Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

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Diesel is now about 25kr per litre and going up 40 ore a day... Has been for 2 weeks.

So about 2 quid and going up daily by 3p or 4p

Crazy af

Electric here was spiking at 40p..
Historical prices are less than 10p pkwh

#rem it's the end of the world as we know it.

That's doom for all the Ethereum and bitcoin miners up here. Haw haw!
 
Sankari said:
* the referendums were illegal; they have no legal authority, because Ukraine's constitution does not allow any region to declare independence from the rest of the country

* the referendums were rigged; independent observers were denied access, Russian voters were brought in to stack the vote, only 34% of Crimean residents actually participated in the referendum, and Russian voters themselves admitted they had been allowed to vote as foreign citizens despite this being illegal

The first point invalidates the referendums by default; the second point is just another nail in the coffin. So stop bleating about the referendums, because they mean absolutely nothing.
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While I agree that in this case the referendums were almost certainly rigged, I'm not sure the fact they weren't constitutional is a good reason for saying they mean nothing. I guess it's a bit of a point for debate how much right people have to determine which country the area they live in belongs to, but personally I think it should be possible for a majority (possibly a supermajority of some kind) to decide that their area should leave the country it is currently part of and join another one or become independent.

If hypothetically there was a free and fair referendum and a large majority of Crimeans did want Crimea to leave Ukraine and join Russia, I don't think it would be right to claim the referendum they held wasn't legitimate just because the government didn't want them to have one.

Same as for example if the UK never granted Scotland the legal right to hold a referendum but they decided to have one anyway, it would be wrong to ignore a majority voting for independence just because it wasn't 'constitutional'.

A bit of a side track I know :p
 
thenewoc said:
We wouldn't be full up if the EU had addressed their migrant problem in the first place. They let unlimited numbers pour into their external borders and then didn't actually want them and turned a blind eye to them massing at Calais. From there they've done very little to prevent them crossing the Channel so we've ended up with tens of thousands this year already. We don't have unlimited funds to house these people.
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Take your nonsense elsewhere. We've taken a fraction of other EU states. I'm not interested in your Billy Britain opinions. You've shown yourself to be one of the most bigoted posters in here again and again. These are people fleeing a war who are seeing their country being destroyed and their men and those women and children who haven't got out yet killed.
 
Jono8 said:
What the hell?

As if many Ukrainians are going to trust taking asylum in the country that is actively bombing their homes!
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He (Putin) wants to show thousands of Ukraine's evacuating over the border to "safe" Russia on TV, to make the Russian population think Ukrainians are happy with their special operation and thankful to come to Russia.

Absolute dick move.
 
chrcoluk said:
Of course, but my point is I dont think we and others will honour Nato treaty if Romania attacked. Which in turn means if Putin attacks a Nato country he wil get away with it.
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Putin won’t do ****. He can barely handle Ukraine. As for nato, there’s no choice but to defend or it all falls apart. I wouldn’t want to see it tested though!
 
GreatAuk said:
While I agree that in this case the referendums were almost certainly rigged, I'm not sure the fact they weren't constitutional is a good reason for saying they mean nothing. I guess it's a bit of a point for debate how much right people have to determine which country the area they live in belongs to, but personally I think it should be possible for a majority (possibly a supermajority of some kind) to decide that their area should leave the country it is currently part of and join another one or become independent.

If hypothetically there was a free and fair referendum and a large majority of Crimeans did want Crimea to leave Ukraine and join Russia, I don't think it would be right to claim the referendum they held wasn't legitimate just because the government didn't want them to have one.

Same as for example if the UK never granted Scotland the legal right to hold a referendum but they decided to have one anyway, it would be wrong to ignore a majority voting for independence just because it wasn't 'constitutional'.

A bit of a side track I know :p
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Talking of rigged illegal referendum results, that the government in power decide to take as gospel, and jam down the throats of the majority of the population who did not want that outcome.

Brexit vote anybody? :p:p:p:p
 
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