UEFA Champions & Europa League Football Thread ** spoilers ** [7th - 9th November 2023]

Shamikebab said:
Maguire wasn't pushed out of the door. ETH said all summer he'd be happy if he stayed but would understand if he wanted to leave to play regularly. He's playing because we've got an injury crisis what are you talking about? :confused: Fernandes captain, who should be captain? Picking fights with players? You mean Sancho being a ****? What a load of nonsense you've just wrote Baz.
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He was picking the tea lady ahead of Maguire trying to force him out. As usual it's pointless saying anything critical of Utd as you take it so personally.
 
BaZ87 said:
He was picking the tea lady ahead of Maguire trying to force him out. As usual it's pointless saying anything critical of Utd as you take it so personally.
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He's in the same position he's been since last year I don't know what you're talking about. You're just making **** up now. He picked Shaw ahead of him, who is injured...so he's playing. It's not complicated. You're acting like he's flip flopped on some big decision.
 
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Shamikebab said:
Maguire wasn't pushed out of the door. ETH said all summer he'd be happy if he stayed but would understand if he wanted to leave to play regularly. He's playing because we've got an injury crisis what are you talking about? :confused: Fernandes captain, who should be captain? Picking fights with players? You mean Sancho being a ****? What a load of nonsense you've just wrote Baz.
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Sancho being a **** aka sending a tweet is nothing compared who he was happy to come back into the squad.
 
How many points does a country get for a team wining the champions league? If it’s not a gillzion then the PL can kiss that 5th spot goodbye:D
 
BaZ87 said:
I've not called for him to go, I was simply responding to your post where you excused ETH for today's game but ignored the other dozen plus games where you've been poor and contributed to the calls for him to go.

As Carragher said during his debate with Neville the other week, as bad as your owners are etc etc, there's plenty of things that are still in his control and he should be doing so much better than he is. Utd have got progressively worse over the past 12 months and ETH is responsible for his signings, his work on the training ground and the way he sets the side up and this Utd side looks more lost and confused than any Utd side I can remember. Whether it's the decision to spend so much on Mount when he wasn't needed (or at least shouldn't have been a priority), Maguire going from being pushed out the door to starting every week (alongside Evans) while Varane is benched, making Fernandes captain, picking fights with players, it's just a shambles and these are all things he's responsible for.
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I expect better from you Baz with your understanding of the game and especially since Liverpool went through a very similar injury crisis twice and were terrible for huge portions of the season. Plenty of people then were saying "Klopp hasn't a clue" and every week he had to go out in front of the media with a brave face. This whole mantra of "deal with it" is just silly. I knew pretty much at the end of August we would be in this situation and it will not get better until we get our players back.

Maguire is surplus for requirements but ETH has no option but to play him. Maguire cannot play on the left as ETH identified quite early on and uses Evans with him as he doesn't really have anyone else who can because all his players that can are injured. Varane just doesn't look like he is up to the job at the moment.

We have rotated the squad so many times with no solid back 4 since the season started. We have played Amrabat, Lindelof and Dalot as left back and the CB pairing has changed every game.

The purchase of Mount was pretty obvious to me. He needed a player with legs in the middle a bit like Amrabat but further up the field as Eriksen and Casemiro do not have the legs to play 50+ games a season. The problem for mount he has come into a side that is pretty much threadbare at the moment so ETH is sticking with the players that he knows.

The performance was great last night and in total cruise until Rashford was sent off. I would even argue up until that point it was one of our best performances of recent times.

Two of the goals we conceded last night were mistakes by Dalot simply because he is a right back being played out of position at left back and his positioning was completely off for the 3rd and 4th goal.
 
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adam cool dude said:
I expect better from you Baz with your understanding of the game and especially since Liverpool went through a very similar injury crisis twice and were terrible for huge portions of the season. Plenty of people then were saying "Klopp hasn't a clue" and every week he had to go out in front of the media with a brave face. This whole mantra of "deal with it" is just silly. I knew pretty much at the end of August we would be in this situation and it will not get better until we get our players back.

Maguire is surplus for requirements but ETH has no option but to play him. Maguire cannot play on the left as ETH identified quite early on and uses Evans with him as he doesn't really have anyone else who can because all his players that can are injured. Varane just doesn't look like he is up to the job at the moment.

We have rotated the squad so many times with no solid back 4 since the season started. We have played Amrabat, Lindelof and Dalot as left back and the CB pairing has changed every game.

The purchase of Mount was pretty obvious to me. He needed a player with legs in the middle a bit like Amrabat but further up the field as Eriksen and Casemiro do not have the legs to play 50+ games a season. The problem for mount he has come into a side that is pretty much threadbare at the moment so ETH is sticking with the players that he knows.

The performance was great last night and in total cruise until Rashford was sent off. I would even argue up until that point it was one of our best performances of recent times.

Two of the goals we conceded last night were mistakes by Dalot simply because he is a right back being played out of position at left back and his positioning was completely off for the 3rd and 4th goal.
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The temptation to just reply with a sarcastic comment about ETH actually doing a great job and give him an 8 year contract is so great.

You're exaggerating your injury crisis to cover for other failings. You were without Snow White's helper, Shaw and Casemiro yesterday, the latter who has been pretty rubbish whenever he's played and you were playing against a championship level side. But lets look at Utd's opening 3 games of the season, vs Wolves you had a pretty much full strength side out with all those players available, how did you play? Terribly. 2nd game off the season vs Spurs you had the same full strength side out, how did you get on? What about the 3rd game of the season at home to Forest? You were without just Luke Shaw, does that excuse the terrible performance again? There's been numerous other games where the only obvious issue with the Utd side has been the lack of a natural left back and you've still played terribly.

Maguire was clearly not wanted and ETH playing everybody and anybody ahead of him at the back end of last season and start of this season now he's first choice, keeping Varane out of the side. You've spent £50m odd on a player that can only really play in the position your best player and charismatic captain plays in, all while you're scraping round the back of the sofa to bring a crab in on loan because you needed a defensively minded CM. It's not after the event to say it was fairly obvious that Casemiro wasn't a long term option when he was signed and the signs of his decline were clear from the back end of last season. That £50m odd would have been far better spent on somebody to cover/replace him than Mount.

No you can put all your issues down to being without Shaw and Martinez all you want and blame the goals you conceded on the fact Dalot is a right back, not a left back but you had a left back on the bench last night, maybe ETH could have picked him? Or is that somebody elses fault too?
 
BaZ87 said:
The temptation to just reply with a sarcastic comment about ETH actually doing a great job and give him an 8 year contract is so great.

You're exaggerating your injury crisis to cover for other failings. You were without Snow White's helper, Shaw and Casemiro yesterday, the latter who has been pretty rubbish whenever he's played and you were playing against a championship level side. But lets look at Utd's opening 3 games of the season, vs Wolves you had a pretty much full strength side out with all those players available, how did you play? Terribly. 2nd game off the season vs Spurs you had the same full strength side out, how did you get on? What about the 3rd game of the season at home to Forest? You were without just Luke Shaw, does that excuse the terrible performance again? There's been numerous other games where the only obvious issue with the Utd side has been the lack of a natural left back and you've still played terribly.

Maguire was clearly not wanted and ETH playing everybody and anybody ahead of him at the back end of last season and start of this season now he's first choice, keeping Varane out of the side. You've spent £50m odd on a player that can only really play in the position your best player and charismatic captain plays in, all while you're scraping round the back of the sofa to bring a crab in on loan because you needed a defensively minded CM. It's not after the event to say it was fairly obvious that Casemiro wasn't a long term option when he was signed and the signs of his decline were clear from the back end of last season. That £50m odd would have been far better spent on somebody to cover/replace him than Mount.

No you can put all your issues down to being without Shaw and Martinez all you want and blame the goals you conceded on the fact Dalot is a right back, not a left back but you had a left back on the bench last night, maybe ETH could have picked him? Or is that somebody elses fault too?
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I guess we will see when we get all our injuries back. Then either you will be right and ETH is a fraud or I will be right but I have never seen a team where chopping and changing you back 4 every week has led to success.
 
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adam cool dude said:
I guess we will see when we get all our injuries back. Then either you will be right and ETH is a fraud or I will be right but I have never seen a team where chopping and changing you back 4 every week has led to success.
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You should still be able to beat Copenhagen and not concede 4 regardless of your back 4.

Do United have a get out in regard to Amrabat? He's absolutely garbage.
 
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omnomnom said:
You should still be able to beat Copenhagen and not concede 4 regardless of your back 4.

Do United have a get out in regard to Amrabat? He's absolutely garbage.
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Oh I agree. We did exactly the same against Galatasaray when Casemiro was sent off but when you have the moral and mental strength of Manchester United it is a dead cert to get demolished. This has been a problem that goes back even to Jose.
 
adam cool dude said:
I guess we will see when we get all our injuries back. Then either you will be right and ETH is a fraud or I will be right but I have never seen a team where chopping and changing you back 4 every week has led to success.
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But you were playing equally as bad before these players started getting injured Adam. Of course injuries have compounded the situation but they're not the only issue at Utd. You weren't playing well at the back end of last season. As I said, Casemiro's struggles began back then and yet bringing in somebody to cover/compete/replace him was seemingly an after thought. You talk about chopping and changing but ETH has contributed to that with his flip flopping with your CB's. When Varane first got injured Lindelof came into the side and he stayed in the side when Martinez got injured and Varane came back, now Lindelof and Varane are both out the side and he's picking Maguire and Evans over them. Similarly the left back situation you keep pointing to - he's swapped between picking Reguilon and Dalot. These are not decisions that he's been forced to make, these are decisions he's chose to make. I'm not necessarily criticising him for making those decisions but you cannot use the constant rotation of your back 4 as a defence of the manager when he's the one that's chose to make those changes.

There is more wrong with this Utd side than missing Luke Shaw and Martinez and this constant refusal of Gary Neville and a handful of Utd fans to accept ETH is at least partially to blame for the sides failings is getting a little desperate now. The Glazers can be terrible owners and Utd can have a couple of injuries without the side being as bad as it is. We're however many games into the season and Utd have had 1 good/comfortable performance, that's mental. You cite Liverpool's issues last season and during the covid season but we weren't terrible every single game. There were clear issues and Klopp was accountable for a number of these (his decisions (which I agreed with fwiw) to not sign another CB in the covid season and his refusual to not refresh our midfield last season massively backfired) but you could still see a style of play and we were still putting in good performances around the bad ones.
 
Shamikebab said:
We got 'pumped' by 1 goal after being down a man for over an hour and having a laundry list of contentious decisions against us.
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But Man U have been playing crap all season, they are dire to watch, have no real plan and I can’t see any improvement. Similar to Spurs once Conte spat his dummy out.

Honestly, if I supported Man U I would be very concerned at the moment, and its not something I say to get a bite. Training ground, stadium, structure and team all need significant financial input and personal who are experts in thier own areas to improve. Without that you’ll become more like Newcastle used to be, a team that overpays for players in wages and fees because nobody wants to go there and the weather is crap.
 
Jimbeam3678 said:
But Man U have been playing crap all season, they are dire to watch, have no real plan and I can’t see any improvement. Similar to Spurs once Conte spat his dummy out.

Honestly, if I supported Man U I would be very concerned at the moment, and its not something I say to get a bite. Training ground, stadium, structure and team all need significant financial input and personal who are experts in thier own areas to improve. Without that you’ll become more like Newcastle used to be, a team that overpays for players in wages and fees because nobody wants to go there and the weather is crap.
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Nobody is not concerned, but for how crap we've been we're still only 6 pts off top 4 so it's not all dire. Similarly every fan wants the latter fixed and none of these problems are fixed by sacking another manager.
 
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