Not that we need them there, useful to have but regardless, plenty of airbases available.
US kills Iran's General Soleimani
- Thread starter Malevolence
- Start date
Not that we need them there, useful to have but regardless, plenty of airbases available.
Soldato
Sort of, yea. If America had a magic wand, what would countries like Iraq look like? Would they look like they do in the current form? or would it be capitalist society with Starbucks on every corner?
The problem is America is never really gonna be seen like that from within, too many power vacuums, causes more problems than it solves i think.
I think America wants stabilty in the Middle East and security for Israel. Do you think Iran is run by some benevolent group of men who don't want to see Israel wiped off the Earth? Do you think they don't fund and support groups that also want that goal?
Exactly. America wants a world that looks like them.
They're not really bothered about peaceful co-existence with people who prefer to do business elsewhere (like with the Russians). They're quite happy to use the CIA et al to push for regime change in countries that aren't pro-America.
They have (as do we, historically) a history of destabilising entire countries and leaving a bigger mess than they ever found, for the sake of "bringing freedom", aka contracts for US firms and installing governments that will bow to their will.
It's not about peace and freedom and all that jazz, it's about doing what's best for their own interests. Even if that means starting wars.
Soldato
But a thriving economy relies on cooperation and stability, it goes with the territory, why do you think the gdp of countries like Iraq and Syria is incredibly low?
People don't keep assets or money in countries that are volatile
A whole host of reasons. None of which are solved with American bullets and bombs.
Corruption, religion to name just two.
e: Question: what do you think America can achieve in such places? Besides ******* all the natives off, which is a given?
Soldato
You have to ask yourself this? Why does the ME have such a massive problem with conflict, but the western world and far east dont?
Is it America causing all these problems, or is it religion?
How is our interference helping? What have we achieved?
Soldato
I don't think we should be in the ME. But i have no problem with a ME country asking and paying for military defence, just like NATO does.
The problem is, everything gets thrown into the mix when it comes to the ME.
Now back to my question..
Why does the ME have such a massive problem with conflict, but the western world and far east dont?
Is it America causing all these problems, or is it religion?
The problem is, everything gets thrown into the mix when it comes to the ME.
Now back to my question..
Why does the ME have such a massive problem with conflict, but the western world and far east dont?
Is it America causing all these problems, or is it religion?
Is that before or after we invaded them to install our own approved government?
Soldato
Is that before or after we invaded them to install our own approved government?
What event are you talking about?
America wants stability as long as it has significant influence over the governments in the area. Same with most of the other regional players. Iraq (and Syria) are both heavily affected by proxy wars between the US, Russia, Saudi, Iran and Turkey. There are never any "good guys" in these sort of conflicts, everyone has a motive.
A multitude of issues as mentioned above. Religion is certainly one of the factors, but even that is in part due to the divisions being taken advantage of by regional powers (Sunni - Saudi, Shia, Iran for example).
It's not like the ME is the only unstable area in the world. Large parts of Africa have been conflict zones for decades, many of those supplied by and stirred up by the US/West and Russia/East to gain influence in those regions. SE Asia used to be a violent area too, with wars and dictatorships abound. Arguably the rise of China there has reduced the instability in that region, hence why there are far fewer incidents there in the last couple of decades.
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Soldato
The Americans lighted the initial sparks, the idiots carried it on from there.
Looks like permission will be revoked very soon.
Soldato
Sectarianism has been happening a long long time before America got involved.
We went through it with protestants v catholics, the ME is still going through it.
Theres no getting away from that
Well given that we're all talking about Iraq here...
Soldato
Well we're going down a bit of dead end here, im not exactly going to defend the Iraq war.
And we're sort of getting off track, the issues i raised where about what America wants, you think its about destabilisation, but its not really, America would ideally want a stable country.
Do you fancy having a pop at my question..
Why does the ME have such a massive problem with conflict, but the western world and far east dont?
Is it America causing all these problems, or is it religion?
It goes back far longer and roots far deeper than just America causing these issues or religion. America as today didn't even exist when half these troubles began though many want to lay the blame soley at the door of Gorge Bush, etc.
Soldato
Yea, that's i posted about sectarianism further up. It's something the ME needs to figure out for themselves..
But i can also potentially see a situation where a genocide happens and people will suddenly be calling for countries in the West to sort it out. Its very difficult, do you just leave them to it, or do try and mediate and stabilise the problem.
But i can also potentially see a situation where a genocide happens and people will suddenly be calling for countries in the West to sort it out. Its very difficult, do you just leave them to it, or do try and mediate and stabilise the problem.
Tribalism.