4k HDR TV selection - rather baffled!

hughtrimble

hughtrimble

hughtrimble

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Afternoon all,

So I'm in the market for a new TV, and started at a budget of around 400, but that rapidly climbed to the 600+ mark due to the fact that it'll last for a good few years, and there's nothing worse than a crap picture or shoddy interface on something like a TV. Max 50 inch screen, and it'll have to be wall mounted.

I'm between these two:

Sony Bravia KD49XD8088 https://www.richersounds.com/product/tv---all/sony/bravia-kd49xd8088/sony-kd49xd8088bu

LG 49UH770V http://www.richersounds.com/product/tv---all/lg/49uh770v/lg-49uh770v

Reviews on both are mixed, with some saying the Sony has very poor black contrast (always grey) whilst the LG has issues upscaling non HD sources to 4k due to its processor.

What else is different between them that will actually make a difference? The HDR thing is basically daft as I don't have Netflix's ultra premium account, and even if I did, there seems to be basically nothing out there that will take advantage of HDR for the foreseeable future (I will never buy BluRay players or the like, only stream stuff).

Any other suggestions out there for alternatives?

Cheers,
Hugh
 
VincentHanna said:
Netflix Ultra premium already includes HDR content on shows like Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Marco Polo etc.

You won't get great HDR on a low budget TV though.
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Indeed, but I don't and won't be purchasing that Netflix upgrade as none of those shows is of interest. There may be more in future, but as you say, HDR at this price point is sort of pointless anyway!
 
VincentHanna said:
Netflix Ultra premium already includes HDR content on shows like Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Marco Polo etc.

You won't get great HDR on a low budget TV though.
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UH770V isn't a low budget TV

I should know I paid £800-£900 for a 43" UH750V about 6 months ago.

OP the LG has zero issues upscaling non 4k content. mine works flawlessly with everything. my only gripe with the tv is that it isn't larger it's one of the best tv's i have owned. however the max the wooden feature wall in my living room can accomodate is 43" so i have it on an articulated arm to pull it closer to me. 55" in the games room :D
 
Psycho Sonny said:
UH770V isn't a low budget TV

I should know I paid £800-£900 for a 43" UH750V about 6 months ago.

OP the LG has zero issues upscaling non 4k content. mine works flawlessly with everything. my only gripe with the tv is that it isn't larger it's one of the best tv's i have owned. however the max the wooden feature wall in my living room can accomodate is 43" so i have it on an articulated arm to pull it closer to me. 55" in the games room :D
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Thank you for this Sonny. The whole 'budget' thing is pretty challenging to deal with, given everything looks budget compared to the OLEDs...! But these two certainly aren't the bottom end of the price bracket.

Have you had any issues with the vertical zone LED dimming? I realise you can switch it off, but it seems a shame to have that feature if it's just turned off.
 
I would say go for something with a va panel.

The Sony screen is ips and doesnt have great blacks. I have the 55 inch version (my first ips in many years) and its been a struggle to get used to.

Sure, it can still deliver a very pleasing image, but it can be distracting. I only bought mine with the intention of not having it for very long.

Have a look at lg 50uh635v. I had one very briefly and picture was decent. I would have kept it but it had a line of faulty pixels right across the screen.

The smaller 43xd80 is va and a nice screen - I use one for pc and gaming, occasionally streaming. This one will be with me a while.

Otherwise, maybe the Panasonic dx700 series, or Samsung ku6400 series.
 
hughtrimble said:
Thank you for this Sonny. The whole 'budget' thing is pretty challenging to deal with, given everything looks budget compared to the OLEDs...! But these two certainly aren't the bottom end of the price bracket.

Have you had any issues with the vertical zone LED dimming? I realise you can switch it off, but it seems a shame to have that feature if it's just turned off.
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No issues with my set what so ever. I also own a panny plasma the GT50 it's in the bedroom 50" panel and 55" sony w809C in the games room.

the sony is by far the worse tv out the lot. it's used for consoles only and for that it does the job very well.

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/kdl55w805c-201508034145.htm

see the review for w807c above (model lower than my w809c) so it's 9/10 reviewed highly.

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/panasonic-tx-p50gt50b-p50gt50-201205091797.htm

https://www.avforums.com/review/panasonic-gt50-tx-p50gt50b-50-inch-full-hd-3d-plasma-tv-review.282

review of my GT50 again a very good set.



put it this way my LG is better than the Sony and IMO just as good as my plasma. Yes it doesn't have the black levels but the colours, viewing angles, OS, 4K HDR is stunning.

the only other option i had for a high end 43" was a samsung and it was 50% more than the LG. there was no way I was paying £1200-£1400 for a 43" tv so the LG was the only choice in the premium market when I bought.

It's not let me down. I won't upgrade it til it dies or 8K arrives or 4k OLED is made in 43". the UH770V should be even better I would alsop look at the UH8XXV (fill in X's) too if you can LG seems to have priced their sets very competitively. You get a stunning picture for substantially cheaper than samsung. but samsung is usually the go to these days for 4k LCD's as long as you buy a 7 series or higher you should have zero issues.
 
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I'm a big time audio / visual nerd and I held off on 4K up until Boxing Day, where I picked up the Samsung UE55KS700 (HDR, 10 bit panel, 1000 bits etc).

I never saw the benefit of 4K, even when I demo'd it. I'd of happily paid for it if I could see a reason, i was even an early 3DTV adopter (god what a pointless excersize that was) ... Then I saw an 4K UHD Bluray on a mates Ultra HD Premiem certified set. Sold. Went out and got one.

4K on its own, absolutely. Really don't see the point. A Ultra HD Premium certified TV with a 10bit panel, 1000+ nits etc (low for OLED due to blacks), it's absolutely phenomenal. Even my wife was impressed, I have around 40 UHD Blurays now and The Grand Tour looks fantastic on Amazon.

If you're getting a 4K either hold off... Or up your budget for a proper HDR set. Anything else will just be a disappointment, I really don't think manufacturers should be allowed to advertsize HDR on their sets unless they're either Ultra HD Premium certified or meet the specs for it.
 
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdm99eiCpqE&list=PLBtp_AFLHDXH3wlluTCsCt0Cl-H0Y6jT0&index=5

LG's HDR is compatible with standard HDR and dolby vision. KS7000 is a great tv it's also nearly a 1/3rd more expensive than the LG. What do you get for that extra £200 is arguably a marginally better picture only if the tv is being viewed head on.

is that worth the extra £200 well I would need to see both side by side to know for sure. I cannot base it off reviews alone.
 
eyetrip said:
I would say go for something with a va panel.

The Sony screen is ips and doesnt have great blacks. I have the 55 inch version (my first ips in many years) and its been a struggle to get used to.

Sure, it can still deliver a very pleasing image, but it can be distracting. I only bought mine with the intention of not having it for very long.

Have a look at lg 50uh635v. I had one very briefly and picture was decent. I would have kept it but it had a line of faulty pixels right across the screen.

The smaller 43xd80 is va and a nice screen - I use one for pc and gaming, occasionally streaming. This one will be with me a while.

Otherwise, maybe the Panasonic dx700 series, or Samsung ku6400 series.
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Viewing angles aren't an issue for me, so VA seems potentially better. How do you tell what sort of panel they use? I can find nothing in any spec lists on the shopping sites that give that info.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdm99eiCpqE&list=PLBtp_AFLHDXH3wlluTCsCt0Cl-H0Y6jT0&index=5

LG's HDR is compatible with standard HDR and dolby vision. KS7000 is a great tv it's also nearly a 1/3rd more expensive than the LG. What do you get for that extra £200 is arguably a marginally better picture only if the tv is being viewed head on.

is that worth the extra £200 well I would need to see both side by side to know for sure. I cannot base it off reviews alone.
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Few things on the LG

- Its an 8bit panel plus dithering.
- Peak brightness is around 400-450 nits

What you're getting is a wider colour gamut, far far better contrast (Not just in general but also as the LG is an IPS and not VA). I'd always go VA over IPS, on any television. The Samsung viewing angles are great, then again like most into their home cinema seating position is a consideration not just for TV but for 5.1. Then you're getting over 1000 nits of peak brightness with the KS7000.

It's well worth the extra. Watching top quality HDR content on a KS7000 really brings home how much depth HDR can bring, some scenes on The Grand Tour and UHDs like Life Of Pie are just godsmacking. The picture quality isn't just marginally better, it's substantially better... Which is why most review sites have the KS7000 as their best TV of the year when balancing price and performance. Granted, I got my UE55KS7000 for £850ish during sales.

Compatibility doesn't mean anything for the LG, since it'll be impossible for it to pull off a good HDR picture. It's a bit like hiring a Corgi registered plumber who doesn't own or know how to use tools. Dolby Vision is a way off getting any kind of support, can't even get DV UHDs yet. HDR10 is the open standard and HDR10 plus metadata is likely to be the primary winner due to the same. I do wish DV the best - but being a closed and licensed approach it's going to struggle.
 
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The Sony is IPS in 49" guise, VA in 43", I recently bought a 49" one after being happy with it in store, though haven't moved yet so I haven't got it out the box! I paid considerably less than the price you've linked though, i'd expect to see it cheaper again sooner or later?

(I paid £850 total for the 49" TV and HT-XT3 soundbase, which Richer Sounds are selling for £1000 combined)
 
sprite- said:
Few things on the LG

- Its an 8bit panel plus dithering.
- Peak brightness is around 400-450 nits.

What you're getting is a wider colour gamut, far far better contrast (Not just in general but also as the LG is an IPS and not VA. Then you're getting over 1000 nits of peak brightness with the KS7000.

It's well worth the extra. Watching top quality HDR content on a KS7000 really brings home how much depth HDR can bring, some scenes on The Grand Tour and UHDs like Life Of Pie are just godsmacking. The picture quality isn't just marginally better, it's substantially better... Which is why most review sites have the KS7000 as their best TV of the year when balancing price and performance. Granted, I got my UE55KS7000 for £850ish during sales.
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what i don't understand is why do PC enthusiasts opt for IPS panels over TN and VA and PLS?

and why do tv enthusiasts opt for VA over IPS?

surely if 1 tech was superior then it would be opted for across the board?

https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=85

as you can see many people opting for IPS and specifying they want IPS over others
 
Psycho Sonny said:
what i don't understand is why do PC enthusiasts opt for IPS panels over TN and VA and PLS?

and why do tv enthusiasts opt for VA over IPS?

surely if 1 tech was superior then it would be opted for across the board?

https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=85

as you can see many people opting for IPS and specifying they want IPS over others
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Are the use cases for a monitor and TV the same, therein the answer may lay?
 
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/465-h...4330-determining-display-panel-bit-depth.html

great article on HDR there

"In a Dither

How can an 8-bit panel—or any other 8-bit step in the signal path—reproduce a 10-bit HDR image without banding? There are two main techniques to do this. One is spatial dithering, in which neighboring pixels are assigned color values in such a way that the banding is obscured. But this sometimes results in visible artifacts such as a checkerboard effect or what looks like noise, so it isn't used much in consumer TVs.

The other, more common technique is temporal dithering, often called frame-rate control (FRC). In this process, a pixel rapidly alternates between two colors to give the impression of a third color. Depending on the specific algorithm used, this can work much better than spatial dithering, but it can also result in visible artifacts such as twinkling, especially in dark areas. Still, this process works so well, it's even used in some professional monitors that are widely used in color grading.

In my recent article listing HDR-capable displays, one of the most heated discussions in the comments is about the native bit depth of the panel used in this or that model of TV. Unfortunately, some manufacturers, such as Samsung and Sony, do not officially reveal the bit depth of the panels in their HDR displays, saying that an 8-bit panel with good processing can perform better than a 10-bit panel with poor processing.

That may well be true, but I maintain that an 8-bit panel is an inherent bottleneck in the HDR signal chain, and compensating for it with dithering—even high-quality dithering—is not as desirable as using a 10-bit panel with good processing. Such a TV is generally more expensive to manufacture and purchase, but in my view, it's worth it to get the best possible HDR image."

10 bit is better so long as it's got the processing to back it up

put 2 people in a room and see if anyone could tell a 10 bit panel from an 8 bit panel. It's a test I would like to see done by HDTVtest or avforums
 
sprite- said:
I'm a big time audio / visual nerd and I held off on 4K up until Boxing Day, where I picked up the Samsung UE55KS700 (HDR, 10 bit panel, 1000 bits etc).

I never saw the benefit of 4K, even when I demo'd it. I'd of happily paid for it if I could see a reason, i was even an early 3DTV adopter (god what a pointless excersize that was) ... Then I saw an 4K UHD Bluray on a mates Ultra HD Premiem certified set. Sold. Went out and got one.

4K on its own, absolutely. Really don't see the point. A Ultra HD Premium certified TV with a 10bit panel, 1000+ nits etc (low for OLED due to blacks), it's absolutely phenomenal. Even my wife was impressed, I have around 40 UHD Blurays now and The Grand Tour looks fantastic on Amazon.

If you're getting a 4K either hold off... Or up your budget for a proper HDR set. Anything else will just be a disappointment, I really don't think manufacturers should be allowed to advertsize HDR on their sets unless they're either Ultra HD Premium certified or meet the specs for it.
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Is the LG 49UH770V not proper HDR?

Their blurb:

Super UHD with HDR Plus for stunning contrast levels
With their unique 'HDR Plus' technology, LG have pushed the abilities of 4K UHD resolution to the max. HDR (High Dynamic Range) Plus extends the range of colours for enhanced realism. It also delivers brighter whites and darker blacks, helping to give this TV stunning levels of contrast.

Dolby Vision for dramatic imaging
Dolby Vision optimises the HDR format to give quite simply the sharpest, most accurate images possible. Dolby vision-equipped TVs, like this LG, can decode both generic HDR content and content that's specifically been encoded in Dolby Vision - a leading format in Hollywood and cinemas. Dolby Vision also adjusts the picture to take full advantage of each display's characteristics and presents an optimized picture for each scene in specially mastered content.

SDR to HDR conversion - the best possible picture from Blu-ray
Another unique feature with LG's HDR Plus technology is the ability to convert SHD (Standard Dynamic Range) video to HDR for near-HDR quality from all your standard High Definition sources. This means that Blu-rays and other FHD content has greater realism, more depth and sharper detail than ever.
 
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