2022 mini-budget discussion

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Budget cuts would happen anyway during a recession, but the tax cuts means there will likely be more which is worse situation.

Indeed. And the public, even the ignorant ones will easily be able to see from news that they are giving to the rich to do it.

Their voter base is evaporating.

They must be doing it for personal gain. Can't see any other reason you'd go against basically everyone's advice
 
It would kill our ability to export our goods around the globe. We already have a problem with low productivity and overpaid unskilled workers so I don't agree that your suggestion is sensible or attainable.

So you would rather that a large percentage of the population dont get paid enough to live on and the rest of the country's taxpayers pay more tax to top up their wages while big corporations make massive profits and those are then paid out to foreign owners moving the money out of the UK?

And no it doesnt have to put costs up at all. Take my work. The directors have gone from £200k ish to £250k each over the last 2 years. if they hadnt increased their income due to increasing profits we could have given every member of staff a 4% payrise and we wouldnt have had to increase our charge out rate at all in order to cover that extra cost.
 
They just haven't realised our governments brilliance yet.
The article continues :

The crisis of confidence had been brewing for years. Dubious claims from the ruling Conservatives — ranging from Brexit’s benefits to parties in Downing Street during lockdown — together with the recent ousting of the Treasury’s top official and the side-lining of the country’s budget watchdog meant investors didn’t believe the Chancellor when he promised to stabilize the public finances.

The markets “aren’t willing to trust the Truss administration’s claims that it will deliver medium-term fiscal sustainability on the basis of its word alone,” said Allan Monks, an economist at JPMorgan Chase & Co. in London. “That reflects a broader distrust in markets about how UK policy making has been evolving — and in our view, that distrust is entirely justified.”

Nothing illustrates it better than the slide in the pound. It’s fallen from a high of more than $2 in 2007, just before the financial crisis, to $1.50 at the time of the Brexit referendum, and is now on the brink of parity with the dollar.

“Because the UK has damaged its once strong credibility with a poorly managed Brexit and persistent threats of a UK-EU trade war, it no longer enjoys the benefit of the doubt,” said Berenberg’s Pickering.

For JPMorgan’s Monks, the doubts set in before the 2016 Brexit referendum, accelerated after the shock result, and culminated in recent attacks on the central bank, the judiciary, and the civil service.

Nevertheless, Friday’s act of fiscal largess — being unfunded — marked a major break from the economic traditions of Truss’s Conservative Party. The government still needs to set out how it will cover the additional borrowing required to fund its £45 billion of tax cuts and further £60 billion-plus for its program to offset the recent surge in energy bills.

Those measures will drive up the country’s budget deficit to 4.5% of gross domestic product. That would be enough to put the debt burden on an explosive path, hitting 101% of GDP by 2030, according to Bloomberg Economics.

In the meantime, the Bank of England will come under mounting pressure. The central bank has spent much of the year struggling to raise interest rates fast enough to combat a surge in inflation it failed to predict.

The BOE is now all but guaranteed to respond to the looser fiscal policy with tighter monetary policy. Money market traders are now betting on at least a 150 basis-point rise in interest rates by policymakers' next gathering on Nov. 3. Setting aside the risk of an emergency hike outside of scheduled meetings, that would be a move unprecedented since the bank was granted independence by the government in 1997. Pricing also shows the benchmark rate will almost certainly hit 6% next year.
Chickens coming home to roost....The Birds style...
 
If they are going on record with tax cuts for the rich but budget cuts for services their option polls are going to fall through the floor.
You'd think but a quick glance at the Daily Mail comments section will reassure you there's plenty enough people who will happily see 'welfare budgets' cut because only benefit cheats and illegal immigrants use welfare money.
 
You'd think but a quick glance at the Daily Mail comments section will reassure you there's plenty enough people who will happily see 'welfare budgets' cut because only benefit cheats and illegal immigrants use welfare money.

This is true. I do sometimes have a peruse of that. It's quite vile
 
Refreshing not to see the usual u turn after media hysteria lol - ultimately over £2bn, ridiculous..

So Labour are saying they wouldn't undo the cuts apart from reverting the 40% rate to 45% over £150k so what's their plan for funding this?

Also Labour saying they would reinstate the 45% rate and then use this 'new' money to pay for whatever policy goes down best on Twitter is just another reminder as to why they are not to be taken seriously..
 
Refreshing not to see the usual u turn after media hysteria lol - ultimately over £2bn, ridiculous..

So Labour are saying they wouldn't undo the cuts apart from reverting the 40% rate to 45% over £150k so what's their plan for funding this?

Also Labour saying they would reinstate the 45% rate and then use this 'new' money to pay for whatever policy goes down best on Twitter is just another reminder as to why they are not to be taken seriously..

Did you miss the entire £500 Billion wiped off the stock market or the BoE being forced to print £65 Billion so UK PLC pensions fund doesnt collapse?
 
I cannot stand Truss, bad choice, not that there are many good choices these days, but even as someone right of centre, this just look like popularism to get some short term public gain..

This was discussed to death yesterday in the office and our most vocal labourite was lambasting Truss for trying to spend her way out of the recession and this is an obvious fallacy basing that on having this huge debt around our necks, so I just asked why was he so against Cameron and the period of austerity to reduce debt because at that time the same vocal labourite thought the way to stimulate the economy was to spend our way out?

Obviously the situation is different, but he's so used to just parrotting labours stance he couldn't actually formulate a response.. And doesn't this highlight the main issue, whilst all our leaders on any side of the aisle just fight and bicker, constantly promising more money but failing to provide a credible financial plan to achieve that, arguing the opposite of whatever your opposition says, this just fuels many bad decisions?

I am sure we would all agree that a panel of financial experts should be drawn on so decisions can be defended by some logic. I suspect people will still disagree, but at the moment it's hard for anyone to not agree it seems so reckless..
 
Refreshing not to see the usual u turn after media hysteria lol - ultimately over £2bn, ridiculous..

So Labour are saying they wouldn't undo the cuts apart from reverting the 40% rate to 45% over £150k so what's their plan for funding this?

Also Labour saying they would reinstate the 45% rate and then use this 'new' money to pay for whatever policy goes down best on Twitter is just another reminder as to why they are not to be taken seriously..
Oh yes, because at times like this we need Labour to step up and explain how they'll get us out of this mess. :p
 
Anyone know exactly what would have played out had the BoE not stepped in?

If it's happened then surely it will happen again?

Would vast swathes of pension funds literally evaporate over night? Is it that bad? As that's what it reads as.

Just trying to get a clear understanding of what's to come.

BoE said it was a temporary fix. So unless something changes in what the Govt does then its not permanently fixed.
 
I cannot stand Truss, bad choice, not that there are many good choices these days, but even as someone right of centre, this just look like popularism to get some short term public gain..

This was discussed to death yesterday in the office and our most vocal labourite was lambasting Truss for trying to spend her way out of the recession and this is an obvious fallacy basing that on having this huge debt around our necks, so I just asked why was he so against Cameron and the period of austerity to reduce debt because at that time the same vocal labourite thought the way to stimulate the economy was to spend our way out?

Obviously the situation is different, but he's so used to just parrotting labours stance he couldn't actually formulate a response.. And doesn't this highlight the main issue, whilst all our leaders on any side of the aisle just fight and bicker, constantly promising more money but failing to provide a credible financial plan to achieve that, arguing the opposite of whatever your opposition says, this just fuels many bad decisions?

I am sure we would all agree that a panel of financial experts should be drawn on so decisions can be defended by some logic. I suspect people will still disagree, but at the moment it's hard for anyone to not agree it seems so reckless..

I like that one of Truss' own economists who helped with the overall theme of her policies has criticised how they've gone about doing things. Which is what I also think, it's not what they're doing (tax cuts) it's how they're doing it (not providing costings/a plan for how government will adapt to the cuts).
 
Did you miss the entire £500 Billion wiped off the stock market or the BoE being forced to print £65 Billion so UK PLC pensions fund doesnt collapse?

The obscene level of mental gymnastics and utter delusion on display by the handful of terminally gullible individuals still trying to defend this catastrophe, really is quite breathtaking isn't it?
 
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I cannot stand Truss, bad choice, not that there are many good choices these days, but even as someone right of centre, this just look like popularism to get some short term public gain..

This was discussed to death yesterday in the office and our most vocal labourite was lambasting Truss for trying to spend her way out of the recession and this is an obvious fallacy basing that on having this huge debt around our necks, so I just asked why was he so against Cameron and the period of austerity to reduce debt because at that time the same vocal labourite thought the way to stimulate the economy was to spend our way out?

Obviously the situation is different, but he's so used to just parrotting labours stance he couldn't actually formulate a response.. And doesn't this highlight the main issue, whilst all our leaders on any side of the aisle just fight and bicker, constantly promising more money but failing to provide a credible financial plan to achieve that, arguing the opposite of whatever your opposition says, this just fuels many bad decisions?

I am sure we would all agree that a panel of financial experts should be drawn on so decisions can be defended by some logic. I suspect people will still disagree, but at the moment it's hard for anyone to not agree it seems so reckless..

It's quite simple, you don't sideline/skip/remove all the checks and balances like the Tories have. This provides some credibility to your plans. Labours ideas, so far, seem like decent ideas for the future, imo.
 
Oh yes, because at times like this we need Labour to step up and explain how they'll get us out of this mess. :p


Well no - the point is they dont have a plan so they are criticising the govt for not releasing a plan whilst saying they would keep most of the cuts that are popular on Twitter.. pathetic... cake and eat it, as your EU overlords used to say.. lol
 
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