3D Mark Time Spy not using true A-Sync, Maxwell A-Sync switched off!

[hyperseven]

So what, like all of them bar Tomb Raider and Gears of War then? The latter not even being designed to be DX12, never mind 11.

Do you also have an issue with games that are Gameworks titles where NVIDIA 'helped" the devs then?

Or do you find also find it acceptable that NVIDIA list Maxwell as supporting A-Sync, but here we have a developer stating that NVIDIA purposely disable it via drivers to avoid a performance hit.

1.no issue, but you can be sure umpteen threads will start banging on how evil and unfair Gameworks is.

2.don't really care, got a 1080 amp extreme on order.

its just another case of the results do match what you want them to be.

 

[N19h7m4r3]

1.no issue, but you can be sure umpteen threads will start banging on how evil and unfair Gameworks is.

2.don't really care, got a 1080 amp extreme on order.

its just another case of the results do match what you want them to be.

So you dismiss any game that gives AMD a performance improvement because of DX12/Vulkan and A-Sync, and now say it's only a case of results not matching what I want them to be.

The overall results show AMD gaining a bigger performance improvement, and this benchmark is an outlier.

Which one is really ignoring the numbers then?

 

[humbug]

The only thing that would be bad about this whole situation, is that Nvidia may seek to not use Async and therefore try to kill it off, thereby harming AMD's market share, because AMD has dedicated hardware for Async. That would be the kinda smart thing to do, although pretty poor form. But they are a business, not a charity.

So, as I don't really know that much about Async, what is the benefit? If AMD had used thos transistors for normal processing rather than Async, so they could use the whole die even in DX11, would they be better off now?

Why do people talk about Nvidia using the latest in technology or not in terms of charitable choices?

Does its user base really not deserve to take advantage of new features without Nvidia feeling charitable toward us?

 

[layte]

I wonder if FM will respond to all the salty trolls.

I also wonder if this is a theme we will see going forwards with DX12 software that does not have AMD branding all over the marketing material.

Interesting times.

 

[humbug]

I wonder if FM will respond to all the salty trolls.

I also wonder if this is a theme we will see going forwards with DX12 software that does not have AMD branding all over the marketing material.

Interesting times.

Most game devs make games for console and then port to PC, those consoles are all the same AMD architecture that you find in PC.

Now that DX12 is here on PC features that are used to get the performance out of consoles, such as true A-Sync are just par for course of development.

Nvidia's equivalent to A-Sync, pre-emption, is completely different and requires a different development path.

We may well see games not branded as AMD without true A-Sync, and yet also with A-Sync if AMD nor Nvidia are involved, what sort of a balance of that Nvidia want will depend on how much Nvidia are willing to pay.

 

[SiDeards73]

I wasn't talking to him about Pascal and was showing what gains there were with my Pascal GPU but never mind.

Greg don't own Nvidia GPUs and I haven't for about 12+ years I make no hiding of this fact, I am openly positive toward AMD also, again I do not hide this fact, call me an AMD fanboy I'm ok with that, I buy their products because they normally offer the best bang for buck, I am now invested as I have a Freesync screen.

My point was Nvidia stating Maxwell supposedly supports async, numerous developers stating they are still waiting for Nvidias help implementing it, yet nothing has arrived and now we have a statement that it is in fact turned off for Maxwell.

It makes zero difference to me, i dont buy their products but if I did I would be thinking I'm having to upgrade which in the era of today's GPUs is normally a given. But then I look at the current state of things like GCN and how it matures and in fact gets a new.lease.of life with the new APIs. And the fact Nvidia drop support for older products usually fairly quickly, by that I mean less.emphasis on tuning for them.

This is where AMD have a lead as everything is built on GCN so they tune for the hardware and it benefits their cards across the board.

Anyhow my main point is, someone is telling porkies, either Nvidia or the Devs, maybe it's various devs from various companies and not Nvidia?

I'm not butthurt, I just don't live in Denial

 

[humbug]

Greg don't own Nvidia GPUs and I haven't for about 12+ years I make no hiding of this fact, I am openly positive toward AMD also, again I do not hide this fact, call me an AMD fanboy I'm ok with that, I buy their products because they normally offer the best bang for buck, I am now invested as I have a Freesync screen.

My point was Nvidia stating Maxwell supposedly supports async, numerous developers stating they are still waiting for Nvidias help implementing it, yet nothing has arrived and now we have a statement that it is in fact turned off for Maxwell.

It makes zero difference to me, i dont buy their products but if I did I would be thinking I'm having to upgrade which in the era of today's GPUs is normally a given. But then I look at the current state of things like GCN and how it matures and in fact gets a new.lease.of life with the new APIs. And the fact Nvidia drop support for older products usually fairly quickly, by that I mean less.emphasis on tuning for them.

This is where AMD have a lead as everything is built on GCN so they tune for the hardware and it benefits their cards across the board.

Anyhow my main point is, someone is telling porkies, either Nvidia or the Devs, maybe it's various devs from various companies and not Nvidia?

I'm not butthurt, I just don't live in Denial

He has a point, Nvidia made a point of the fact that Maxwell has A-Sync and that it was simply not turned on yet.

Its been turned on for Pascal but not Maxwell, did Nvidia lie or is it a case of them not wanting to turn it on? are they not feeling charitable?

 

[SiDeards73]

He has a point, Nvidia made a point of the fact that Maxwell has A-Sync and that it was simply not turned on yet.

Its been turned on for Pascal but not Maxwell, did Nvidia lie or is it a case of them not wanting to turn it on? are they not feeling charitable?

It's not in their interest really to keep tuning old cards as people won't be so quick to buy new cards, this is actually something AMD could learn from, but GCN is so good at the low level APIs that the cards will always run well on them now.

It does make me wonder what Vega will be like

 

[D1craig]

not read every post but this is jut getting silly.

surely these companies should use everything they can and not compromise becasue it gives an unfair advantage or whatever. use it all and force the others to come up with something to close the gap.

 

[humbug]

It's not in their interest really to keep tuning old cards as people won't be so quick to buy new cards, this is actually something AMD could learn from, but GCN is so good at the low level APIs that the cards will always run well on them now.

It does make me wonder what Vega will be like

If AMD did this it would be a massive issue according to reviewers.

 

[CaptainRAVE]

3D Mark is only a benchmark app so who really cares..

The FPS performance you get in real games is where it counts..

First reply, nail, head. Who gives a rats backside about a benchmark other than the fanboy brigade.

 

[nashathedog]

"NVidia have gimped performance coz look at dat Titan now performing like a 390X"

You wish

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/RX_480/24.html

On a serious note though, The grumbling about what brands do and don't do all over the forum is a bit much,
What matters is,

Are you able to run the games you want to run well?

If so, times are good.

 

[Gregster]

Greg don't own Nvidia GPUs and I haven't for about 12+ years I make no hiding of this fact, I am openly positive toward AMD also, again I do not hide this fact, call me an AMD fanboy I'm ok with that, I buy their products because they normally offer the best bang for buck, I am now invested as I have a Freesync screen.

My point was Nvidia stating Maxwell supposedly supports async, numerous developers stating they are still waiting for Nvidias help implementing it, yet nothing has arrived and now we have a statement that it is in fact turned off for Maxwell.

It makes zero difference to me, i dont buy their products but if I did I would be thinking I'm having to upgrade which in the era of today's GPUs is normally a given. But then I look at the current state of things like GCN and how it matures and in fact gets a new.lease.of life with the new APIs. And the fact Nvidia drop support for older products usually fairly quickly, by that I mean less.emphasis on tuning for them.

This is where AMD have a lead as everything is built on GCN so they tune for the hardware and it benefits their cards across the board.

Anyhow my main point is, someone is telling porkies, either Nvidia or the Devs, maybe it's various devs from various companies and not Nvidia?

I'm not butthurt, I just don't live in Denial

I can't fault your honesty but you cut my post and ignored the gimping part for some odd reason. I guess Maxwell owners who have been eagerly waiting for Async and not getting it have a right to be annoyed, but on the same vein, Pascal owners could also share the same argument because we haven't got Async in any games yet either.

 

[Gregster]

You wish

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/RX_480/24.html

On a serious note though, The grumbling about what brands do and don't do all over the forum is a bit much,
What matters is,

Are you able to run the games you want to run well?

If so, times are good.

Absolutely Nasher. I have always maintained I want games to work without issue regardless of what you run. I don't mind a bit of fanboy fun either and all good.

 

[shankly1985]

DX12_1 How that was the big talking point!

 

[layte]

Most game devs make games for console and then port to PC, those consoles are all the same AMD architecture that you find in PC.

Now that DX12 is here on PC features that are used to get the performance out of consoles, such as true A-Sync are just par for course of development.

Nvidia's equivalent to A-Sync, pre-emption, is completely different and requires a different development path.

We may well see games not branded as AMD without true A-Sync, and yet also with A-Sync if AMD nor Nvidia are involved, what sort of a balance of that Nvidia want will depend on how much Nvidia are willing to pay.

My post was a bit antagonistic, it shouldn't have been.

I agree with a lot of what you are saying, different hardware is going to require different approaches.

We are still so early in the life of these API's, so it's annoying seeing people going off the deep end if a piece of software does not fit with their mindset. Calling things true this or false that is not going to help, as they are two differing ways of getting the same result.

 

[SiDeards73]

I can't fault your honesty but you cut my post and ignored the gimping part for some odd reason. I guess Maxwell owners who have been eagerly waiting for Async and not getting it have a right to be annoyed, but on the same vein, Pascal owners could also share the same argument because we haven't got Async in any games yet either.

Sorry mate i was in a field with the wife and kids enjoying the sun while they played footy walked round the park and fed the ducks, got an ice lolly and just enjoyed the time with me family.

What i meant was, i seem to recall a lot of hullabaloo recently about Nvidia rendering Kepler redundant via lack of improvisation in drivers etc, i believe they have a track record for dropping progression on older cards while favouring newer cards? i dunno, like i say i dont own Nvidia cards so i can only go on what i read on "Teh Interwebz!" but i seem to recall a lot of people go narky about it recently?

What i was trying to get at is i can believe people do this in practice as they want you to upgrade to the newer rather than keep the older and infact AMD have kinda shot themselves in the foot by not taking this approach, GCN it seems is now living up to its potential, which means they have a lot of customers on older cards that will get new leases of life and will potentially not bother to upgrade as there is no real need to.

Vram is probably the main factor in forcing these people forwards, and perhaps efficiency in newer features in the newer cards.

Look at the gain in Doom for instance, my 290P would seem like a new card in Doom (i dont own the game, its not my kinda thing) so say a few other devs took the same approach and made like an MMO or something, all those older GCN cards would be fantastic in it, people wouldnt feel they need to upgrade as their card would suddenly gain a new lease of life etc.

 

[Marine-RX179]

I can't fault your honesty but you cut my post and ignored the gimping part for some odd reason. I guess Maxwell owners who have been eagerly waiting for Async and not getting it have a right to be annoyed, but on the same vein, Pascal owners could also share the same argument because we haven't got Async in any games yet either.

Don't worry, Nvidia will eventually offer a "fix" for Async in their typical fashion...in the form of ditching your old cards and buy their next gen cards

 

[chaparral]

Async off
http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/13350573

Async on
http://www.3dmark.com/spy/11356

Score 0 with NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080(1x) and Intel Core i7-6850K
That a high score ...


I take it we meant to be looking your graphic score and CPU scores and not the final scores ?

Graphics Score 6782
CPU Score 7021

vs

Graphics Score 7570
CPU Score 7148

 

[humbug]

Thats +1.8% ^^^ are you sure that is A-Sync or margin of error?