AMD Navi 23 ‘NVIDIA Killer’ GPU Rumored to Support Hardware Ray Tracing, Coming Next Year

[TNA]

As I commented above, it is a sound point, but it is also marketing obfuscation again. Tell me, if Uncle Jensen describes the Hopper RTX 4070 as the flagship, despite there being a 4080 and 4090 too, would you just accept it? What makes the 4070 the flagship when there are better cards available? Also, there is certainly a price gap (not necessarily a performance gap) that can support a 20GB 3080 or 3080 Ti. If Nvidia drop that, does the 3080 still remain the flagship just because Jensen named it as such?

"Flagship gaming card" is marketing semantics, and part of this insidiously genius campaign.

Silence!! My card is flagship! Da bestest! The Leather Jacket Man said so!

What a load of rubbish, I know

 

[Zeeflyboy]

The cult marketing campaign has already started though, you can see it on this thread already - 'no answer to DLSS 2.0', 'ray tracing superior on Nvidia because: reasons'. Its all down to the fact that Nvidia feeds this machine, lapped up by the faithful and then spewed out all across social media, it is quite remarkable to see.

We won't see what happens with pricing until the first week/2nd week in February, nobody discounts brand new, hot products at Christmas, not even AMD.

My hand will be firmly clenched in my wallet until then and we have a full roundup of all the first-party and AIB card's plus PCB tear-downs and a catalogue of power limits, phase counts and ram chip manufacturers.

Well I mean that's just fanboy drivel though that most sane people would ignore. No one can state "no answer to DLSS" until after the presentation on the 28th... We simply don't know what they have. No one can state how Navi RT performs because we don't even know how games will implement it let alone have any actually tangible details on the hardware side... Until we have the cards in hand and AMD's presentation out of the way it's just noise.

I really look forward to seeing how the cards stack up, but it won't stop the stupid arguments. Even if one card beats the other there'll be "But this, but that" from the respective camp's fanboys, I think it's probably unlikely at this point that one card will simply outperform the other in every single aspect and there will always be some argument to be made that X is cheaper, Y has a software feature that I care about, Z company is evil and the CEO shagged my mum etc etc.

 

[Scougar]

*SNIP*

It is literally this simple:
Top RTX Geforce SKU for Turing: 2080 Ti, £1,200+
Top RTX Geforece SKU for Ampere: 3090, £1,400+

Nvidia have successfully raised the price again.

*SNIP*

I genuinely don't know how you don't see this. It is clear as day, beyond obvious.

Honestly, I hadn't looked at it like that. Probably because I don't normally burn my money on excessively priced products. Well pointed out, thanks

 

[Gregster]

And a 1660Ti was worlds better than the 2080 Ti's pricing, but that means nothing since we're talking about SKU-for-SKU comparisons. If you're hinging some kind of value argument on the 2nd tier SKU costing less than the top tier SKU then you're going to fall flat on your face.

It is literally this simple:
Top RTX Geforce SKU for Turing: 2080 Ti, £1,200+
Top RTX Geforece SKU for Ampere: 3090, £1,400+

Nvidia have successfully raised the price again.

2nd RTX Geforce SKU for Turing: 2080, £700
2nd RTX Geforece SKU for Ampere: 3080, £700 (lol OK)

Nvidia have held price, but that price is a carefully crafted lie. You cannot buy, nor will you realistically ever buy, a 3080 for less than £800, and those prices are set to increase again once Nvidia rescind their (alleged) initial AIB discount. So, Nvidia have successfully raised the price again, and this time actually managed to spin desire and hype into the mix to get people interested and get sales. A not-insignificant price increase and significantly bigger customer interest? Shareholders will be very happy indeed.


I genuinely don't know how you don't see this. It is clear as day, beyond obvious.

Even I agree with this (rare I know) but the 3090 is the 2080Ti replacement card.

 

[Sumanji]

A lot of noise over what seems like semantics to me

Just want to point out that you are trying to align a complete product stack at the end of its lifecycle against a newly released (and likely incomplete) product stack.

I.e. If Jen-Hsun announces a 3080Ti, 3090Ti, or a Titan card somewhere down the line, all your comparisons will get messed up

 

[LePhuronn]

Even I agree with this (rare I know) but the 3090 is the 2080Ti replacement card.

And this is what I've trying to get my head around. We can all have our own opinions and discuss/debate/bicker our respective points when it comes to rumour and speculation because you can't do anything else without hard fact. But when there is hard fact I honestly cannot understand how people can argue with it. The post you quoted is the perfect example of that.

 

[LePhuronn]

A lot of noise over what seems like semantics to me

Just want to point out that you are trying to align a complete product stack at the end of its lifecycle against a newly released (and likely incomplete) product stack.

I.e. If Jen-Hsun announces a 3080Ti, 3090Ti, or a Titan card somewhere down the line, all your comparisons will get messed up

Well no, my alignment won't be messed up because I'm not trying to compare or align anything. I've literally argued what you've just said yourself: Uncle Jensen can shout how the 3080 is the flagship all he wants, but it just isn't. The 3090 exists now, a 20GB 3080 or 3080 Ti will surpass the 3080. Any and all comparisons of value, price and whatnot of "flagship vs flagship" are completely skewed and part of this insidious marketing mindbender to dupe people into thinking they're getting something they're not.

 

[BigBANGtheory]

Even I agree with this (rare I know) but the 3090 is the 2080Ti replacement card.

yes of course it is, you need to look at the price points not the marketing and product names cos these all change to suit Nvidia's narrative

 

[james.miller]

'flagship' doesnt have to be the fastest card. Flagship can mean many things, fastest, biggest, highest profile ect.

Don't get too caught up on the word. Jensen said the 3080 is their flagship because that's how they're selling it. Nothing really more than that.

 

[jonneymendoza]

'flagship' doesnt have to be the fastest card. Flagship can mean many things, fastest, biggest, highest profile ect.

Don't get too caught up on the word. Jensen said the 3080 is their flagship because that's how they're selling it. Nothing really more than that.

Well itsb not the fastest, biggest, highest profile ect. Its the 3090 that is LOL

 

[smr]

That's what I was thinking too. Flagship doesn't mean fastest no. It will be the biggest selling 3000 series graphics card which I think is why nvidia have stipulated it with flagship status.

 

[smr]

The 3090 has already earned it's status as a Card which is OTT for most gamers, and is geared more towards creators / Scientists/ Devs and only a small minority of hardcore enthusiasts, the 3080 will out sell it copiously.

 

[EastCoastHandle]

It's a shame really. The true successor of the 2080ti is the 3090 (or s variants when released). Only if you pay close attention to the performance metrics. And they certainly raise the bar by another 200 to buy it.

So if you went from a 2080ti to 3080 you down graded to next gen.

 

[james.miller]

Well itsb not the fastest, biggest, highest profile ect. Its the 3090 that is LOL

it's also well in to diminishing returns with significantly worse performance/price and clearly not the card nVidia want to spearhead the turing range.

 

[gpuerrilla]

Honestly, I hadn't looked at it like that. Probably because I don't normally burn my money on excessively priced products. Well pointed out, thanks

Welcome outside of the matrix..

Even I agree with this (rare I know) but the 3090 is the 2080Ti replacement card.

\o/

yes of course it is, you need to look at the price points not the marketing and product names cos these all change to suit Nvidia's narrative

OMG I might have no need to bang my head against nearby brick wall... all these people having a realisation.. maybe it took the horlicks of the 30 series release for the penny to drop!!

 

[pooley]

love the mental gymnastics here, a slower, cheaper card is now the 'flagship' as it sold more just lolz

 

[AMDPower]

It's a shame really. The true successor of the 2080ti is the 3090 (or s variants when released). Only if you pay close attention to the performance metrics. And they certainly raise the bar by another 200 to buy it.

So if you went from a 2080ti to 3080 you down graded to next gen.

You would be mad to pay £700+ for 10% extra performance.

if it was 25-30% extra performance, no problem the money is somewhat worth it, but for 10%, no way.

Now if you need the extra ram then no problem I understand that reasoning but from gaming perspective BIG no.

 

[gpuerrilla]

love the mental gymnastics here, a slower, cheaper card is now the 'flagship' as it sold more just lolz

Jensen works in mysterious ways. Just watch the slight of hand moving things outside of your vision.

 

[gpuerrilla]

You would be mad to pay £700+ for 10% extra performance.

if it was 25-30% extra performance, no problem the money is somewhat worth it, but for 10%, no way.

Now if you need the extra ram then no problem I understand that reasoning but from gaming perspective BIG no.

But this got lost a long time ago. The price of a 'high-end' graphics card should be no more than £500. Paying for the 'flagship' or the 'best' is just playing into their hands which causes this bar raised mentality with pricing to boot.

 

[james.miller]

love the mental gymnastics here, a slower, cheaper card is now the 'flagship' as it sold more just lolz

no mental gymnastics here, just a lack of understanding of what the word means.

But this got lost a long time ago. The price of a 'high-end' graphics card should be no more than £500. Paying for the 'flagship' or the 'best' is just playing into their hands which causes this bar raised mentality with pricing to boot.

Yep ^^