Donald Trump

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Soldato
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Got to love anti corruption groups who only ever bother to look for corruption on one side of the political sprectrum, really shows how much they care about corruption as a whole lol
Give us an example oh great one.. It's easy, as you've shown multiple times, to make very low effort posts that add nothing to the topic at hand that makes you feel better. Add some examples, do some research to back up your, so far, useless point - you may actually learn something, yes, even you!
 
Soldato
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Surely it beats spilling more blood in an unwinnable perpetual war? all the Afghanistan war has done is drain the US militarily and economically. Did they learn nothing from the Soviet Union?

The left were screaming that Trump was going to start WW3 before he was elected, all he has done is make peace and avoid war and he's been attacked every step of the way. Who are the warmongers here?

so freeing all Taliban prisoners to once again inflict their brand of Islam on Afghanistan is a price worth paying? That’s the best deal the ultimate deal maker could make? Seems to me anyone could make that deal as it’s a win win for the Taliban.

No they didn’t. The right claimed Hilary would start ww3. People started getting nervous when Trump started threatening North Korea with nukes in his naive attempts at diplomacy that went absolutely nowhere.
 
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Soldato
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it’s the hypocrisy that stinks.

Also he’s basically caved in to the Taliban. What was the point of 19 years of sacrifice of blood and treasure just to walk away and free all the Taliban to go back and carry on from where they left off? I fail to see how this is anything but a massive win for the Taliban.

You need to think about it in a geo-political sense. They didn't start the Afgan war because mostly Saudi nationals, supposedly, crashed lots of planes on 9/11 did you? If they wanted to go after the perps, like the bogey man himself Bin-Laden, then they should have gone after Saudi Arabia. The Taliban were doing OK in Afghanistan, they had almost ceased Opium production, which massively reversed after the 'war' started before the invasion. It's very multifaceted, to much to go into in one post.

Then, after Afghanistan, go into Iraq, kill about one million people give or take(including previous sanctions), kill Sadam for some mystery Weapons of Mass Destruction - oops, none found, doesn't matter... Same deal with Libya, kill Colonel Gaddafi, because he's a tyrant and he blew up a plane 20 odd years back, which he paid reparations for or something, Hillary laughs about it on TV - good times!

Same with Syria.. What, he gassed his own people - he must be gotten rid of at any cost.. Only to find out the gas attack wasn't by Assad but by the UK/USA supported terrorist(Taliban - you know they are our friends now), never mind cover it up with the help of the OPCW - but good scientist leaked the results, against the higher ups, going against the official narative of the west.https://thegrayzone.com/2020/01/22/...stleblower-un-no-chemical-attack-douma-syria/

All these counties are sitting on the last known massive oil reserves on the planet! Thats why there are over 1000 US troops still in Syria, Syria doesn't want them or need them there, just to protect the oil fields: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...umps-syria-strategy-leaves-pentagon-perplexed Who's getting the revenue from those oil fields? It was the same in Iraq and Libya! Get in there and secure the oil fields, give out contract to friends of the US/Allied forces - that's why we were involved, for our share of the oil. We, too, would be buggered without a guaranteed supply of oil so I totally get it. Oil is also running out, we are at, even past, peak oil - it's all downhill from here.

Now they are aimed are Iran, it'll be much harder to take them down, I think time is running out.. It's all/mostly about oil, mainly, if they can do other things at the same time, like help Israel perhaps to keep them the superpower of the area then fine. But the main thing is oil! America needs it, they have it, American takes what it wants - by force if necessary. Obama said it in one of his 'state of the union' addresses, iirc, I'll see if I can find it.
 
Soldato
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IDGAF about your buzzwords, go on, try a few more.
I used YOUR buzzwords, must try harder...

Skunk said..
If Trump cured cancer you lot would call him a homophobe for not curing AIDS.

I said..
Are you saying that only gays get AIDS? hmmm who looks like the homophobe now?

Again, I used your lame excuse of an argument against you. See how easy that is? It's all very low effort stuff and does little to advance the discussion.
 
Soldato
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You need to think about it in a geo-political sense. They didn't start the Afgan war because mostly Saudi nationals, supposedly, crashed lots of planes on 9/11 did you? If they wanted to go after the perps, like the bogey man himself Bin-Laden, then they should have gone after Saudi Arabia. The Taliban were doing OK in Afghanistan, they had almost ceased Opium production, which massively reversed after the 'war' started before the invasion. It's very multifaceted, to much to go into in one post.

Then, after Afghanistan, go into Iraq, kill about one million people give or take(including previous sanctions), kill Sadam for some mystery Weapons of Mass Destruction - oops, none found, doesn't matter... Same deal with Libya, kill Colonel Gaddafi, because he's a tyrant and he blew up a plane 20 odd years back, which he paid reparations for or something, Hillary laughs about it on TV - good times!

Same with Syria.. What, he gassed his own people - he must be gotten rid of at any cost.. Only to find out the gas attack wasn't by Assad but by the UK/USA supported terrorist(Taliban - you know they are our friends now), never mind cover it up with the help of the OPCW - but good scientist leaked the results, against the higher ups, going against the official narative of the west.https://thegrayzone.com/2020/01/22/...stleblower-un-no-chemical-attack-douma-syria/

All these counties are sitting on the last known massive oil reserves on the planet! Thats why there are over 1000 US troops still in Syria, Syria doesn't want them or need them there, just to protect the oil fields: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...umps-syria-strategy-leaves-pentagon-perplexed Who's getting the revenue from those oil fields? It was the same in Iraq and Libya! Get in there and secure the oil fields, give out contract to friends of the US/Allied forces - that's why we were involved, for our share of the oil. We, too, would be buggered without a guaranteed supply of oil so I totally get it. Oil is also running out, we are at, even past, peak oil - it's all downhill from here.

Now they are aimed are Iran, it'll be much harder to take them down, I think time is running out.. It's all/mostly about oil, mainly, if they can do other things at the same time, like help Israel perhaps to keep them the superpower of the area then fine. But the main thing is oil! America needs it, they have it, American takes what it wants - by force if necessary. Obama said it in one of his 'state of the union' addresses, iirc, I'll see if I can find it.

what have Iraq and Syria got to do with Afghanistan? Absolutely nothing. Yes Saudi should have been punished but then back in the real world that was never going to happen.

are you seriously defending the Taliban? They are heinous and not far behind ISIS. Who cares about opium production? I wasn’t a supporter of the US and her allies going in but once you have you don’t walk away 19 years later handing a win to the Taliban. It makes the sacrifice of all the service personal and their families mean nothing. It’s a massive fold and I can see it turning around and biting the US and the rest of us in the arse.
 
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whether you agree with it or not the US was always going into Afghanistan when the Taliban refused to hand over Bin Laden. Doesn’t matter who was POTUS. If Trump was POTUS when 911 happened he’d have done the same.

To be 100% fair to both the US & The Taliban, they did offer to hand OBL over if the US halted their air strikes and presented evidence of his guilt, then they would hand him over to a third party country but Bush refused to negotiate which leads us to where we are now with the Taliban, having been pummeled for 19 years and now on a comeback and stronger than ever. Every soldier that died over there did so for nothing in the end which is tragic.

Besides which the invasion of Afghanistan was never necessary as it should have been the Saudi's that faced the US anger over 911 but now they are best buddies while the oil is flowing.
 
Soldato
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I used YOUR buzzwords, must try harder...

Skunk said..

I said..

Again, I used your lame excuse of an argument against you. See how easy that is? It's all very low effort stuff and does little to advance the discussion.
Lefty loser tears, twice as sweet as sugar but zero calories. Keep sniveling, it fuels me! :cool:

Oh, and inb4 "haha yOu SaId it fUeLs BuT cAn'T iF it has ZeRo cAloRies, haha i'M sO eruDiTe!"
 
Soldato
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To be 100% fair to both the US & The Taliban, they did offer to hand OBL over if the US halted their air strikes and presented evidence of his guilt, then they would hand him over to a third party country but Bush refused to negotiate which leads us to where we are now with the Taliban, having been pummeled for 19 years and now on a comeback and stronger than ever. Every soldier that died over there did so for nothing in the end which is tragic.

Besides which the invasion of Afghanistan was never necessary as it should have been the Saudi's that faced the US anger over 911 but now they are best buddies while the oil is flowing.

That to me reads like they were never going hand him over because they knew the US would never release any intel on Bin Laden and the US was in no mood to negotiate at the time anyway. Bin Laden was behind the attack and he had to be bought to justice or preferably killed, its not like he didn't already have enough US blood on his hands before 911. Again yes Saudi were partly responsible but that was NEVER going to happen.

I do think if Bin Laden had been handed over straight away along with any of the other leadership the invasion could have been avoided. That didn't happen though and now we are back to square one or worse than square one as 10s of thousands died for nothing.
 
Soldato
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That to me reads like they were never going hand him over because they knew the US would never release any intel on Bin Laden and the US was in no mood to negotiate at the time anyway. Bin Laden was behind the attack and he had to be bought to justice or preferably killed, its not like he didn't already have enough US blood on his hands before 911. Again yes Saudi were partly responsible but that was NEVER going to happen.

I do think if Bin Laden had been handed over straight away along with any of the other leadership the invasion could have been avoided. That didn't happen though and now we are back to square one or worse than square one as 10s of thousands died for nothing.

I agree and I was all for bringing him to justice as much as anyone but it's the way it was done. It's possible that the talks may have broken down or the US didn't get the exact terms they wanted but they never even tried. They just went in dropping bombs as they always do. Negotiation may well have saved a lot of soldiers lives and countless civilians if it was even given the chance.

But I guess that's all water under the bridge now. 19+ years of blood and nothing changed for the better. It won't be long before those 5000 prisoners are back to abusing their people again.
 
Soldato
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Highlight of the thread for me is the isolated incident of blue on blue in the last few posts :) I love it when Trumpers temporarily forget who the other Trumpers are, and vica versa.
 
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