DirectX 12 Showcase New Features and Benefits of D3D12 API

humbug · 1 Apr 2015 at 15:31

Ayahuasca said:
Some sanity back to the debate, thank you.

He's hitting on one slide which says they don't, there is another slide which says they do, which one of the two is correct is anyones guess.

There is a level at which a GPU is rated for compatibility, both say GCN Tier 3 (Full) Maxwell 2 Tier 2 (Not full)

Both say:

Conservative Deph: GCN: Yes | Maxwell 2 Emulated
Dedicated Auto Counter: GCN: Yes | Maxwell 2 No
SAD4: GCN: Yes | Maxwell 2 Emulated.

Where they differ Is Rasterization flags. 2 of them.

GCN is 3+ years old, its that much older than Maxwell 2, as for other Nvidia GPU's of that time there is very limited compatibility, its very unlikely they were developed with DX12 in Mind, Nvidia's 4+ years claim IMO is busted.
Maxwell 2 is post DX12 announcement.

layte · 1 Apr 2015 at 15:55

https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/direct3d-feature-levels-discussion.56575/page-4#post-1833996

AthlonXP1800 · 1 Apr 2015 at 15:58

bru said:
From this translated link.

https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pcmanias.com%2Fdirectx-12-que-placas-o-suportam-e-em-que-nivel%2F&edit-text=&act=url

The same chart but showing different results.

Not that any of that matters to be honest, if there are only 100 gamers and you code your game in such a way that only 20 of them can play it, your an idiot, you code your game so that everyone can play it then your on to a winner.

Of course not to forget the fact that by the time these games that utilise DX12 get here all the non DX12 cards will be too slow to play them anyway.

It say Geforce 900 series is only cards supported full DirectX 12 feature level 12.1 with Conservative Rasterization and Rasterizer Ordered Views, GCN do not supported these features.

I found a link below from beyond3D confirmed with images from cap viewer showed GTX 980 supported it while 290X did not supported it.

https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/direct3d-feature-levels-discussion.56575/page-4#post-1833996

opethdisciple · 1 Apr 2015 at 16:18

This is what I mean by all these people on here advising people to get a 780ti over a 970. Your buying older tech with less DX12 support.

meldarthx · 1 Apr 2015 at 16:20

Good grief; how people have forgotten DX 12 was originally created for Xbox One; MS needed to fix their tool set for Xbox One which until DX 12 is released for Xbox One is an utter mess. *This is all backed up by devs as PS4 is the lead platform next/this gen* If MS has any chance to become lead platform *they don't because lead platform is always one with the biggest install base; why PS3 took over late from 360* But if they want to at least keep pace with PS4; they have to fix their damn tools.

Guess who they turned to for help.......AMD as its AMD's tech that's running the show; the base for DX 12 is mantle; plain and simple. This has also been backed up by devs who had the specs, access two both and manuals; they said they were the same thing.

DX 12 evolved from mantle; there's is now ifs ands or buts; this is also backed up by my friends in the industry. ..

humbug · 1 Apr 2015 at 16:23

layte said:
https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/direct3d-feature-levels-discussion.56575/page-4#post-1833996

Feature Level 11.1. not 12, meaningless to this argument.

This is Nvidia trying to confuse the argument by throwing in an irrelevant curveball.

humbug · 1 Apr 2015 at 16:36

meldarthx said:
Good grief; how people have forgotten DX 12 was originally created for Xbox One; MS needed to fix their tool set for Xbox One which until DX 12 is released for Xbox One is an utter mess. *This is all backed up by devs as PS4 is the lead platform next/this gen* If MS has any chance to become lead platform *they don't because lead platform is always one with the biggest install base; why PS3 took over late from 360* But if they want to at least keep pace with PS4; they have to fix their damn tools.

Guess who they turned to for help.......AMD as its AMD's tech that's running the show; the base for DX 12 is mantle; plain and simple. This has also been backed up by devs who had the specs, access two both and manuals; they said they were the same thing.

DX 12 evolved from mantle; there's is now ifs ands or buts; this is also backed up by my friends in the industry. ..

^^^^^^^^^^ The XBox One currentl runs on a modified version of DX11. its junk.

layte · 1 Apr 2015 at 16:36

humbug said:
Feature Level 11.1. not 12, meaningless to this argument.

This is Nvidia trying to confuse the argument by throwing in an irrelevant curveball.

Not at all 11.3 is DX12 features exposed via DX11. Read the B3D thread I linked and educate yourself.

humbug · 1 Apr 2015 at 16:50

layte said:
Not at all 11.3 is DX12 features exposed via DX11. Read the B3D thread I linked and educate yourself.

No, the feature set is DX11.1, if GCN didn't have these flags in DX11.1 they are not going to have them in DX12.

Maxwell 2 is a brand new architecture, its possibly a feature set that Nvidia requested.
Or developed for already in DX11.1 and was then ported over to DX12.

This does not mean GCN cannot run these feature sets, it could be that they can't, or it could be something that they need to activate in their drivers.

What it certainly does not do is get around the fact that Kepler is Tier 1, Maxwell 2 Tier 2 and GCN Tier 3 DX12.

Maxwell 2 is brand new, GCN is over 3 years old.

DX12 is not the 4+ year brain child of Nvidia, as they so claim.

AthlonXP1800 · 1 Apr 2015 at 16:50

https://twitter.com/_cwyman_/status/580774316108685312

Just found this GTC2015 Nvidia presentation talked about cool features ACAA, CGAA and FTIZB.

ACAA seemed a big improvement over MSAA with less memory bandwidth, CGAA 2A is amazing and wow FTIZB can render ray traced quality.

layte · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:01

humbug said:
What it certainly does not do is get around the fact that Kepler is Tier 1, Maxwell 2 Tier 2 and GCN Tier 3 DX12.

Read the thread. Capsviewer trumps what some random guy on internet forum has to say.

Ayahuasca · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:02

People reading far too much into this Tier 1, 2 and 3 malarkey.

D.P. · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:08

Ayahuasca said:
People reading far too much into this Tier 1, 2 and 3 malarkey.

Correction, AMD fanboys shout to much about this Tier 1, 2 and 3 malarkey

humbug · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:08

layte said:
Read the thread. Capsviewer trumps what some random guy on internet forum has to say.

The Capsviewer your citing proves these are DX11.1 feature sets.

What is your argument here? that those Capsviewer slides prove DX12 has nothing to do with Mantle?

If so your argument is "because GCN doesn't have this specific DX11.1 Feature Set"

Of Course it doesn't, why would it, its not DX11.1 that people are arguing is Mantle.

layte · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:15

humbug said:
The Capsviewer your citing proves these are DX11.1 feature sets.

What is your argument here? that those Capsviewer slides prove DX12 has nothing to do with Mantle?

If so your argument is "because GCN doesn't have this specific DX11.1 Feature Set"

Of Course it doesn't, why would it, its not DX11.1 that people are arguing is Mantle.

Just read the damn B3D thread and educate yourself.

Playing the wilfully obtuse card does you no favours.

humbug · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:17

layte said:
Just read the damn B3D thread and educate yourself.

Playing the wilfully obtuse card does you no favours.

What are you talking about?

Is that going to tell me DX11.1 isn't Mantle? i already know that...

Obtuse? are you sure your getting a handle on what i'm saying?

layte · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:22

If you cant read that thread and understand the subject at hand and how it details what DX12 functionality is in particular hardware then nothing I or anyone else says here can make a difference. At least people will now know that anything you state on the matter is from a platform of ignorance and to ignore it.

Also, stop trying to move the goalposts on what we were discussing. It's your favourite trick when shown up and I'm not going to play along.

humbug · 1 Apr 2015 at 17:41

layte said:
If you cant read that thread and understand the subject at hand and how it details what DX12 functionality is in particular hardware then nothing I or anyone else says here can make a difference. At least people will now know that anything you state on the matter is from a platform of ignorance and to ignore it.

Also, stop trying to move the goalposts on what we were discussing. It's your favourite trick when shown up and I'm not going to play along.

You are diverting to another forum with pages up on pages of arguments not that dissimilar to arguments in this thread as if that thread should be some shining beacon of light in proving you right, i have been keeping up with it since it started, there is nothing in that which changes anything in here.

layte · 1 Apr 2015 at 18:01

humbug said:
You are diverting to another forum with pages up on pages of arguments not that dissimilar to arguments in this thread as if that thread should be some shining beacon of light in proving you right, i have been keeping up with it since it started, there is nothing in that which changes anything in here.

You obviously have not.

I would suggest to anyone who wants to cut through the FUD being spread in here to go read that B3D thread. Good solid info with people discussing things in a civilised matter.

atheos · 1 Apr 2015 at 19:23

So as someone who does not buy cards often.

Is buying a 780ti madness ahead of buying a 970 as the 780ti will have less DX12 features?