Sale of petrol and diesel cars to be banned by 2040

Bug One said:
I take it you don't live near a coastline. There are offshore wind farms everywhere I can see now - a huge amount of investment has been taking place.


You reckon Elon isn't thinking about this already. I mean - the guy also runs a space agency.


You say suddenly, then 2040 in the same sentence. You realise that 2040 is a few years away, right?
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I do and I worded that wrong I guess but have you seen our government ? They cant get anything done in a reasonable time or organize a **** up in brewery!
 
Bug One said:
You say suddenly, then 2040 in the same sentence. You realise that 2040 is a few years away, right?
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(Checks Profile)

It really isn't. 20 years isn't really that much at all.

It only seems so to you since you are still quite young.

We would have to put the whole country on a NORKesque War economy C/W savage Rationing to achieve what the Greens want in that time frame.

Journey said:
Why not look at the total cost of ownership over the period the car is owned, rather than just the upfront cost?
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Because if you are on a limited income, the up-front costs are the ones that really matter.
 
MadMossy said:
People like you are why we never went back to the moon, people like me are the reason we went there in the first place. The technology is getting there, its only a matter of time (years) before it happens, could be 15 years could be 50 years, certainly in my life time I would like to think.
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I don't think people are not arguing it isn't but rather the fact in 15 years is not long away. The original Tesla Roadster was launched 12 years ago.
 
Just imagine the AA or RAC in the future towing around a diesel generator to power all the EV cars that ran out of juice. All that lovely black diesel fumes, from a generator that has no filtration on it!!
 
Mark1989 said:
Sorry but for me to have a EV it has to be charged at home at a minimum. I don't often go into a city center and there isn't one super market near that that provides charge ports. I work for massive company and again no charge points either.

Okay super markets near me or work may invest but would a car be insured to be left elsewhere whilst it's charged? I very much doubt it.

I'd love the infrastructure to get there as the tech itself is great whilst getting petrol or diesel cars off the road would be great for the environment too.
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Why wouldn’t it be insured? You park up your ICE car and leave it don’t you? Leaving a EV on charge is not really any different to parking up an ICE car and walking away for 30+mins.

The infrastructure is there in some areas but it clearly needs more work in other areas :( but at least it is improving month on month.
 
MadMossy said:
People like you are why we never went back to the moon, people like me are the reason we went there in the first place. The technology is getting there, its only a matter of time (years) before it happens, could be 15 years could be 50 years, certainly in my life time I would like to think.
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what was your contribution or do we call you Buzz?
 
Pottsey said:
Why wouldn’t it be insured? You park up your ICE car and leave it don’t you? Leaving a EV on charge is not really any different to parking up an ICE car and walking away for 30+mins.

The infrastructure is there in some areas but it clearly needs more work in other areas :( but at least it is improving month on month.
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I maybe wrong and correct me if so but wouldn't an EV car especially depending on it's performance need a good hour or 2 to reach max charge. Most car parks have time limits on plus you could get to one and be zero spaces free to charge the car as an example went to hull at weekend to the deep it had 2 spaces only where you could charge, yet the car park could fit in well over 70 plus cars

It's improving in what you could class as higher class city's such as London, Bradford in no way has any care for EV in any part of it I've seen.
 
MadMossy said:
Petrol may be the "most appealing" when you look at on vehicle cost alone, when if you consider the cost of maintenance/fuel as well, then the EV is likely to be cheaper over all. Not only would its tax be zero (petrol anything from £20 to £400), but the cost to recharge its batterly would be as low as £3.50 (50kW @ 7p kWh when charge at night on economy 7 rates) vs refueling a petrol/diesel tank for £62/£65. So if you refueled twice a month, your already nipping at the door of an EV in terms of cost of ownership. More than twice a month and the EV becomes an absolute bargain. When you add on general maintenance as well then the costs really start to spiral.

If I were in a position to buy a new car now, I wouldn't think twice about it, i'd get an electric car regardless and I live in a flat, the infrastructure is there for charging if needed in an emergency but a cable out the window would suffice for the time being.
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Journey said:
Why not look at the total cost of ownership over the period the car is owned, rather than just the upfront cost?

What is the difference in deprecation, fuel costs, servicing and maintenance costs, between the two vehicles? Also where did you get the costs from?
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The prices are taken from Peugeot's website and discounts from broadspeed (£2.5k petrol and £1k electric). Depreciation accounted for in PCP deal.

The Petrol car's first year of tax is included, but from year 2 it'll be £140, or £12 a month.

A Nissan leaf first serice is apparently £120-150 from what owners are saying. So you're saving less than £100 a year in servicing. So probably less than a tenner a month.

Fuel obviously is a big variable depending on milage. Doing 8,000 miles a year would cost about £95 a month in petrol, being realistic. That would be approximately 4 charge cycles, realistically. So Prehaps £14.

Adding all that together does save approximately £100 a month. Based on this rudamentary maths, 16,000 miles a year would see a break even point.

I would like an electric car, because I can get away with it as long as we keep our other car which is a diesel VW Touran. I just want to see something affordable that makes sense. Maybe a VW id3, but we'll have to see.
 
Mark1989 said:
went to hull at weekend to the deep it had 2 spaces only where you could charge, yet the car park could fit in well over 70 plus cars

It's improving in what you could class as higher class city's such as London, Bradford in no way has any care for EV in any part of it I've seen.
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Two spaces out of 70 sounds spot on given they make up less than 5% of new car sales let alone total cars on the road. Why would there be more than 2 in 2019/20?
 
Mark1989 said:
I maybe wrong and correct me if so but wouldn't an EV car especially depending on it's performance need a good hour or 2 to reach max charge. Most car parks have time limits on plus you could get to one and be zero spaces free to charge the car as an example went to hull at weekend to the deep it had 2 spaces only where you could charge, yet the car park could fit in well over 70 plus cars

It's improving in what you could class as higher class city's such as London, Bradford in no way has any care for EV in any part of it I've seen.
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You can get to around 80% in around 30min with a fast charger around about the same amount of time many people take to do a weekly shop. How long do you park up to go to the cinema or eat out at at a nice meal? that should be enough to get full or near full charge. Depending on factors 80% should be enough for most people to lasts days if not a week. You could get to one and have zero spaces free but its not like most people need to charge it up every day or every time you come across a spot. Just charge it up the next time you are out or the time after. Its not that different from getting fuel. You do not stop off every chance you get to top up patrol. You just pick a day and sometimes you delay it a few days and go later. Unless your driving on the limit you can do the same with EV's.

For most people based on an average daily drive a charge should last a good week or more or you can do 2 half chargers instead of one full one. So you only have to park you car in the right spot once a week and how many times do you park your car in a week? At least around here just about everywhere you park are EV points. Around my area even in some of the poorest towns let alone city's there are so many opportunities to park and charge there isn't a problem even if you do not have a driveway and even if you miss 1 day as all points are full.

Granted its not like that in all areas but its getting more common by the month.
 
Jonnycoupe said:
if they simply tow the car it will charge it...
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They won't tow them, they call in a flatbed which can take a long time to arrive. I know someone who had to wait over-night to have a flat EV carted away.

She arrived at a motorway services (without the range to reach any others) and the car just randomly refused to charge. No one had a clue what was going on, AA guy couldn't do anything, nor could the local dealer and it had to be shipped back to Nissan.
 
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I think consumer demand will drive the adoption of EV's way sooner than 2035, certainly for the top/mid range vehicle owners, and as the cost of batteries continue to drop, specially with multiple new factories starting up, it shouldnt be that impossible for cheap EVs to become available that would sit in with the current crop of cheaper city cars.

If VW, Honda, Toyota etc can introduce small city cars like the VW Up/Honda Jazz or Toyota Aygo in EV format for sub £10k then it won't take long at all for EVs to take over. Petrol stations would start replacing pumps with rapid charging points within 5 years or so. I can certainly seeing places like London being EV only very quickly and from there it would spread out around the rest of the country.

Within 5 years you'll likely see many logistics vehicles moving over to Electric, specially delivery/postal vans as they are all short range start/stop trips that would suit EV perfectly. Then you have the likes of Walmart/ASDA looking to receive a fleet of Tesla trucks sometime within the next year or two, those are autonomous vehicles so could see a shift into long haul logistics being automated.
 
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