BMW and M Power Owners

[Robi]

It's going to feel pretty different, as it is a different engine and better suspension setup.


In the short amount of time I've spent in an M3, I do prefer the N55 as an engine compared to the S55, if only for sound. The S55 sounds more fizzy and raspy, the N55 more throaty and growly. It's more old school BMW sound.



I think the M2 sweet spot is LCI non comp, as you get the N55 with LCI improvements, from memory.



Also, if you've got an auto, the DCT in the M2 will be a very different experience (in a good way).

You're not the first person to say that.

My only concern with non-comp is that it's the same engine as my current car, how much different will it really feel (probably a silly question)? Although from what you said previously, very different.

From the looks of Autotrader, it's actually going to be difficult to find an LCI non-comp. From 2018 onwards, sub 35k miles, long beach blue (my preference), 9 available, all of which are comp. They range from £32.2k to £37.2k.

 

[[TW]Fox]

Are the laser lights genuinely that decent on the G20?

Yes.

It seems like they're just the normal adaptive LED headlights, with lasers for >35 (?) MPH speeds where they increase range.


Can't tell if they have the ability to blank out parts of the beam?

They do and this is the main reason why you want them. The visibility package adds the laser headlights and the better automatic high beam system that does exactly as you describe. The Visibility Package is the only way to get this on 2019-2022 cars.

You can add Automatic High Beams to a standard car if the car built after about mid 2020 but using the BMW Connected Drive store but this only does on or off, it does not split the beam in the way you describe.

I've seen mixed reviews on them, some saying they can't live without them, some saying they don't miss them, some saying they never saw the lasers on.

When the laser lights operate they are noticeable and excellent. However, the list of requirements for them to work is such that you'll very rarely ever see them work. The benefit in the visibility package is not the lasers, it's the high beam assistant and the fact the headlights themselves look much better than the ones you get as standard, which they seem to have made look as bad as possible

 

[[TW]Fox]

The laser side doesn’t add much other than the headlight design looking better. The adaptive LED side is what you want.

This is not the case on the 3 Series until the facelift. After the facelift, the lasers were removed from the range and the Adaptive LED headlight now has the better high beam system fitted.

I’ve found the lasers only offer the same output as VAGs matrix highbeam setup

Because you are describing the operation of the adaptive high beam, not the laser itself, which hardly ever does anything but when it does it is far better than anything else you may have used. When the laser operates, it extends the reach of the high beam headlight to as much as 600 metres. You will likely only ever see this happen in the middle of nowhere on a road with no light sources and no traffic.

The 3 Series is unique for this - in the 5 Series etc there is no requirement to have laser lights in order to have the better high beam system.

 

[MrRockliffe]

You're not the first person to say that.

My only concern with non-comp is that it's the same engine as my current car, how much different will it really feel (probably a silly question)? Although from what you said previously, very different.

From the looks of Autotrader, it's actually going to be difficult to find an LCI non-comp. From 2018 onwards, sub 35k miles, long beach blue (my preference), 9 available, all of which are comp. They range from £32.2k to £37.2k.

It's about the package as a whole.

The 135i is a 1 series with a quick engine.


The M2 is an M car. Meaning it has been tweaked by a team dedicated to making high performance cars.



On newer cars, I'm not so convinced of the differences being worth the extra dosh for most people, but in my limited experience with an F80, it did feel pretty different to a normal 3 series.


It's just more extreme.




That being said, none of them are anything like a Porsche to drive. They still feel like big boats, in comparison.




If I were in your boat, I'd go to Kevin Bird and get your suspension upgraded, and throw in an LSD. You'll get a superior driving experience without the need to buy a new car.




That is unless you specifically want an M2.


If you specifically want an M2, it would be LCI non comp for me.




My time in my Boxster S has taught me that you don't need the quickest car on the road to have fun.




Go test one out to be sure

 

[Dangerous Dave]

This is not the case on the 3 Series until the facelift. After the facelift, the lasers were removed from the range and the Adaptive LED headlight now has the better high beam system fitted.



Because you are describing the operation of the adaptive high beam, not the laser itself, which hardly ever does anything but when it does it is far better than anything else you may have used. When the laser operates, it extends the reach of the high beam headlight to as much as 600 metres. You will likely only ever see this happen in the middle of nowhere on a road with no light sources and no traffic.

The 3 Series is unique for this - in the 5 Series etc there is no requirement to have laser lights in order to have the better high beam system.

On the output side what I’m saying is with the lasers on it’s not any brighter or further reaching than the full high beam output of VAGs matrix LED headlights.

I personally found that the BMW LED highbeam was noticeably dimmer than the VAG setup and due to the restrictions of when the lasers come on the majority of the time the VAG matrix setup was better and only matched with the lasers on. It would be interesting to compare the 3 series LCI adaptive LEDs to see if it is better than the pre LCI LED visibility pack setup. I bet they’ve improved the LED output which is likely the reason for dropping the laser setup.

Only caveat I’ll put on the observation I never drove both on the same night but did plenty of trips down the same roads in both cars I’m surprised no one has done an article measuring all the headlight outputs but my quick google can’t find one.

 

[Bear]

I’m surprised no one has done an article measuring all the headlight outputs but my quick google can’t find one.

 

[[TW]Fox]

On the output side what I’m saying is with the lasers on it’s not any brighter or further reaching than the full high beam output of VAGs matrix LED headlights.

My experience is that performance is comparable without the lasers, with the lasers adding a rarely used but noticeable advantage when conditions are right. I don't think it has ever been claimed by the manufacturer or otherwise that the standard Audi system is capable of 600 metres of range. If they were that good, they'd have been sure to mention it!

I think it is fair to say that the lasers themselves are not really worth the effort, but the adaptive high beam system is and for this you need the laser lights if you're buying a 2019-2022 car. The removal of the laser lights and the inclusion of the better high beam assistant on the facelift removes this requirement.

Note that any comparisons on the relative performance of the laser headlights from North America are probably not useful as the performance is reduced for this market.

I personally found that the BMW LED highbeam was noticeably dimmer than the VAG setup and due to the restrictions of when the lasers come on the majority of the time the VAG matrix setup was better and only matched with the lasers on. It would be interesting to compare the 3 series LCI adaptive LEDs to see if it is better than the pre LCI LED visibility pack setup. I bet they’ve improved the LED output which is likely the reason for dropping the laser setup.

My understanding was that it was about production cost, which is why they continue to be available on the more expensive cars in the range. I don't think there is any improvement, it is possible that its a backward step, it wouldn't be the only recent change in the 3 Series that was a downgrade on what went before (There are various things missing from the interior now, for example).

Either way, if you're looking at buying a 2019-2022 3 Series then I think the visibility pack is worth it - even if you forget the lasers and don't care that the daytime running lights look a bit rubbish, the better high beam assistant is worth it on its own.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

Velar configurator:

Adaptive Matrix-Laser LED headlights with Daytime Running Lights. This technology provides additional light to the main beam, increasing the road visibility up to 600m when there is no oncoming traffic detected by camera above 80km/h. It also provides main beam and static bending cornering light (which operates at speeds less than 40km/h when indicator is switched on to illuminate the road or driveway that you may be turning in to).

 

[DRZ]

If you specifically want an M2, it would be LCI non comp for me.

@Robi

Speaking from experience as a current M2 Competition owner who has previously owned an LCI M2, the LCI is definitely the better car for UK B road fun. If you're a bit of a lardarse like me, the LCI seats are a bit more accommodating as well.

When I bought my LCI there was a new Comp demonstrator in the showroom - I'd gone to see that car actually and asked to take the LCI out just to make sure I was making the right decision buying the heavily-discounted ex-demo car. I ended up buying the LCI but at the time that came with a £10k+ saving so it really was a no brainer. I massively regret selling that M2, so in a bit of an impulsive mood I bought a Comp to scratch the itch. I still massively regret selling the LCI and now I sort of regret not getting an LCI instead of the Comp this time around. I just don't quite love it in the same way that I loved the LCI.

 

[mjt]

Speaking from experience as a current M2 Competition owner who has previously owned an LCI M2, the LCI is definitely the better car for UK B road fun. If you're a bit of a lardarse like me, the LCI seats are a bit more accommodating as well.

When I bought my LCI there was a new Comp demonstrator in the showroom - I'd gone to see that car actually and asked to take the LCI out just to make sure I was making the right decision buying the heavily-discounted ex-demo car. I ended up buying the LCI but at the time that came with a £10k+ saving so it really was a no brainer. I massively regret selling that M2, so in a bit of an impulsive mood I bought a Comp to scratch the itch. I still massively regret selling the LCI and now I sort of regret not getting an LCI instead of the Comp this time around. I just don't quite love it in the same way that I loved the LCI.

Is the M2C your 'daily' ?

 

[IC3]

What has beam height got to do with mirrors?

Oh I missed that bit, I thought he was asking about lights beam.

The mirror dip can be coded.

Anyone ever had the oil level sensor fail on them, or malfunction? Dipstick is showing MAX, whilst the iDrive measuring shows under.

 

[Dis86]

Oh I missed that bit, I thought he was asking about lights beam.

The mirror dip can be coded.

Anyone ever had the oil level sensor fail on them, or malfunction? Dipstick is showing MAX, whilst the iDrive measuring shows under.

Had it happen on my f30

 

[IC3]

Had it happen on my f30

Thanks, N57? I need to check ISTA, to see if there are any tests.

 

[MattHep]

In the current climate, am I an idiot to consider moving from my F21 M135i to an F87 M2 Competition? They seem like incredible value at the moment.

I've always had the itch to move, more out of curiosity than anything else. I have no experience of them, so I'd be interested to see how different it actually feels compared to my current car.

I've made the same move myself, had my Comp for 3 years now. Completely different car in terms of handling and chassis, the M2 being much more driver focused. Although they arent the best in cold and wet conditions and can be quite lively.

And yes the values are quite good as well at the moment.

 

[DRZ]

Is the M2C your 'daily' ?

At the moment, yes, although I don't have a commute and I don't go shopping etc in it as I'll take my partner's Golf (or whatever eventually fills the Range Rover-sized hole in our car lineup)

 

[Robi]

I've booked a test drive of this on Saturday. Mileage is a little high for my liking and still completely undecided on options, but it's local and gives a glimpse into what an M2C will feel like. Afterwards, will try to find an LCI non-comp for a drive.

I've made the same move myself, had my Comp for 3 years now. Completely different car in terms of handling and chassis, the M2 being much more driver focused. Although they arent the best in cold and wet conditions and can be quite lively.

And yes the values are quite good as well at the moment.

Thanks for the feedback.

Did you drive a non-LCI / LCI prior to buying the Comp? If so, thoughts?

 

[MattHep]

I've booked a test drive of this on Saturday. Mileage is a little high for my liking and still completely undecided on options, but it's local and gives a glimpse into what an M2C will feel like. Afterwards, will try to find an LCI non-comp for a drive.



Thanks for the feedback.

Did you drive a non-LCI / LCI prior to buying the Comp? If so, thoughts?

I had a non LCI F20 m135i (2014). It was very soft compared to the M2 Comp, although sounded much nicer.

 

[MrRockliffe]

Really struggling to find something with decent options.

I've seen this, but a little out of my price bracket:

Auto Trader UK - New and Used Cars For Sale

Find your next car with Auto Trader UK, the official #1 site to buy and sell new and used cars. Over 400,000 cars online. Simple, easy, quick!

www.autotrader.co.uk

 

[IC3]

Really struggling to find something with decent options.

I've seen this, but a little out of my price bracket:

Auto Trader UK - New and Used Cars For Sale

Find your next car with Auto Trader UK, the official #1 site to buy and sell new and used cars. Over 400,000 cars online. Simple, easy, quick!

www.autotrader.co.uk

When buying newer cars, whenever its me or someone from my friends group buying. I always say to buy towards the end of quarter, especially in Q1 and Q4, you can usually grab the best deals and haggle - be prepared to walkaway though, they'll call you or literally chase you. Once a sales guy chased us and caught up as we were getting into the car, it was towards end of December, managed to get good deal.

The market is still slow, dealerships are trying their luck with inflated prices, I hope next year they'll drop as the difference between trade-in and listing prices is daylight robbery currently...

 

[MrRockliffe]

When buying newer cars, whenever its me or someone from my friends group buying. I always say to buy towards the end of quarter, especially in Q1 and Q4, you can usually grab the best deals and haggle - be prepared to walkaway though, they'll call you or literally chase you. Once a sales guy chased us and caught up as we were getting into the car, it was towards end of December, managed to get good deal.

The market is still slow, dealerships are trying their luck with inflated prices, I hope next year they'll drop as the difference between trade-in and listing prices is daylight robbery currently...

I did try that end of last quarter but absolutely 0 interest.


Yet, from what I can see, cars don’t seem to be selling all that quickly. I’ve seen some models with dealers up for a few weeks, even as long as several of months.



Some are not budging at all, some will try and bundle in packages at reduced costs.

But as soon as I say I’m a cash buyer, they seem to become disinterested, likely because they earn less.