is open to discussions on the sale of it to Iran. I'm pretty sure Russia isn't in a hurry to let Iran have it though despite that.

Even a moderate number of S-400 installations don't really help against an invasion level assault in this case though as they are relatively limited ammo wise and relatively fixed targets in that they are prominent and would be tracked - the bigger defence is the proliferation of mobile medium capability systems with a degree of autonomy.

 

[Nasher]

A bunch of S-400s couldn't stop a few US cruise missiles, we've seen that already. So far they have only been good for shooting down airliners.

 

[StriderX]

S-400s couldn't stop a few cruise missiles, we've seen that already.

Just to be accurate, those systems were always under the control of Russia, no system was in Syrian control, so i doubt any S-400 missiles were even launched.

I seem to be correct. ('expert's' opinion, so degree of salt, but seems logical enough)

https://www.defensenews.com/pentago...-from-the-strikes-in-syria-america-or-russia/

 

[Nasher]

I can't see really them ignoring incoming missiles on purpose.

 

[Rroff]

I can't see really them ignoring incoming missiles on purpose.

Actually makes sense tactically - it could be such an attack was designed to draw out their defences - leaving them either vulnerable while reloading or unable to counter a more crucial threat. It actually makes perfect sense in the circumstances that the S-400 systems wouldn't engage unless absolutely necessary.

EDIT: Or as StriderX says below such an attack could be used to analyse their capabilities.

 

[StriderX]

It was Russia's choice ultimately, why would they use the limited services of a few launchers and let the US (or potential buyers...) learn about the capabilities of the system? That would be a ****** trade.

All the while they got to see how NATO systems operated, don't think they cared that much about Syria taking a few hits when they know the data is more valuable. All we saw with the strike is that previous systems are ineffectual (<1%), which Iran has plenty of, but Iran knows this. I do sort of wonder what the proficiency of the operator does to the older systems abilities though, I doubt Syria had many trained personnel left by that point.

Maybe NATO already know the abilities of the S-400 system and doesn't need a demonstration, they'd never admit to that though, so until it happens, we are none the wiser.

 

[Lord-Jaffa]

Angela Merkel heading to Russia to talk with Putin about the middle east crisis. To me, a layman, that seems to send some form of message as to who's considered the more reliable partner in the situation. And it isn't America.

Germany is just desperate for the Russian Pipeline Nord Stream 2, at this point they will do pretty much anything.

 

[Rroff]

All we saw with the strike is that previous systems are ineffectual (<1%), which Iran has plenty of, but Iran knows this. I do sort of wonder what the proficiency of the operator does to the older systems abilities though, I doubt Syria had many trained personnel left by that point.

The level of information makes a huge difference as well - those older systems are very capable supported with a networked integrated fire control system so they have a heads up what is coming and not very effective when they are firing reactively in relative isolation.

 

[Nasher]

It was Russia's choice ultimately, why would they use the limited services of a few launchers and let the US (or potential buyers...) learn about the capabilities of the system? That would be a ****** trade.

All the while they got to see how NATO systems operated, don't think they cared that much about Syria taking a few hits when they know the data is more valuable. All we saw with the strike is that previous systems are ineffectual (<1%), which Iran has plenty of, but Iran knows this. I do sort of wonder what the proficiency of the operator does to the older systems abilities though, I doubt Syria had many trained personnel left by that point.

Maybe NATO already know the abilities of the S-400 system and doesn't need a demonstration, they'd never admit to that though, so until it happens, we are none the wiser.

I once heard a story from someone in the RAF of how they managed to get hold of a Russian jet. A Russian pilot basically flew it to Cyprus and sold it to them in exchange for a few million and a passport lol

I wouldn't be surprised if they already have the latest a S-400. Or at least the blueprints.

Unlike Russia, the western lifestyle itself is enough to lure people in.

 

[Malevolence]

Germany is just desperate for the Russian Pipeline Nord Stream 2, at this point they will do pretty much anything.

Something which the US doesn't want.

https://www.state.gov/fact-sheet-on-u-s-opposition-to-nord-stream-2/

 

[jsmoke]

Something which the US doesn't want.

https://www.state.gov/fact-sheet-on-u-s-opposition-to-nord-stream-2/

Back to oil again, makes more sense.

 

[Rroff]

I once heard a story from someone in the RAF of how they managed to get hold of a Russian jet. A Russian pilot basically flew it to Cyprus and sold it to them in exchange for a few million and a passport lol

I wouldn't be surprised if they already have the latest a S-400. Or at least the blueprints.

Unlike Russia, the western lifestyle itself is enough to lure people in.

The only way the West has got hold of Russian hardware of that nature before is by buying it through another country or when another country has collapsed, etc. and that is usually the export version rather than domestic spec.

 

[Dis86]

Back to oil again, makes more sense.

Or literally stopping their allies Ukraine from being left in the cold

 

[Dis86]

The only way the West has got hold of Russian hardware of that nature before is by buying it through another country or when another country has collapsed, etc. and that is usually the export version rather than domestic spec.

Totes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Cold_War_pilot_defections

 

[FoxEye]

Back to oil again, makes more sense.

Well, gas in this case. The US is trying to block the sale of Russian gas to... anyone.

I wonder what this means, say, for a country desperate to sign a trade deal with the US? "I see you're importing gas from Russia. Hmm, maybe you'd like to reconsider?"

 

[Rroff]

Totes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Cold_War_pilot_defections

I'm talking about ground based systems such as the S-400 not aircraft.